Which Sequence For All Those "wet Work" Like Molding And Stuff?

[Sona]

So I got a problem I´d really like to fix.
As I made several sword sheath (Larp) and similar for customers so far (and will do more in the future), I usually wet mold them around a wooden form before stitching, sometimes I add some tooling and sometimes I treat them with hot water to get the a little stiffer.

My usually sequence for doing this was more or less this one:

- tooling (wet)

- molding (wet)

- stitching

- dyeing

- heat treatment/boiling (wet)

- applying finish and stuff.

So the main problems I got are:

1) When I dye the piece, the colour becomes uneven as some ares are compressed more than others through the process of molding. Maybe it´s usefull to add that I use a sponge for the dye-job, when the colours should be lighter, I wrap some cloth around it so there´ll be less colour per layer)
-> My solution would be to dye it before molding, as it´s easier to apply evenly and the fibres are mor even, too. The reason of doing it afterwards was, that the dye stiffens the leather a little bit, but I think an even colour has a higher priority.

2) The main issue is, that the tooling really looses definition. After tooling I case it two more times (molding and "boiling") so it evens out a bit once and again. Besides for the heat treatment I use water hot at about 75 to max. 90 °C (~167 - 194 Fahrenheit) (I use a boiler and a thermometer, so I never get the same temperature). For the process I boil the water and pour it over the stitched sheath on the form, so even if I use 90°C, the leather wouldn´t reach that temperature completeley and won´t get that brittle.
But with this molding process, the top grain starts to shrink and every cut from the swivelknife opens up a lot while the stamping starts to fade away...

For that problem I got no solution right now and I can´t figure out how to do it right. I think there are some liquids out there used for stiffening leather instead of boiling it, but I don´t know how that will affect the dyejob or the finishing process....
I think it might be an idea to mold the sheath right after tooling to get one casing step out of the line, but then I´d have to case, tool and mold in one step....

Any ideas, tips or solutions to this one?

[scottyslife]

Ion Atkins has a video on making a spider friction sheath in that video he dries the leather in the oven after molding. Take a look at the youtube video maybe it will help.

Scott

[Sona]

Thanks for the answer. Actually I know the video, but I don´t have an oven that´s big enough to put a sheath of 80+ cm in. Thought about that already, but I got some "limitations" on that point XD

[scottyslife]

Hmmm heat gun hair dryer maybe I made a sheath from the video and I did harden nicely with the forced drying, and with that I am out of.ideas lol

Scott

[ConradPark]

In general a lot of leather - specially veg tan, will stiffen a lot more if it was first soaked in almost boiling hot water (until no more air bubbles show) and then dried in slightly accelerated temperature (sunny afternoon, portable heater/radiator in a closet etc.) and will be sufficient hard afterwards. If you're going to do tooling, use thick leather - at least 6-7 ounce but even thicker is better and re wet the surface with a sponge to do the cutting and tooling after the moulding and drying (you have to do this before the casing otherwise the cuts will open up too much when drying) and then let air dry. Then you can use a solution of white glue thats been thinned with water until as thin as water but still white or milky in color and apply this as a lacquer - sometimes a couple of coats are needed. This stiffens up the surface again when dried. You need to do all coloring before this step though. It takes some practise but this is how many tooled leather clogs and water flasks are made.

[Sona]

Thanks a lot Conrad. I´ll try it out as it sounds logical.
I am just a little scared of tooling on the scabbard I think as I don´t have a nice flat surface... but I´ll give it a try.
What about dyeing? as said before I got the feeling that I compress a lot of fibres during the process of molding which leads to an uneven colour.... any experience with that?

[ConradPark]

Hi, I advice to try on something else first. Experiment on scrap leather first! Dip dying in oil dye can work before tooling (but let it dry at least a couple of days) but generally you need to experiment. The issue with uneven coloring seem to be with lighter water based colors mainly, I always either dip dye or airbrush and buy already drum dyed leather so never had that issue. Lacquers are always last on. When tooling on a moulded surface, do it with the mould on to avoid de-figuring the piece but try it on a smaller item first, mould a small phone case or something to try out on first.