First Saddle Design

[HannahT]

Rktaylor, I'd been wondering about following one set of instructions. I'm glad you mentioned it. I'm thinking about following the Stohlman books as close as I can, though I'm going to need a LOT more clarification on ground seats. I'm looking at the Ray Hunt wades--I like of like the shape that I'm seeing on a lot of them. 

[HannahT]

And BondoBob, I'm really seeing what you mean! If I hadn't started asking questions I'd have a HUGE mess on my hands.

[HannahT]

It looks like I'm going to need several pieces of thinner leather, according to the Stohlman instructions. Would you guys say 2 sides of 10-12 oz and another of 8 or 9 would be my best bet? I don't have a splitter myself.

[cowboycolonel]

You have a skiver. 

 

It might do to have someone job the thinner pieces you think you need.  Most saddle shops will have work order residue (you'd call it scrap) that they could cut/send you.  Better than buying a side in the blind. 

[Big Sioux Saddlery]

Unless you buy your stirrup leathers pre-cut, you'll want a heavy side, either 13/15 from HO, or 12-14 if you buy from Wickett. I think that is their heaviest weight and sometimes I have a hard time finding a side from heavy enough for stirrup leathers, but when I do, I save it for that only and try not to cut anything else from the top 20 inches or so.  Honestly, if you're putting in a flat plate, the stirrup leathers would be the only thing that you'd need that heavy.  You'll line the flat plate so you can use lighter leather, although cut it out of the prime area.  A regular dee ring rigging would be cut from heavier stuff, but most of the other parts just don't need to be that heavy if they're cut from the correct area of the hide.  I normally get a couple sides of 8-10 in whatever color I'm ordering.  I might not use much of it for the saddle itself, but a lot of times, the customer might want bags, or a headstall, and depending on what the saddle will be used for, I might cut the breastcollar from the 8-10. It's great for belts and lots of little incidental parts like hoof pick holders, breast collar dee chapes to install on the saddle, dee ring chapes to put under rosettes, buck rolls, spur straps, and many other miscellaneous items.  If I was going to order just enough leather for one saddle, from Wickett I'd order an 8-10 and two 12-14's.  HO I'd probably order an 11-13, and two 12-14's or one each of 12-14 and 13-15, depending on if you're going to cut your own stirrup leathers. That would be the one part that I'd job out if I had to.  Color matching can be an issue with leather from different shipments, or sometimes even within the same batch, if you choose to job out some of the other stuff. It's really hard to order only as much leather as you'll need.  Be sure to be very specific with your salesperson when ordering.  It sucks to order three sides and for whatever reason not be able to get a seat out of any of them. 

[Squilchuck]

Hannah,  I have made two saddles pretty much on my own using books and videos.  Here are some suggestions from my experience.

·         Find a local mentor to whom you can ask questions and show your work from time to time.  My farrier has been making saddles for 40 years, so each time he comes out for the horses he answers my questions and checks my work. 

·         I first bought the Stohlman books and read the first two volumes well.  The wealth of knowledge, discussion, and detailed instructions are invaluable.  I later made the Harry Adams book one of my go-to sources, in particular for instructions for making patterns.  His instructions are less detailed than Stohlman’s and harder to follow sometimes.  The Jeremiah Watt DVD is great for seeing how he makes saddles and I got many tips on saddle making and other leather work. 

·         For my first saddle, I made Stohlman’s saddle #1 to keep things simple.  There are many ways to do some things, so I tried his method first like a cook book so as not to get too confused.  I scanned the patterns then enlarged and printed them on my computer ( in pieces for assembly if large).  Some things Stohlman does I‘ve found can be done easier, maybe better for me:  didn’t use the rigging skirt or make the rigging jig, found a better way to cut the seat ears, used fewer  tacks and more screws.  Adam’s book of the Watt DVD were my guides. I love Stohlman’s method for cutting leather conchos with a half punch – I can make any size concho I want from the same leather and its cheaper than getting expensive rosette punches. 

·         For my second saddle, I pretty much followed Adam’s procedures, unless I found Stohlman’s ideas easier or better. In particular, I found Stohlman’s way of fitting and cutting the ears on the seat cumbersome and inexact.  I suggest you use the measurement procedures  from Adams or Watt, which are similar.  I made patterns the way Adams describes.

·         I use 11/13 oz. Hermann Oak skirting leather.  Saddle leather that weight will last forever for most riders, is easier to work,  and won’t make as heavy a saddle that’s made from 13/15 oz. leather.  I used thinner HO strap leather for some pieces that require thinner leather, rather than trying to split or skive skirting leather.  I have a nice Heritage bench skiver/splitter to thin strap-width pieces – that skiver/splitter is one of my most valuable tools for leather work.

·         Don’t use cheaper skirting leather like Tandys if possible – you will be investing many hours making the saddle so the extra cost for high-quality leather that stamps, forms, and takes oil/dye well is well worth it.  I used to buy cheap leather when I started and wondered why my stamping, shaping and coloring was inconsistent or crappy.  I only use HO leather for all my projects. I have found Wickett and Craig to be good, too, but a bit less pliable and easy to cut.  The same quality and time issues apply to stamps: I used to economize with Craftool stamps, but now only use Barry King stamps, even though they cost 2-3 time more, for crisp clean imprints. 

·         I used custom trees from Bowdens for both saddles, mainly because they make custom trees from horse measurements using the Dennis Lane template system.  Both trees fit my horses like a glove, and the quality was good.    

·         I’d keep the stamping and carving to a minimum to focus on the saddle making.  Some parts like the skirts and jockey are easy to stamp, but the swells with their curve can be tricky to basket stamp straight. 

·         I found the hardest part was cutting the seat to fit around the swells.  On both saddles I made a mistake and had to buy a third hide to cut out a new seat.  Go slow and be careful not to cut out too much in front of the swells. 

·         The first cantle binding was a regular straight-up binding.  I used the hidden stitch Stohlman describes and it worked well.  I am sure my back stitching would have shown very uneven.  The hidden stitch is easy and looks nice.  I did a Cheyenne roll on the second saddle and had to do the binding over four times before I could get a wrinkle free back.  Make sure you use thin stretchy leather and skive the back.  One big problem was I tried to outsmart the pros and cut a piece that curved like the cantle, which put too much leather in the corners to tuck.  Stohlman’s straighter pattern worked.

Hope this helps.  --John

[Squilchuck]

I just reread your original note.  I did a leather ground seat in the first saddle, then used a strainer plate in the second. Can't say which is better, but I likely will use a strainer in my next saddle.  Good to try both methods.  If you make a Wade then the swell cover should be easier than Stohlman's saddle #1.  Stohlman shows how to cover round swells in volume 3 of his series. I have done both laced and welted swells, and found neither not too difficult using his instructions.  I used standard ring rigging because that is what I am used to, and thought it would be lighter and easier to make.  I am going to put flat-plate rigging in a Wade saddle this winter.  If you will be trail riding, I'd wrap and lace cover your stirrups; the edges of my stirrups with tooled covers sewn on the edges took a beating from brush while trail riding this summer.  The end of my brain dump....  Here are photos of my saddles 1 and 2. Lots to improve on, but on the whole not bad. 

[Big Sioux Saddlery]

19 hours ago, Squilchuck said:

I just reread your original note.  I did a leather ground seat in the first saddle, then used a strainer plate in the second. Can't say which is better, but I likely will use a strainer in my next saddle.  Good to try both methods.  If you make a Wade then the swell cover should be easier than Stohlman's saddle #1.  Stohlman shows how to cover round swells in volume 3 of his series. I have done both laced and welted swells, and found neither not too difficult using his instructions.  I used standard ring rigging because that is what I am used to, and thought it would be lighter and easier to make.  I am going to put flat-plate rigging in a Wade saddle this winter.  If you will be trail riding, I'd wrap and lace cover your stirrups; the edges of my stirrups with tooled covers sewn on the edges took a beating from brush while trail riding this summer.  The end of my brain dump....  Here are photos of my saddles 1 and 2. Lots to improve on, but on the whole not bad. 

Very nice job on a first and second saddle! This is exactly what I meant when I said I'm amazed at some of the first work shown on this forum that is produced using the educational material that is available today.  And excellent advice from someone that has recently been through the early learning process.

[Ken Nelson]

Lewis trees have the strainer  fiberglassed in them and are really easy to get a good ground seat on.  Good Trees.  I have been using them for 8 years and never have had one come back.

Edited October 30, 2016 by Ken Nelson
mistake

[Squilchuck]

Thanks, Big Sioux.  I forgot to mention that this forum also is a great resource for learning and troubleshooting!  --John