When Is It Ok To Give Up?

[OurJud]

The recent pic you posted looks like perhaps 3oz oil stoned hide ( different folks call it different stuff). The biggest issue I see with your original product is hands down the edges everywhere. The stitching looks god, but the edges being rough, glue showing and lack of quality leather is what I see when I view your product.

Thanks, treybecca.

Google doesn't seem to like your wording, as "3oz oil stoned hide" doesn't bring up any relative results. I know the edging is bad, but I can't afford better leather right now. Come mid July, however, I will have funds to buy some proper stuff and maybe even some tools.

[camano ridge]

If you look up Stoned oil leather or Stoned oil cowhide you willl have better luck. Chrome Excell is the original pull up leather. There is also aniline pull up leather, additional oils and waxes are added when the leather is pulled or shaped around an item the leather the color becomes lighter in areas where it is stretched..

[BigGriff]

The Pall wallet you posted is pretty easy. I can see it. Imagine 4 squares - 2 squares on the left and two on the right. Here's the best I can do on this website.

1

23

4

1 & 2 are connect at the top and bottom. 2 & 3 are connected at the side. 3 & 4 are connected bottom and top. Piece 4 also has the snaps you need to close the wallet.

Fold 1 over 2, then 4 over 3, then fold 2 & 3 together. You could definitely make this. Hell, I might give it a go.

[humperdingle]

Ourjud, if you want to contribute a fiver or so toward p&p, I can send you enough natural veg tan to maybe make a couple of minimalist wallets. It'll be a bit thicker at about 3mm, but might help until you can buy more.

It's very light in colour but can easily be darkened with olive oil.

Let me know by PM.

[OurJud]

camano, thanks, that did return better results. I've used a lot of the pull-up stuff, although I'm not sure of it's quality.

BigGriff, thanks for the explanation of the pall wallet's construction. I can see clearly how it was done now. I really love the two-tone effect, but it amazes me how he managed to make such neat holes going through four layers of leather.

When I'm constructing my wallets I feel as though I'm treating them really roughly; pulling and folding and prodding holes so much that when I've finished they look like they've been in use for three years already. But when you look at the pall wallet, it looks like it hasn't even been touched by human hands. How does he do that?

humperdingle, PM sent.

Edited March 28, 2014 by OurJud

[BigGriff]

BigGriff, thanks for the explanation of the pall wallet's construction. I can see clearly how it was done now. I really love the two-tone effect, but it amazes me how he managed to make such neat holes going through four layers of leather.

When I'm constructing my wallets I feel as though I'm treating them really roughly; pulling and folding and prodding holes so much that when I've finished they look like they've been in use for three years already. But when you look at the pall wallet, it looks like it hasn't even been touched by human hands. How does he do that?

Just noticed the two-tone effect. I'm guessing it's two pieces of leather now, or they are really careful when dying. As for the the construction, I could see on the Pall website that they use templates. You could do the same out of a $2 piece of poster board. As for the stitching, it looks machine stitched to me.

[OurJud]

Well either he's lying or he's exceptionally good, as the description on the minimalist wallet site says it's handmade from a single piece. Wouldn't the divide between the two colours be as simple as using a guard of some sort to make a neat line between the two? When I've watched people dying leather they normally use like a sponge thing on a stick. If the sponge is good and square I wouldn't think it would be too difficult to get a neat divide.

Then again I've never dyed leather so I could just be talking through my arse.

Edited March 28, 2014 by OurJud

[BigGriff]

Well either he's lying or he's exceptionally good, as the description on the minimalist wallet site says it's handmade from a single piece. Wouldn't the divide between the two colours be as simple as using a guard of some sort to make a neat line between the two? When I've watched people dying leather they normally use like a sponge thing on a stick. If the sponge is good and square I wouldn't think it would be too difficult to get a neat divide.

Then again I've never dyed leather so I could just be talking through my arse.

Ok, since he says he's definitely using one piece, then he is definitely using some type of guard/cover to make sure it stays where he wants.

You can make this. Easy. Practice on paper products. Take your time on leather. Use the tiger thread you mentioned. Buy one 2-prong stitching chisel. Rubber cement to hold your edges while stitching. Sandpaper for your edges. I would worry about dying until you can make one in natural. Use 2-3 oz veg tan. I know you're in the UK, so I don't know suppliers. Give it a go, and keep us updated.

[WScott]

Good to see members helping out, giving suggestions and even offering materials.

Way to go folks! That is what a good website with a strong community is all about.

Just took a question and some photos.

[OurJud]

Good to see members helping out, giving suggestions and even offering materials.

Way to go folks! That is what a good website with a strong community is all about.

Just took a question and some photos.

Seconded! I'm very flattered

BigGriff, as you say I'm in the UK and leather supplies are... uum, non existent, really. At least in my part of the country.

It looks like I might have to wait until mid-July when I'll have the funds to get myself some of this veg tan ordered from the US.

Just in case it is something I can stretch funds to now, can anyone point me to some sites that offer thin veg tan at a decent price??

[Matt S]

Jud, where are you located? Batchelors does a good line in well priced pre dyed veg tan. It's thicker than you want but they have an 8" splitter in the workshop, and arrangements can be made. Also metropolitan leather lists pre dyed veg shoulder on their site, any colour you want (colours other than Black and dark havana by arrangement) and can be split down as you like (1.5mm is listed). About £75+carriage+VAT for a double shoulder from memory. They also list bridle similarly.

[OurJud]

Jud, where are you located? Batchelors does a good line in well priced pre dyed veg tan. It's thicker than you want but they have an 8" splitter in the workshop, and arrangements can be made. Also metropolitan leather lists pre dyed veg shoulder on their site, any colour you want (colours other than Black and dark havana by arrangement) and can be split down as you like (1.5mm is listed). About £75+carriage+VAT for a double shoulder from memory. They also list bridle similarly.

Hi, Matt.

I'm about 6 miles outside Manchester. I've already done some digging and found a number of UK suppliers (even the nearest is a good couple of hours drive away). Ordering from these people is a problem as they don't seem to want to entertain anyone who's looking for a few small panels or good sized scraps as I am. I emailed one of them and they replied saying that if all I wanted was scraps or small panels, I'd have to go to the store and look through their off-cuts.

Unfortunately I'm not in a position to start buying full cuts. The £75+ price you quote is about £65 more than I'm in a position to spend right now. In fact, even if I had it I'd be reluctant to spend that kind of money on a hobby.

Edited March 28, 2014 by OurJud

[LTC]

life is full of choices and compromises. leatherwork is no different.

[camano ridge]

Ourjud, I went to his site and looked at the full description of the wallet ad construction. THe description expalins pretty clearly. Here is an excerpt:

The Double snap wallet vertical bifold is a leather wallet handcrafted by Atelier Pall in a compact minimal design that that doesn't bulge out of your pocket. It is carefully hand stitched from one layer of premium leather and one exterior layer of thinned Italian oiled pull up leather, containing no adhesives or synthetic padding. The edges are hand polished and burnished with beeswax.

[gary]

OurJud,

If you're passing Knutsford, go into Abbey there. They have always been helpful, don't mind dealing with small orders and may have scraps that they want to get rid of. Just go in and chat them up. They are knowledgeable and will point out what you may need and what they have. It would help if you bought something while you're there as they are a business and not a charity but even a small purchase such as needles would help get you in their good books.

Gary

[mircea]

I'm coming pretty late right now but Just curious what OurJud has done until now...if he can hear us

[barehandcustoms]

Keep in mind that usually a professional looking leather item takes a professional level of knowledge and skill. Atelier Pall was started back in 1950s and has a team of people assembling the items. You have people who sit around for several hours a day mastering their technique through repetition. Not to mention the room full of expensive machines that assist in the process. Also business's like them buy directly from tanneries and have access to a grade of leather product that you may not. I think it is safe to say their family members are not out on the floor assembling items but they probably invested million over the years in time and material to achieve their leather's personality.

Glad to see people working with you to figure things out though. Just keep in mind that you don't create amazing products like that without having a passion for what you are doing.

So when is it okay to give up leather craft? I guess when your heart is no longer in it. A lot of times I am not having fun in the shop but that is where I want to be anyways. Honestly, figuring out new designs can be a major headache and I hate making the same thing over and over again.

Slow down and develop a love for your craft if you want to make professional looking products. I am still constantly learning better ways to do things after multiple years of being out in my shop every week.

Edited July 22, 2014 by barehandcustoms

[papaw]

His last sign in date was April.

[barehandcustoms]

Well crap........

[gary]

Looks like the answer to his question is 'April 2014'.

[ConradPark]

OurJud, what you also have to realize is that a studio like PM uses machinery to aid in their production. The clean look is because they use a clicker die to stamp out the piece in the leather, in this pattern they also stamp out the holes for the stitches - that's why the holes are round instead of the diamond shaped or slit shape you get from a pricking iron or a stitching awl. The handmade part comes in the stitching that I doubt takes no longer than 2 min. The edges are probably finished with something like a big drum sander for shoe making or at least a smaller bench grinder with a burnisher/polishing attachment, probably they also have a edge color machine.

Now this is not meant in a negative way, as everyone here that has a business knows, there is only so much you can do by yourself and to be able to offer and supply to demand this is the way to go. As a hobbyist it's of course not possible to have machines like this and because of that you will sometimes not be able to get the same look either.

I suggest that you try to do projects that feels fun. Avoid trying to copy (you would probably have gotten it cheaper by actually buying the real wallet in the first place).

[papaw]

He hasn't been back on since April 2014