Tutorial or tips for wrap around panel on IWB a la Sparks Versa Max?

[PJ234]

I'm attempting to make a Versamax-esque IWB rig, and I'm a bit stumped as to how to go about constructing it. Specifically the wrap around panel with the semi detached front loop 'wing'. Does anyone have a tutorial, link to a video, or perhaps just some advice as to how to approach this?  

 

Thanks in advance for any help!

[Joon1911]

Adams Leather Works has an excellent video that shows the entire process.  Very well done.  You do have to buy a subscription to watch but I think it’s worth the investment. 

[JLSleather]

Basically the SAME as a "pancake" holster.  Just cut out the leading edge and sew the "butt joint" together, then wrap a piece for "stiffener" (some folks add a strip of steel reinforcing between teh layers).  Loops can be attached any number of ways, I think t-nuts between leather layers and a screw through the snap is most usual (and some like a leather or rubber "washer" behind the straps to shim the loops out a bit).

   http://www.jlsleather.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/IWBa-1.pdf

 

[PJ234]

Thanks much for the replies!  I have made a few holsters so know the general process overall, but not how and when to attach the stiffening piece.  If it were a standard pancake, I'd just mark the stitch lines, glue it up, then stitch, etc  I just can't seem to wrap my head around how and when to do the additional parts  

JLS, can you explain what you meant by 'sew the butt joint together '?  Do you glue any parts together prior to stitching on the stiffening piece?

Thanks again, and sorry if I'm being dense. 

[JLSleather]

12 hours ago, PJ234 said:

 If it were a standard pancake, I'd just mark the stitch lines, glue it up, then stitch, etc  

There ya go -- this is just as simple. 

WHILE ATTEMPTING TO ANSWER THIS, I DID CHECK WHY-THE-HECK-TUBE AND FOUND BASICALLY NOTHING BUT STANDARD MARKETING CRAP.  SINCE I HAVE LITTLE TO NO PATIENCE FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE INFO FREELY HANDED TO THEM, THEN CHARGE THE NEXT GUY FOR THAT SAME INFO, I WILL BE DOING THIS STEP-BY-STEP SOON, FREE OF CHARGE.  I personally find it incomprehensible that with 10,000 members, nobody can provide this very simple information.

Cut the front seam as shown in my pdf and the picture above - cut it out or use an oblong punch to remove that piece.  (NOTE:  you might leave a little extra material ABOVE THE SNAPS, depending on teh size of snap/connector you're using.  I don't like to see less than 3/8" of leather, just personal preference- plan for your own hardware.)

Once you have the shape you want, and the "hole" removed, mark your glue lines on it the same way you did before.  Install your t-nut if you want it between the leather layers.  Glue the front end and stick.  So far, this is EXACTLY what you did when you made your "pancake" version.

Then "open up" the holster on the table so the grain side is up on both pieces (like turning a book over so you dont lose your page).  Be careful not to wrinkle the grain side of the holster.

This will result in a "shark fin" sticking up, two layers thick, where it's glued.  But the part with the material removed will lay flat and "come together" in a butt joint.  Some folks sew this butt joint shut, but not necessary.  You can use seam tape to hold it temporarily, but also NOT necessary.  Take your "stiffener" piece (which may include sweat guard since it's IWB) , glue in place, and sew.  Once the reinforcement piece is glued down and sewn to the back and front of the holster, the butt joint is locked in place.  

Close the holster normally and glue the trailing end (you may need to dampen the reinforcement piece). Sew teh back as with your pancake version.

I'm late for something already, but I'll get this in pics later.  

[JLSleather]

Okay ... in a rough sense.... just to maybe answer your question without making one of these right now ....

You have your "pancake" pattern ...

BEFORE cutting out parts, decide what type of connection you'll use for the loops (you could just sew them, if you don't mind threading the belt through them to take on and off - but that's not done very often).  Let's assume you're using snaps - line 24 snap is about 5/8" diameter, and I like to see a good 3/8" outside the snap (I don't mind 5/8", but NOT less than 1/4").  So, make sure you have 1" of material above where the slots are on your pattern to allow for the snap and the 3/8" [NOTE: you could just lower the loop, but that will change the angle of your holster]

Now decide if you want to go with the same shape front panel - entirely optional either way.  For this discussion, I'm leaving it the way it shows - and we'll need to alter it a bit to let it wrap around.  This is done AT THE STITCH LINE (incidentally, this is the point of those 50/50 rigs).  We want it to wrap around, and since I'm using a sweat shield on the holster, I want to include that in teh wrap around, to stiffen the sweat guard.  The finished shape will depend on the cutout, and for this one let's cut out to below the belt line.

Mark parallel line about 3/8" from stitch line, and another at least 1/4" under the belt line.

 

and cut out this area in front of the front stitch line. Easiest way, punch a round hole for the bottom of the slot and cut up the sides.

 

 

 

 

[JLSleather]

Here the slot has been removed (but not the stitch line), and I have replaced the belt SLOTS with belt LOOPS.  Also added line 24 snaps where they would fall if you let the pistol ride at the same height and angle we had before.  You can see, this does not leave enough room above the snap to assemble the holster.  You could drop the loops lower, long as you understand that will raise the rig and make the pistol ride higher. 

 

 

 

 

Instead, let's adjust the pattern so that we have the same height and angle.  I want 3/8" ABOVE the snaps, so I if you have one of those 12" tandy squares, you can just lay it on the top belt line, and mark the other edge of the square, giving you a parallel line 1" above the belt, which is about what we want here.  Pencil in the change to your contour pattern, keeping in mind proper space to properly grip the weapon.  

[KingsCountyLeather]

@JLSleather As we say in Ireland... Fair play to ya! 

[JLSleather]

 

 

You may have noticed that with this particular pattern, if you go UP that 1" from the belt line in the leading edge, that would put you in the cutout area.  To 'fix' this, we'll move the entire front wing out 3/8" - the distance of the slot width - and then come up to our new line.

This gives your base IWB pattern (I didn't cover the loops here, but that will get included in the pdf version)

 

And of course, these changes would need to be made also in teh back panel.  This shows the 'theory' of it, but in actual practice, it's much faster and easier to glue the pieces, then cut out both front and back together - eliminate tedious lining up edges.

 

 

[JLSleather]

For illustration, I added the stitch line to the back panel, and twisted the parts around so the leading stitch line is vertical.  Once you have the idea down, no reason to do this consistently.  

This is done to show the idea behind making your reinforcement "wrap around" panel (what, you thought I forgot what we started out to cover?@!). 

 

The front 'wings" will get glued together up to the front stitch line, leaving the rest separated. If you glue these sections, you end up with something looking like the back portions of front and back panels, with that "shark fin' sticking up in the middle.  Something like this ... (note I put the bottom belt line back in for now) 

[JLSleather]

 

 

Adding a horizontal line where the belt line crosses the center line ... and penciling in the contour of the sweat guard is just copying teh back panel sweat guard at this point.  Make this line higher if you prefer, depending on how much you want to reinforce.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 Sketch a contour to the line from some point on teh sweat shield, as you see fit...

 

 

 

 

And round the bottom portion of the panel into the wrap around section.  Keep in mind this is the THEORY, and your actual panel will likely need to be about 1/4" wider than this. Easiest way to get your pattern is put the front and back together, then wrap a piece of leather around the assembly, mark, and trim (make a paper pattern from that before stitching it on).

 

[JLSleather]

 

 

Leaving you with front panel, back panel, and wrap.  It should be easy to see how the panel spans the front and back through the 'slot'.

Edited May 4, 2018 by JLSleather

[PJ234]

Aha...now it makes sense!  JLS, I can't tell you how much I appreciate you going to all this effort to create drawings to go along with the instructions!

 Thank you again kind sir!

[alpha2]

I have to say, I KNOW Jeff likely has better things to do with his time, and yet he continues to put this kind of time and effort into helping others to "visualize" how to do things that are second nature to him, but a TOTAL mystery to the rest of us.

He's a resource. Use him, but don't abuse him.

Jeff

(not that Jeff)

[JLSleather]

That actually HELPED somebody?@!  Well, okay - cool!  

Sew the leading edges together ahead of teh front stitch line.  

Where the pieces come together at the top of the front stitch seam, some folks sew the butt joint first before adding the reinf panel.  Scuff the area where the panel will go, apply glue, stick and sew the panel to both front and back panels.

Close back end of holster, sew back stitch lines as "usual".

Honestly, I tried to 'get away' on this one with a quick, down 'n' dirty pdf on the site.  Now that it's been brought to the front here, I'll get some time to actually DO one with pics -- likely be more helpful.

[JLSleather]

17 minutes ago, alpha2 said:

I have to say, I KNOW Jeff likely has better things to do with his time,

Well, thanks - but that may sound a bit more noble than it really is.  COULD be that some guy bashed his leg so bad he needed knee surgery... and now gets to spend part of the day SITTING and part of the day IN THE GYM firming up a knee.   I mean, just guessin' here ... and if some think he aint chargin' enough, probably just write it off to disorientation due to blood loss.  But I wouden know.

OH, I think Boss Lindsey is going to be selling these for a few bucks here 'n' there as he gets the chance to upload 'em.  Look this kid up if'n ya need somethin' like that.

Edited May 4, 2018 by JLSleather

[JD62]

This community owes  a huge thanks!! And get well quick Jeff!

[JLSleather]

HEY ... WHO'S the dummy now?@! (hint:  it's me).  Found this post, right on this site, from a few years ago.  The wrap reinforcement is done a bit different, but he's got some pics that would have made my entire conversation.. you know.. basically useless.

 

[KingsCountyLeather]

Yeah...  would have saved you a lot of time. 

Full marks for your effort though! 

[PJ234]

Thanks for the other link JLS!  Something about your approach speaks to me for whatever reason, but maybe I"ll try that one next time to see the differences. 

I'm part way through with your method and finding this to be an interesting new challenge.  I'm almost ready to stitch on the reinforcement panel, but my new-to-me sewing machine is giving me fits, so I'll either have to hand stitch it or wait until I get the machine going again.

 

 

[JLSleather]

HEY .. shark fin!  Can you put a bit of curve in the pieces, and still be able to sew on the reinforcement?  Takes the wrinkle out (except in the shark).

[PJ234]

Do you mean next time don't open it all the way flat?  Yes, I could still sew the reinforcement if it was curved...guess I just did it that way not knowing any better (although I did wet it well before opening to try to reduce or eliminate wrinkles.)

[JLSleather]

3 minutes ago, PJ234 said:

Do you mean next time don't open it all the way flat?  Yes, I could still sew the reinforcement if it was curved

Yessir, that is what I mean.  Wet it to open is a good plan, too.  What holster was ya makin'?  I'll send ya a chunk o leather I think you might like -- we'll chock it up to makin' up fer my half-advice

Long as I said that, I should add that in SOME cases, it helps to sew down one side so it hold still while ya mark other end! 

[PJ234]

Ok, thanks for the additional advice. That's extremely generous of you to offer to send some leather, but not at all necessary...I have more than you could shake a stick at already!

This is for a government model 1911. This one is a test/prototype/learning experience full of mistakes and missteps, many of them related to trying to stitch it on my new-to-me malfunctioning sewing machine.  Too many new operations attempted (first wrap around reinforcement, first exotic overlay, first time using sewing machine) on a single project, but I'm blundering ahead regardless ;-)

 

 

[JLSleather]

Right up my alley -- text/prototype/mistakes are my SPECIATY

What model machine?  LOTS of folks around her kin help with that!