Pfaff 138-6 Old but New to Me!

[suzelle]

Hi Folks!

Well, this new (old) Pfaff arrived about 2 weeks ago. She was being used for years in an Industrial Environment. However, just using a light weight thread, about the weight of a household thread, or serger thread. Company I bought her from was using this machine for sewing on patches, mending, that type of thing. I'm adjusting the settings to run v69 weight thread on a daily basis. Have really cranked down the tension disk, as you can see in photo #4.

It's so tight, cranked all the way down (see knurled knob on the right) and photo shows this... tension disk on the right is the one I'm using and it's quite a bit lower than the tension disk on the left. I don't like having to set it so tight. However, it's sewing fine. I've also adjusted the bottom tension to get a pretty even stitch from top and bottom (locks in the middle) and no puckers in the fabric.

My question is, can I do something to make the stitch sew correctly without cranking this poor tension disk all the way down?

The reason I ask is because I'd also like to use v91 weight thread in this machine once in a while, but I have no more room to crank that disk down. Don't want to ruin the machine or the disk.

Also, with the v69 thread, I'm finding it a little difficult to pull a tail of thread out before beginning to sew. It's just tight when I pull and that is never good on your needle.

Hope I have explained myself clearly. Please advise, if you can.

There is another issue with this machine too, but will address that in another post.

Thanks ahead!

Edited May 18, 2016 by suzelle

[Kohlrausch]

Hi,

 

that's what the machine has two tensions for. Use the left one with the stronger spring for the stronger thread.

 

HTH

Greets

Ralf C.

[suzelle]

Really? Lol! Geesh! I read somewhere that the other disk was for a double thread. You know, running a double needle with one bobbin thread. Guess that was not correct information

Here's what I'm getting so far for stitching. Looks okay/ pretty good, but could be better.

Hmmm, will try threading other disk too. Thank you so much!

I am printing an Instruction manual I found on the internet for the Pfaff 138. Will see if there is some fancier threading information in it. So far, I have not found anything in manual about 2nd disk.

[suzelle]

So far, nothing in the instruction book I have on how to thread the two discs. I tried it though, works better than threading one disc. So thank you Kohlrausch. Much appreciated!

Please, anybody else with info (perhaps pictures of how to thread the 2 discs from an Instruction Manual please)... Feel free to post.

Thank you!

[Constabulary]

The older Pfaff 138 had a stamped in "K" for Knopfloch (thats German for Buttonhole) on the left tension unit and originally the 2nd bobbin case that was supplied with the machine also had a stamped in K. You also can use double needles with this machine f.i. for sewing tucks (in German it is called Biesen) - but don´t ask me how this work's I never tried this. When I had a Pfaff 138 I used the 2nd unit for heavier thread as Ralf C. said.

 

[Constabulary]

I have an english 138 manual where the 2 needle sewing thing is mentioned but file its too large to attach. Here is a picture of the "K" marked parts. I only have this tiny picture of the threaded left tension unit - hope this helps

Edited May 18, 2016 by Constabulary

[suzelle]

Constabulary,

Thanks so much! Very helpful information here, photos are very much appreciated! Looks like I have it threaded right, I appreciate the threading picture too. So nice of you! Okay, you confirmed what my thoughts were, that the 2nd tension knob was used for multiple situations.

One funny thing about my machine when I got it is... I was trying to install a round (commercial needle) and couldn't get one in the slot. Then I examined the needle that was in the machine when I bought it home and found it was a flat side or shank, a needle designed for a Home machine. At first I was a little put off by it, because I have a whole bunch of industrial needles I wanted to put to use in all sizes. Thought about it some more and realized that I had a lot of flat shank needles too in all sizes, so what the heck! The advantage is to a standard household needle is I can install that blind-folded. Fits right into the place it's supposed to, no turning while trying to see if I got it positioned right. Love it now!

I think the reason that the Sewing Machine Repair place that Serviced the machine installed the flat side needle holder is that there were two little ladies in their mid 80's (Sisters) who worked for them and ran this machine and another machine just like it. They probably couldn't see too well and it just made the needle changing easier.

Another thing on this machine that is different: One of the bobbins that came with the machine had a section that was cut out of it. Not sure why, but looked like it was altered. Anyhow, no complaints, the bobbin runs fine. Photo attached. Unfortunately, I do not have the original bobbins. My machine has been well used but she runs nicely.

Thank you both Ralf and Constabulary, you are the best!

[Kohlrausch]

14 minutes ago, suzelle said:

 

Another thing on this machine that is different: One of the bobbins that came with the machine had a section that was cut out of it.

Hi,

 

that looks like broken off. Probably fell down and somebody stepped on it. Bobbins and bobbin cases have been unaltered by Pfaff for decades, you can easily find spares. Pfaff also markets a bobbin case for thicker thread. http://www.naehwelt-flach.de/Zubehoer/Pfaff-Zubehoer/Zubehoer-Naehen/Pfaff-creative-Spezialspulenkapsel.html This will probably be the equivalent of the K-marked part that has been lost. I have discussed this with my sewingmachine shop and we have not been able to find out the difference between the "spezial"-case and the standard case. You can always turn up the tension on the setscrew of the spring, so I don't quite see the point. On my Pfaff 130 and 138 I have been sewing up to size 138 thread with size 22 needles, which is where the 15x1-needle system (flat shank) maxes  out anyway. Over it's period of production the Pfaff 138 has been offered with several needle systems, so flat shank does not necessarily indicate an alteration, it may be the way the machine left the factory.

 

Here's some additional info on threading and a link to the manual:

http://www.buzzerco.com/pfaff/

 

HTH

Greets

Ralf C.

 

 

[suzelle]

Ralf,

That link you posted is where I read about how to thread the machine, LOL! I like to follow Brian's blog. He is always playing with some new Thrift Store sewing machine find and posting the information.

Anyhow, great information you had put down about the bobbins, set screws and adjusting. I think that perhaps the reason that Pfaff gave you (2) bobbins adjusted different ways (you say one was for buttonholes) is probably because most people who sew a lot like me, don't want to have to adjust a bobbin set screw each time they change to a different thread thickness or set the machine up for a different task.

I have a couple of commercial buttonholers around and will likely use one of them for the Pfaff 138. We'll see. But I might just pull out my trusty old Kenmore when I have to do those. So easy and very predictable what kind of buttonhole the Kenmore will give me. I like that. Have had that machine since I was 16, bought it brand new. I won't tell what year that was.

For my commercial embroidery machines, I have bobbins set for my standard 40 weight poly embroidery thread, then I have a bobbin set to use a different weight thread on occasion. Just makes it easier for me. I have set my sewing machines up that way too and this Pfaff 138 will get the same treatment. I plan to invest in a couple new bobbins, going to get the Italian ones. When I am running all (3) machines and loading and unloading garments, I don't want to mess with tension problems, I just want to get the job done and delivered to my Customer.

Thank for all your input, so helpful. Have a wonderful day!

Edited May 19, 2016 by suzelle

[suzelle]

Ralf,

On second thought, I will hunt down those bobbins you posted the link too. I'll have to see what the Pfaff Dealers around here would charge for them in the USA.  Hopefully not too crazy. I appreciate this so much, thanks again!

[Kohlrausch]

19 minutes ago, suzelle said:

Ralf,

On second thought, I will hunt down those bobbins you posted the link too. I'll have to see what the Pfaff Dealers around here would charge for them in the USA.  Hopefully not too crazy. I appreciate this so much, thanks again!

Hi,

 

I also just had second thoughts. The K-Bobbincase might have worked the other way round. The idea of the K-tensions was to have a very tight needlethread-tension and a rather loose bobbinthread-tension, so that the bobbinthread would be pulled up. This was supposed to look similar to a handstitched buttonhole. I think it is called petit point stitch in English and Perlstich in German. So the K-bobbincase might have a rather loose thread-tension.

 

The aforementioned "Spezial"-bobbincase on the other hand might just have a wider slot to accommodate thicker threads. I think it's general idea is to have the thicker thread in the bobbin because of the shorter threadpath and the possibility to bypass the eye of the needle. If so you might just as well put a file to a standard bobbincase  ;-)

 

Greets

Ralf C.

Edited May 19, 2016 by Kohlrausch
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[suzelle]

Ralf,

I think you are probably on the right track about the bobbin cases. I have noticed that there are bobbins for the pfaff that have different size slots to accomodate the different widths of zig zag stitches on the machines.

This brings me to another funny little thing to work out on my own machine. Why is my machine a 138-6 (capable of 6mm wide zig zag I think) but the stitch dial only goes to 4? I have a friend who has exact same machine as mine, but his stitch width dial goes to 6. Another puzzler.

Well, I just discovered that the bobbin with the crack or damage sews much much better than the other one. The broken bobbin is an Italian, Cerilini. The other one, a Toya. These both came with my machine. Shortly after I got the machine, I ordered (2) Toya bobbin cases on Ebay, believing they were the High Quality ones, as seller stated. They both were not good bobbin cases. Sent them back. I will pay more for a quality bobbin case for sure.

[suzelle]

Oopsie, I mean TOWA bobbin cases. Didn't work for me.

[suzelle]

Is this what you mean Ralf? I remember my Mother in Law stitches buttonholes like this. So cute!

[Kohlrausch]

4 hours ago, suzelle said:

Ralf,

 

This brings me to another funny little thing to work out on my own machine. Why is my machine a 138-6 (capable of 6mm wide zig zag I think) but the stitch dial only goes to 4? I have a friend who has exact same machine as mine, but his stitch width dial goes to 6. Another puzzler.

Hi,

 

that's easy to explain. Most - by a very large margin - 138 have 4,5 mm zigzag. 4,5 is sufficient for most buttonholes and allows for faster sewing than the wider movement of 6 mm. Very few 138 had 6 mm stitchwidth. These are rather sought after and command higher prices - if buyer and seller notice this detail, that is.

The dash 6 on the typeplate has nothing to do with zigzag. For some time -6 was Pfaff's way to say "basic version".

 

About the buttonholes - sorry, I have no idea what I meant ;-) I have just read the words so often that I memorized them  - like learning irregular verbs.

 

Greets

Ralf C.

[suzelle]

Thanks so much Ralf. I was beginning to wonder if the machines that go all the way to 6mm were kind of rare. Only because I have seen more of the ones Iike I have. Seller said it went to 6mm, but he was mistaken obviously. I noticed it when I went to see machine, but bought it anyways. It was only $250.00,  so I figured that if it didn't do 6mm after I got it home, well it was and is still a good buy.

I broke about 15 needles already. Using a #18 needle, trying to get a big project done. Seems when I hit a lump (Jean fabric and upholstery fabric) that is quite a bit thicker than other areas (multiple layers) it just bends the needle or breaks it right off, depending on how fast I am going. Never in my life have I broken so many needles. So, time to do something about that, I am just not sure what yet. LOL! But I will figure it out.

Thank you for your great knowlege about these machines, all who responded!

[Kohlrausch]

It's like driving a car: Slow down at the bumps. You might even try handwheeling them. (ok, don't try _that_ with the car ;-) There are needleplates with differently sized holes. Usually they have stamped into the underside of the plate. You could look if your plate fits your needlesize. Size 22 is 1.4 mm; you would at least need a needleplate type "B" with 1.8 mm stitchinghole for that.

 

The manual in the link classifies subclass A for needlesizes 10 to 11 und subclass B for needlesizes 12 to 14. It seems your are pushing it a bit, you will probably have to make some adjustments. Nothing wrong with that, upholsterer Cesar Chaflo has put up a couple of tutorials, especially interesting would be tutorial 6:

HTH

Greets

Ralf C.

 

[suzelle]

Ralf,

Thanks for the ideas. Yes, I will try those things out. I was sewing with a size 18 needle, will probably move to 20 or 21. But it may be 20 is the biggest flat needle I'll find. Thanks for all your help! Much appreciated!

[suzelle]

Ralf, 

Reading your messages again.... Lots of good info. Yes, I was wondering if I was pushing it, expecting to use the 18 needles and possible larger.

However, I read so much about how this particular machine could handle the v69 thread so easily, that I was sold on the idea of buying one. My other Pfaff which is a 545 High lift, sews with a v91 thread. I keep it set up that way. It sews mostly vinyl, banner and tarp material, sunbrealla, and leather, and multiple layers of jean fabric.

The v69 thread will be used in the Pfaff 138 mostly for applying patches, sewing curtains, sewing upholstery weight fabrics. I'm thinking it's not going to allow me to get too many layers of the materials under it, from the experimenting I have done so far. I always try to push everything to the limits in both directions at first so I can see what my range is for a machine. Maybe a crazy thing, but I do it. LOL.

[suzelle]

On 5/19/2016 at 0:01 PM, Kohlrausch said:

Hi,

 

that's easy to explain. Most - by a very large margin - 138 have 4,5 mm zigzag. 4,5 is sufficient for most buttonholes and allows for faster sewing than the wider movement of 6 mm. Very few 138 had 6 mm stitchwidth. These are rather sought after and command higher prices - if buyer and seller notice this detail, that is.

The dash 6 on the typeplate has nothing to do with zigzag. For some time -6 was Pfaff's way to say "basic version".

 

About the buttonholes - sorry, I have no idea what I meant ;-) I have just read the words so often that I memorized them  - like learning irregular verbs.

 

Greets

Ralf C.

[suzelle]

Greetings Everyone!

I just wanted to say THANK YOU again to all of you who helped with ideas and advice. My Pfaff 138-6 is running like a champ now, not breaking needles any longer!

These are the things I did to the machine:

1- sanded down the needle hole (zig zag slot) in the plate with a very fine sand paper to prevent thread from snagging on burrs or rough spots

2- cleaned & oiled all the moving parts. 

3- adjusted upper and lower tension to fit thread I'm using: Bonded v69 poly coated

4- Installed $65.00 knee lifter part (not the whole lifter, just the "Pawl" I think it is called (has a silver roller/disk) under the bed of machine.

5- Started with size 18 needle, kept breaking. Moved down to a size 16 needle, working flawlessly now.

6- Replaced the original thread stand that was broken. Cost was under $20.00, shipped.

6- Built /Replaced a very damaged drawer that housed the accessories. Adjusted rail. Added a 2nd layer to drawer to easily access most used supplies.

That's about it. I do want to get a few parts for the machine and will likely add a new motor and a new table. I'd like to give it new paint and new decals to make it look new. I'm pretty pleased that I can start using my v69 thread, as I have collected quite a bit of it over the years. It was too heavy for my Juki TL98 machines, and too light weight to keep in my Pfaff 545, which is set for using v92 thread.

Hopefully this information will help somebody in the future, my reason for posting.

Again, THANK YOU all!!!

[Gregg From Keystone Sewing]

Here's the book for this machine, dug deep out of Keystone's archives, if it was not already posted here;

Pfaff 138 Owners Complete

[Workstead]

Suzelle, et al. I just became to owner of a Pfaff 138-6/21-BS. I purchased this machine and a Singer 600W1 complete with tables, motors and some bobbins. The Singer has a knee lift but the Pfaff doesn't. the total price for both of them was $150 so,even though I only wanted the Pfaff I figured I would also get the Singer and maybe sell it. I have been looking for a walking foot machine but this might do for now.  I rewired the Pfaff with proper wiring and added a light as well. In researching this machine for whatever information I could get (I'm a researcher at heart) I came across a lot of good information but one site (blog) had some information about adding a foot operated reverse pedal. The Pfaff 138 has a feature that allows this. Here is a link to the thread that explains it. Hope it helps someone.
 http://www.ashleyandthenoisemakers.com/blog/2015/3/7/pfaff-138-review-1

 

I plan to add it when I get to sewing on my 138. 

Clem

Edited May 20, 2017 by Workstead
Added my name. Added a photo

[suzelle]

Clem, that's nice! A friend of mine did that on his Pfaff 138. Great job! Looks like you got a steal of a deal on that! Fun fun!