441 441 presser foot timing

[ZigZag]

I have a Typical 441, which is much like the other clones available. Since I’ve had it the inner and outer presser feet have never quite been in sync so I made some adjustments as detailed in the attached pdf. Page 8, which worked a treat, but then something elsewhere seems to have been thrown out of time as the inner foot has now got a limp and is hardly lifting at all.

i decided to go through Uwe’s video tutorial for timing everything, all of which went well and I have fine tuned hook, needle height etc. Thanks Uwe for your downloadable balance wheel degree rotation diagram, works brilliantly.

I’m quite happy working with machinery, but can’t figure this one out. I’d be grateful for any advice.

thanks

Nick

TSC-441 Adjustments.pdf

Edited April 1, 2018 by ZigZag
Spelt Uwe’s name wrong. Dooohhhh.

[ZigZag]

Here’s a quick video of what it looks like.

Nick

063053D7-F34F-46D2-B944-69B33F430B75.MOV

[Uwe]

Section (9) 2.  of that manual describes how to adjust alternating presser foot walking height. It looks like a straightforward adjustment. 

Make sure you view that PDF manual as two-page spreads to make sense of it. In single page view the adjustment rule and adjustment procedure appear out of sequence. 

This is the part that shows how to adjust relative walking foot height to get rid of the "limp."

[ZigZag]

Thanks Uwe, will try this in the morning and see how I get on. Could be I didn’t follow instructions carefully enough. 

Thanks

Nick

[ZigZag]

Mmmm, tried again with this today and the adjustment we’re talking about isn’t the issue. I had it timed perfectly yesterday, but at one point it did feel like it tightened up and then it sounded like a shaft slipped in its retaining collar somewhere.

i have looked at another manual and think it may be what is described on page 6, No 19 referring to illustration 16.

Fingers crossed

TY_manual_TW3-441_en_01.pdf

[ZigZag]

It wasn’t to do with the adjustment mentioned above. Now looking at the feed cam as possible problem.

I’ve attached a couple of pics of where the feed cam is currently positioned. There are 2 manufacturer marks, which I think line up with the set screws. Does this look right?

Thanks

Nick

[ZigZag]

I’ve tried a different setting from a manual for the cam but I’m pretty sure it’s in the correct position, which leaves me none the wiser. Something has definitely gone out of whack.

I guess at least I’m getting to learn more about the machine.

Any clues?

[ZigZag]

I have sat staring at the 441 for a little too long now, but it appears the timing between the needle bar and the inner presser foot and the offending item. When the needle bar is coming down the inner presser foot is going up. No matter how I adjust the driving shaft arm, it’s  is always out of sync. Something elsewhere has come out of alignment. So frustrating as yesterday it was bang on the money.

the tightness that lead to it shifting out of whack looks like it came from the driving shaft arm needing to be pushed in firmly home. When I changed it yesterday it was only a half mm out but enough to create some unhappiness.

[CowboyBob]

To adjust the foot timing adjust the cam on the top shaft behind the slotted adjuster.You have to loosen the 2-screws(leave one snug so it doesn't spin) rotate until it's feeding correctly with the inside foot coming down & touch the leather as the needle goes in it.

[Uwe]

It's quite unlikely that the foot driving eccentric cam slips out of position. It's much more likely that the driving arm clamps on either end of the foot driving shaft slip out of position. 

Perhaps the clamp on the other end of the driving shaft was not quite tight. If either end slips, the walking foot motion will go out of synch. 

I'd try rotating the hand wheel to bring the needle tip to be level with the throat plate, then loosen either driving shaft arm clamp to bring both feet down to also be level with the throat plate. Then tighten clamping screws on BOTH ends of the driving shaft well. 

The concept of the walking foot mechanism for many machines is nearly identical. The main difference is that on some machines the slotted arm for adjusting walking height points up, and on other machines that arm points down.The foot driving eccentric will be offset 180˚ depending on which way that arm points.

Normally the foot driving eccentric cam is at one extreme (e.g. all the way out) when the needle is at the very bottom (BDC) and at the other extreme (e.g. all the way in) when the needle is at the very top (TDC.) That's easy to verify visually.

I recently made a video of that walking foot concept on a Pfaff where the slotted arm points down. I have a strong feeling the 441 is exactly the opposite because the arm points up. I don't have access to a 441 right now to verify.

Here's the Pfaff walking foot adjustment video, just for reference:

 

Edited April 2, 2018 by Uwe

[ZigZag]

Thank you both Bob & Uwe for you advice, I’m back to work tomorrow so will have to wait to put your thoughts into practice. Much appreciated. 

Hold tight, response coming soon.

Nick

[ZigZag]

Hurrah! Success.

Uwe & Cowboy Bob, thank you so much for sharing your knowledge and experience.

Uwe, your video was a huge help and you were right, the bolt on the inside end of the bar wasn’t very tight. Also your visual guide of the arm being fully in or out at tdc/tbc was perfect for figuring it out. I did loosen the collar with the cam as it was slightly out. But so easy to get right with you help.

All back together and working better than ever.

The sewing machine doctor does it again.

Nick