108w20 Stopped in my tracks.

[iron1951]

I have been working on getting my 108w20 into sewing mode before I try some sort of restore. I was working on the timing and I broke a needle (no confidence it was the correct needle anyways). So I bought some Schmetz 135x1 needles. Now turning the hand wheel slowly I still have interference between the needle and the hook. So as you (and I now) probably have figured out is that the hook  is wrong. The hook that I am looking for is 247789 and the hook that is in the machine is 244086. I can't seem to find a 247789 on the net. Any ideas? Has anyone had any experience in modifying the hook? Its not the point that is giving me the problem, but the "ramp" that follows the hook.

[Wizcrafts]

I don't know about parts, but here is a link to a downloadable manual. They may or may not have the hook and other components for this aged machine. If not, try Bob Kovar.

[Constabulary]

W/O knowing all the parts number but you probably have to move the hook and hook shaft bushing a bit.

This is my 108W20 I also have a link to a manual in the 1st post.

I replaced the hook with a non Singer hook (NOS hook but from a German Mfg - works very well) and I also had to move the bushing a bit.

Hope it helps.

Edited October 12, 2019 by Constabulary

[iron1951]

The hook that is giving me a hard time, the one that came with the machine, is #244086. After the point of the hook passes the needle as the needle is rising, that is when the needle hits the rest of the hook assembly. It actually bends the needle quite a bit. I would say the needle bar is adjusted correctly because the point of the hook reaches the needle just above the needle eye. The hook does not touch the needle. about a 10 thou clearance. Does anyone know what machine hook 244086 would fit. Just curious.

Wiz, thanks, I already have that parts manual. If I read the manual correctly, I should have hook 247789

Constabulary, do you know the part number of the Singer hook you replaced?

Thanks

[Constabulary]

Now I know what you mean - issue could be the needle. Some have longer tips than others. I wanted to switch to 135x17 needles but it was not possible because they have longer needle tips and they are scratching the hook BADLY. So I had to stick with 135x1. I have different 135x1 needles and they slightly differ in the tip length. You can try to raise the the needle bar a tiny bit or grind down the hook body a bit (in worst case).

Most 135x1 needles I have are 36mm long +/- a little bit but just the one in size NM 120 I´m using the most is approx 1mm longer. So I raised the NB a tiny bit and now it works. Hook is still catching the thread loop w/o skipping stitches.

I still have the hook... let me check...

EDIT:

The OEM Singer hook base has the number 244014. Not sure what the number of the complete hook is. Can post a picture later today.

 

EDIT II:

see pictures. Needle are all from differen Mfg´s (Schmetz, Solidor, SNF, Singer) SNF actually is Singer too.

 

Edited October 13, 2019 by Constabulary

[iron1951]

Here are some pics. The third pic says it all. See the needle bending as the hook rotates.

 

[iron1951]

Just after the hook (yellow arrow) that is where the needle is being "pushed".

Is it possible that my timing is off?? I line the hook up above the top of the eye as the needle just begins to rise. My needle bar does not have any marks. As the needle rises, it moves towards the back of the machine and that is when the needle hits where the yellow arrow points. As I continue to rotate the hand wheel, the needle continues to be directed towards the left. The hook assembly is pushing on the side of the needle. The needle is not bending towards me but bending towards the left.

[iron1951]

Constabulary, my needle is 36.16 mm long, shank to tip. Nice pics btw. Do you have a camera stand? I tried using my magnifier (244086 pic). Okay for really small stuff.

[Constabulary]

When your are sure the timing is right (see manual) then only the needle is left. Try what I did - maybe it helps. BTW - my NB does not have the timing marks either.

just checked my OEM hook again - I have not noticed the # on the bushing - its the same as yours - see picture:

 

EDIT:

No camera stand, camera is a Canon SX-1 IS It has a super macro setting - old camera but works well (even shows how dirty my fingers are )

Edited October 13, 2019 by Constabulary

[iron1951]

Here are some more pics of my hook. Maybe my timing if off? As the needle starts to rise the point of the hook is above the eye.

BUT this is unison feed, so as I continue to rotate the hand wheel, the needle bar moves rearward, the needle interferes with the

hook assembly before it has a chance to rise out of the way.

 

(see pics).  

[iron1951]

Figured it out!! My hook timing was off. I was timing the hook as the needle descended, at it lowest point. What I did not do was wait until the needle plate carrier frame (208549) moved to the rear and the needle just started to ascend. When the hook is set just above the eye of the needle here (needle plate carrier frame at rear), there is no interference. There is even room to lower the needle bar which I had to do. So it looks like I do not need a new hook. Thank you all for your help and letting me talk this out with you.