Need help making a holster

[wes]

Hello,

I am in the process of creating my first molded shoulder holster.

I have purchased a double shoulder, vegetable tanned hide from Siegel of California. It is 5-6 oz. and about .078 thick. Received it yesterday.

This holster is for a Beretta 951 which is a medium frame semi-auto pistol.

I will need help and advice on molding or boning this holster so that it has fine detail of this pistol. As far as I know this molding is the very first thing that I need to do in the process of creating this holster.

Is this correct or do I need to start with something else?

Hopefully the holster will look like the image below.

[Johanna]

I'm a little worried that the 5/6 oz weight isn't going to be heavy enough. Have you drawn your pattern? How much experience do you have doing this kind of thing? (I don't want anyone to leave steps out if this is very new to you) There are several ways to protect the gun while you wet form. Do you plan to handstitch? Do you have all your hardware yet? How are you fixed for tools? I can point you in the general direction, but there are a lot of more experienced makers than me here, and I hope they chime in.

Johanna

ps Welcome to Leatherworker.net!

[wes]

Johanna

Please do consider that anything that I say is totally wrapped in ignorance for I have absolutely no experience with leather work.

The reason that I chose 5-6 oz hide is that I am going to have to mold this holster by hand without the aid of presses. From all of the information that I have been able to glean from the custom holster makers sites, they use 3/4 or 4/5 weight hide for high definition molded holsters. To compensate for lack of stiffness I plan to install a tensioner screw and a thumb snap release. I have plenty of leather with which to fail. The double shoulder is quite large!

I have not drawn my pattern as yet because I do not know how much to allow for the leather stretching during molding. I figured that I would form the outline shape of the two halves of the holster after I have molded it to the pistol. If I need to create a pattern before beginning, I am afraid that I would be at a total loss.

I have considered using my pistol to which to mold my leather, but was worried about rust and corrosion. I have access to a manufacturing company which will make an aluminum form to the dimensions of my pistol. If there is a method in which I can use my pistol and still protect it while wet forming the leather, I am very willing to do so, as this will save me quite a bit of money that would be spent in the creation of the aluminum mold.

I have absolutely no tools. I hope that this is a good thing, as I can purchase only what I need, whenever I need. The cost of the tools is no concern, unless I have to buy some sort of machine. That would probably give me pause.

I will hand stitch this holster. I have an old upholstery sewing machine given to me by my mother, but I am concerned that I would let it get away from me and botch a job that I could have done by hand.

I have no hardware yet for this holster and plan to purchase it as it is required in the progress of this project. I know what it is that I want, but have not located all of the hardware yet.

Thanks for the quick response to my post on this forum. I am glad to see that this forum is not dead as so many specialty forums are on the 'net.

[Johanna]

Okay, Wes, you really are starting from scratch. Two good things- you are not intimidated by this project, and second, you have no "bad habits" to unlearn. The book that Greg mentioned in the other post is an excellent resource, "How to make Holsters" by Al Stohlman.

If you were going into business I would say to make the aluminum form, but for one gun, it's not necessary. This is what I have seen others do: unload the gun. No, I'm not trying to be funny, you wouldn't believe how many times I've asked someone to unload the gun when they brought it in, and they said it was already, and it wasn't. Double and triple check. LOL Use Vaseline to protect the metal, and wrap it in Saran wrap, fastening with masking tape to make it snug. Visit your local newspaper and ask for a discarded "end roll" so you have some big paper to experiment with patterns on. (A butcher shop might be able to help, too.) When working with leather, you want to measure twice, cut once, or you'll wind up with (relatively expensive)scrap. You will want to put a straight edge on that hide to cut your strap before you begin (double shoulders are tricky to get the desired length for straps sometimes) and then you can lay your paper pattern this way and that so you miss any blemishes in the leather, and use your hide efficiently. Cut your pattern pieces a little big- you can always trim them later. Wet the leather and use your fingers to push the leather into the desired shape. (See why I want the gun unloaded?) It may need to dry overnight, and you may decide to do it again the next day to get just the shape you want. Some people use little "beanbags" filled with shot to encourage the leather to hold its shape, but you can also use other household objects, as long as you are careful not to mark the wet leather (like a C clamp would mar the surface of wet leather). When you are satisfied with the shape, it's time to punch the holes and sew. Al Stohlman wrote a book on handsewing that covers how to do the two needle lockstitch, which will not unravel if one stitch should break. I would probably use a stitching groover to recess the stitches slightly. When it is sewn, trim your edges and burnish them with denim or scrap leather until they look like one piece, and you can best do that after you've done your dye work, before you use a sealer on the leather. You're going to need: a decent metal yardstick (straight edge), a gang punch or thonging chisel (same thing) or an awl to make the holes, needles and thread (use the blunt harness needles for this job) dye, sealant, hardware, a hole punch. (Do not waste your money on a rotary hole punch- it will limit how far into the work you can go with future projects) and a mallet.

I'm going to ask a couple of the experts to look at this thread, because there are always several ways to skin a cat, no pun intended. This is an ambitious first project, but it's not out of reach, especially with the good advice from the pros. Is there a Tandy dealer anywhere in your area? It would be a good idea to look over the holster book before you get started, and they have the basic tools you will need. I'm going to PM some folks, so stay tuned.

Johanna

[Jim]

Hmmm, sounds like a job for Superman!! K.W. Allen has a good deal of experience with this sort of thing, not to mention is a superb holster Maker, especially for automatics. I'd get a hold of him on this.

Jim

[Lindsay John Ross]

Hi Wes

In the factory world we use a 20 ton hydraulic press which is lined in the inside with layers of special hard rubber about 5" thick. The holster is dipped in water with some dishwasher similar liquid to allow more even penetration and then allowed to dry until the moisture is basically inside but starting to dry on the outside. The pressure is raised to 20 tons and then released. The hoslter with the aluminium replica ( which is used as the dummy) is removed and then re-wet with a sponge on the outside. We use stainless steel moulders ( they are in the shape of a bullet really) to hand mould the now impressed impressions into the leather. Basically just to enhance the moulded look.

In a situation outside the speed production a factory would need I would follow the same steps but use the gun itself and of course just press it and mould by hand. If the holster is unlined one can get a pretty deep impression by hand moulding but if its lined ( suede or smooth lining) you are going to have to put some energy into it. Just wipe the gun off when finished and reoil. If you get the leather with just the right amount of moisture as stated above there is no reason to worry about the moisture on the gun and can easily be removed with adry cloth.

I could go on forever with this but Im sure you get the drift. A good book with some info at the back on doing this by "hand" instead of using hydraulic presses and aluminium moulds is "Bue Steel and Gunleather" by John Bianchi written when he was still in the driving seat @ Bianchi Gunleather.

Dont know if this helps.

Lindsay

[wes]

I am headed to town today and will stop by Tandy's and pick up the Stohlman book on holsters and on hand stitching. I live in the Rocky Mountains at an elevation of 9500 ft and do not get to town very often. This gives me an excuse to visit civilization. I had seen the holster book offered on the 'net but the front cover illustrated the Western revolver type of belt and holster, so I discounted it of any value. This book may re-establish the value of "You can't judge a book by its cover".

Johanna, after your post last night, I could not sleep for thinking of the method in which I could protect my pistol and I am thrilled that my thinking ran parallel with your suggestion of Saran wrap and electrical tape. And your suggestion of Vaseline ads enough extra to give me confidence in using my pistol without reducing it to a hunk of rust. So, I will definitely use my pistol as the mold.

I have also dreamed up a way in which to define the contours and edges of my pistol to a very fine definition and detail. Your mention of bruising the leather during molding introduces a variable which I had not considered. What, exactly, is this bruising? Is it the closing of pores of the leather? Creating a "skinned" or torn blemish?

Lindsay, I was composing this reply before you posted. You explanation is extremely enlightening and gives me quite a bit of food for thought. Let me consider the method that you have mentioned and I will see what resources I have which might duplicate some of those methods.

Right now I am off to town to get some books.

Edited August 27, 2006 by wes

[wes]

Well, Tandy's Leather locations were closed on Sundays. I tried two locations in Denver. Both closed. That was surprising! I figured that any company devoted to supplying hobbyists would be open weekends when those hobbyists would be off work and out buying supplies for their hobbies.

So I, after doing other shopping (purchased a new 27" LCD TV) I came home and ordered two books from eLeather Supply online. The books are being shipped express mail. I ordered The Art of Hand Sewing Leather by Stohlman and How to make Holsters Book by Stohlman. Hope that these two books are the correct ones.

Lindsay, until my books arrive and I can educate myself, please give me your opinion of a method of molding which I have been considering.

1. two hardwood boards such as bird's eye maple, rosewood, or ebony wood.

2. cut out a cutout the exact shape of the pistol, but is 5/64" bigger all around to allow for the thickness of the leather.

3. coat pistol with Vaseline, wrap with Saran wrap, wrap with electrical tape (as suggested by Johanna).

4. sandwich the pistol between two pieces of soaked leather.

5. sandwich the leather (with pistol between) between the two hardwood boards with silhouette cutout of pistol.

6. define the contours of the pistol by pressing premade pieces of wood into the trigger guard, along ridges, etc.

If the above is nonsense, do not hesitate to state so.

[Tom Katzke]

I had a really good reply almost done and my mouse slipped and it is gone. One thing I do not like about this forum, that replies can get dumped so easy.

I will never be able to recreate it so I will say yes you got the correct books.

You need to study on casing leather. Too much water and you are in trouble and too little you will never get the depth you need in the stretch.

You do not need to use hard wood. I have done forms like you are referring to in soft pine and even plywood. One thing to consider is to ease the inside edge unless you want the hard line that will show. Make sure that the bottom of the form is flat and has no bumps or holes as they will show in the leather.

I would not make pieces to use inside the form. Just get or make some ball modelers to use to work in the detail you want.

Just to make sure you know steel and wet leather do not like each other. I am not talking about your gun because you will protect it or not leave it in contact with the leather long enough to have a problem. Steel if left in contact with wet leather will turn it black. Fillings are the biggest problem, so keep the wet leather out of any area you will be working on metal. You should be able to remove the gun after forming the holster. Once the leather is stretched it will keep its shape while it dries unless you mess around and mush it.

If I remember anything else that got lost I will post again.

If you have any other questions just ask and someone will answer.

Tom Katzke

Central Oregon

[wes]

I have ordered Blue Steel and Gunleather by Bianchi, as recommended by Lindsay. I ordered this book through Abebooks.com. It should arrive 3 to 6 days.

You need to study on casing leather. Too much water and you are in trouble and too little you will never get the depth you need in the stretch.

Tom, I am very thankful that you mentioned this. My inclination would have been to let the leather soak indefinitely, thinking that if a little water is good, a lot of water has to be just wonderful. Glad you gave a caution!