Sewing Machine Questions

[JustWakinUp]

Hey everyone,

I'm wondering when it comes to sewing leather what the best method would be. I have a brothers sewing machine that I would like to run into the ground. I wanted to put it to the task to see what it could and couldn't sew. I've found some folks around here that have 120/20 needles so my question is this.

What size thread is the "general" sewing thread? Is it 12?

I want to get a few needles and thread and begin playing, Please pass along some suggestions

[Art]

Hi _____, (your name here)

The "normal" thread size for the hole the 120 needle makes is 69 or 92 and even 138 with a tight wound poly. Now the question will be how the Brother will like that big thread. Size 69 should definately be doable and I have run Coats 138 through a Singer 201 without any complaints. However, remember that the 40s-50s era Singers were made to be general purpose household machines that would end up sewing everything from lingerie to drapery, jeans, towels, and canvas. That's why you occasionally see old 66's and 201s sewing light leather. Today's machines are much tighter and less capable of sewing heavy materials due to plastic parts and multiple stitch control. You'll have to judge where your brother falls in the scheme of things.

Art

Hey everyone,

I'm wondering when it comes to sewing leather what the best method would be. I have a brothers sewing machine that I would like to run into the ground. I wanted to put it to the task to see what it could and couldn't sew. I've found some folks around here that have 120/20 needles so my question is this.

What size thread is the "general" sewing thread? Is it 12?

I want to get a few needles and thread and begin playing, Please pass along some suggestions

[Regis]

Are you aware of "any" home style portable sewing maching that is fairly reliable for the occasional sewing of 4-5 oz (total) of leather? Perhaps a walking foot one like pfaff?

Using suitable leather needle.

Thanks,

Regis

[esantoro]

Are you aware of "any" home style portable sewing maching that is fairly reliable for the occasional sewing of 4-5 oz (total) of leather? Perhaps a walking foot one like pfaff?

Using suitable leather needle.

Thanks,

Regis

I've been wanting to as a similar question. What is the best portable walking foot homestyle machine? I've been reading up on the Pfaff 130. Are there others?

Ed

[Art]

Hi Regis,

Given those constraints, the Sailrite LS-1 Ultrafeed at about $550 is the best bet. For an extra $250 you can get the LSZ-1 which has a zigzag capability also. These machines are on-the-go machines and spend a lot of time in canvas and upholstery trucks. Sailright's other machines are based on the Singer 111 (you probably can't name a company that hasn't knocked that one off) which is not quite portable.

Art

Are you aware of "any" home style portable sewing maching that is fairly reliable for the occasional sewing of 4-5 oz (total) of leather? Perhaps a walking foot one like pfaff?

Using suitable leather needle.

Thanks,

Regis

[Luke Hatley]

Are you aware of "any" home style portable sewing maching that is fairly reliable for the occasional sewing of 4-5 oz (total) of leather? Perhaps a walking foot one like pfaff?

Using suitable leather needle.

Thanks,

Regis

Regis, there are a lot of old SINGER SEWING MACHINE around that will sew leather

if you are in a larger city to find them.

you can check E-Bay out for Machines. Hopefully you get an Honest seller.

THE BEST OLD SEWING MACHINE TO GET WILL BE A SINGER 31-15.

THEY ARE GREAT AND WILL SEW #69 & 138 THREAD.

[Regis]

Thanks. I do have an Artisan 3000 that isn't convenient for some of the light work. And I have a cheap singer portable with walking foot attached that technically works but, skips, coughs, chokes, and won't last. So, I'm looking to buy something I can pick up, put in the trunk. and take when I visit family and want to do some items there. Tabletop use is important.

Thanks again,

Regis

[Art]

Hi again Regis,

The Singer 31 was a tailor's machine and is a great machine, however no walking foot. You should be able to get a 31, or a 201 (no walking foot either) with a bazillion accessories and feet (that is the way they were sold as a general purpost machine that would do most anything around the house) for no more than $150, that would be in very, very good condition, top condition. On eBay there are a few guys who ghost bid these things up and I have seen them go for $600 or even more, so be careful. With the 201s they have direct drive motors, so burning one up will cause a little bit of a headache, not that bad though. The model 66 was around at this time also and can do light leather work. If you are getting into the $500+ range for a machine it should be a good solid Pfaff 545 or the like or a new Sailrite if you want a portable.

Art

Regis, there are a lot of old SINGER SEWING MACHINE around that will sew leather

if you are in a larger city to find them.

you can check E-Bay out for Machines. Hopefully you get an Honest seller.

THE BEST OLD SEWING MACHINE TO GET WILL BE A SINGER 31-15.

THEY ARE GREAT AND WILL SEW #69 & 138 THREAD.

[Art]

Hi Regis,

The 15 will be a good choice too.

The Singer 31-15, 7-33, 111-150 thru 155 and the Consew 99R(-3) (zigzag) were standard equipment in Navy survival equipment shops (parachutes and harnesses etc). There was also the 211 which was a newer version of the 111. You could have all of those machines in perfect order for under the cost of a new big stitcher and sew darned near anything (including sheet metal with the 7-33 if you had to). Air Force used some of the same stuff but tended toward newer models. This is circa late 60's, I don't know what they use today.

Art

[JustWakinUp]

ANy links to retailers for these threads?

[esantoro]

Are you aware of "any" home style portable sewing maching that is fairly reliable for the occasional sewing of 4-5 oz (total) of leather? Perhaps a walking foot one like pfaff?

Using suitable leather needle.

Thanks,

Regis

I would like to add the most heavy-duty portable tabletop to my little studio set up (already have a Baby Bull and Juki 441 clone).

What about this Kenmore:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...:MEWA:IT&ih=014

And this Pfaff

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...:MEWA:IT&ih=013

Ed

[Art]

You can get Lynhanl nylon at Artisan:

http://www.artisansew.com

Coats poly in smaller sizes and putups at SFS (ask for Dan Bussey) 1-800-526-3892

Sailrite will have a ton of 92 in white

http://www.sailrite.com

There's a zillion others.

Please try to copy the message you are questioning so we will know who should answer whatever.

Art

ANy links to retailers for these threads?

[Art]

Hi Ed,

The Kenmore looks a lot like a Singer 15. The Pfaff is a gem (well that model anyway). He wants more than I would pay for either. If you can find a Singer 15-91 or so or a 31 cheaper, I would go that way.

Art

I would like to add the most heavy-duty portable tabletop to my little studio set up (already have a Baby Bull and Juki 441 clone).

What about this Kenmore:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...:MEWA:IT&ih=014

And this Pfaff

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...:MEWA:IT&ih=013

Ed

[esantoro]

Hi again Regis,

The Singer 31 was a tailor's machine and is a great machine, however no walking foot. You should be able to get a 31, or a 201 (no walking foot either) with a bazillion accessories and feet (that is the way they were sold as a general purpost machine that would do most anything around the house) for no more than $150, that would be in very, very good condition, top condition. On eBay there are a few guys who ghost bid these things up and I have seen them go for $600 or even more, so be careful. With the 201s they have direct drive motors, so burning one up will cause a little bit of a headache, not that bad though. The model 66 was around at this time also and can do light leather work. If you are getting into the $500+ range for a machine it should be a good solid Pfaff 545 or the like or a new Sailrite if you want a portable.

Art

Hi Art,

I just finished looking at the Sailrite webpage. Do you happen to know of anyone who makes a similar portable machine. It seems like the portable Sailrite is exactly what I'm looking for, though a bit pricey.

Thanks,

Ed

[LAPat]

If you are a little patient you can find most any old metal gear home machine on Craigslist for way less than Ebay and see it in person before you get it home.

I have sewn on a Singer 301, 404, and 500 and they can handle probably up to 4 oz garment leather. I also have an old Kenmore, and the thing about the Kemores is that mine -- and probably most machines from the sixties and seventies if not more -- has a bigger clearance under the foot, so you can get thicker material sewn.

I would be tempted to look for a Pfaff 130 after having fallen in love with my new old 545. but I likewise think that Singer is a sure thing. My Kenmore is a metal gear machine but it doesn't have the heart of the Singers.

Now I have an old Bonis at Melanie Machine in L.A. to see if they can fix it up for me so that I can sew fur. Talk about a place that will make you want every machine on the floor. And these machines are clean and the floor is well organized and it's probably the nicest machine shop I've been in. Which is an aside, with a thank you to Art for recommending them. It may be the beginning of a beautiful friendship.

L.A. Pat

[Art]

Hi Ed,

Sailrite is expensive but they sell hardware to DIY guys not to pros although a lot of pros use the LS machines as portables, however they do customize that machine heavily and you would pay the same to by the base machine and put the custom parts on it; the base machine is a Brother I think. On the bigger machines you can save money buying elsewhere. Like I've said before, the Singer 15, 31, 66, and 201 don't have walking foot, but the Navy used the 31s heavily for years, ship and shore.

Art

Hi Art,

I just finished looking at the Sailrite webpage. Do you happen to know of anyone who makes a similar portable machine. It seems like the portable Sailrite is exactly what I'm looking for, though a bit pricey.

Thanks,

Ed

[esantoro]

Hi Ed,

Sailrite is expensive but they sell hardware to DIY guys not to pros although a lot of pros use the LS machines as portables, however they do customize that machine heavily and you would pay the same to by the base machine and put the custom parts on it; the base machine is a Brother I think. On the bigger machines you can save money buying elsewhere. Like I've said before, the Singer 15, 31, 66, and 201 don't have walking foot, but the Navy used the 31s heavily for years, ship and shore.

Art

Art,

My grandfather was a tailor/dress maker. I think he gave my sister, who tried her hand at designing for a while and now teaches design, one of these Singer 15s. This is a pretty heavy machine.

So far I really like the Pfaff 130. Portable, heavy duty, nearly .5" presser foot lift (no walking foot???). Do you know if the Pfaff 130 will take 138 poly. I'd like to get a portable machine with the capabilities of the 130 but that will sew 69 to 138 thread.

As always, thanks for your help and expertise.

Ed

P.S. I've taken the advice in this thread and have been looking on Craigslist for a portable machine (New York area). CL has some great deals.

[esantoro]

Thanks. I do have an Artisan 3000 that isn't convenient for some of the light work. And I have a cheap singer portable with walking foot attached that technically works but, skips, coughs, chokes, and won't last. So, I'm looking to buy something I can pick up, put in the trunk. and take when I visit family and want to do some items there. Tabletop use is important.

Thanks again,

Regis

I was really attracted to the Sailrite and came across this Consew 206R:

http://cgi.ebay.com/CONSEW-CP206R-Walking-...1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/CONSEW-CP206R-PORTABLE...1QQcmdZViewItem

Ed

[Art]

Hi Ed,

The 15 came in different flavors from 15-1 to 15-120 or so, some had a full rotating hook and most had finger type bobbins. Some had drop feed and some didn't, some had reverse and some didn't.

The Pfaff 130 has standard foot, no needle feed, but is zigzag. I have only seen one with a 110 needle and a 120 is bare minimum for 138 poly (130 for 138 nylon). I can't tell you for sure so I guess maybe?

I know most of us are part timers in leatherwork, but even there a sewing machine is a lifetime investment. It's nice to get a great machine at a great price, but pros buy their primary machines new and keep their eyes open for good cheap used equipment for their second and third machines. My portable weighs 170# (just the head) so, if I though I really needed a portable, I would go out and buy the LSZ because I know that is the last portable I will have to buy (if it doesn't go overboard in 100ft of water). The first machine I bought (I researched a few different ones), I spent a LOT of time on before I bought, I really wanted to get the right one, and I was still looking at Sheridan, I went to Campbell, Luberto, Weaver, Ferdco, Artisan, and a few clone folks with no name and I still couldn't make up my mind. Prices, features, quality, service, all confusing. I'm dragging the wife to all these vendors and for two or three days on and off she watched me. Finally at the 11th hour she who must be obeyed grabs me and hauls me over to Jerry at Artisan and says what is the best big machine you have, and he starts realing off a speil about the 4000P, she interrupts him and says two words, "best price", at that point in time he could have said $6000 and it wouldn't have mattered, she said, "write him a check, you now have a sewing machine". I asked her why Artisan, and she said, "They were the closest to the front door". If she had let me go, I probably would still be looking. She of course was right, for a straight stitcher, the only real important thing is to have one, buy the best you can afford and you will have it forever and if you need to sell, you can probably get what you paid for it.

My recomendation is to buy the LS if you can afford it, or save-up till you can. If you are going on the road, you need something light that can do the job. If you are looking for a new toy, then the used market is great, but wait till something crys out to you "take me or they will throw me away", and be absolutely ready to walk away if the price isn't right.

My way more than 2 cents, sorry.

Art

Art,

My grandfather was a tailor/dress maker. I think he gave my sister, who tried her hand at designing for a while and now teaches design, one of these Singer 15s. This is a pretty heavy machine.

So far I really like the Pfaff 130. Portable, heavy duty, nearly .5" presser foot lift (no walking foot???). Do you know if the Pfaff 130 will take 138 poly. I'd like to get a portable machine with the capabilities of the 130 but that will sew 69 to 138 thread.

As always, thanks for your help and expertise.

Ed

P.S. I've taken the advice in this thread and have been looking on Craigslist for a portable machine (New York area). CL has some great deals.

[esantoro]

Art,

Your cents are their weight in gold and platinum. I hate to fawn, but I am in your debt (and many others here) who have offered such great advice.

My set up:

Jukki 441 Clone

Baby Bull/Mach 1

I love both of these machines. The 441 is reserved for all the leather stitching because of its compound feed mechanism. The Baby Bull is reserved for all the lighter stuff, which is a bit too industrial for.

I may be having to move in the next six months, and I was thinking of selling the Baby Bull and getting a portable, which could do the work I'm asking the Baby Bull to do and save a lot of space.

I may just go with the Sailrite. I need to call them and ask what the presser foot lift is on it. I'd love to have .5" if possible. The used CP206r is .25". I think a new one is .5" but am not sure.

Ed

Hi Ed,

The 15 came in different flavors from 15-1 to 15-120 or so, some had a full rotating hook and most had finger type bobbins. Some had drop feed and some didn't, some had reverse and some didn't.

The Pfaff 130 has standard foot, no needle feed, but is zigzag. I have only seen one with a 110 needle and a 120 is bare minimum for 138 poly (130 for 138 nylon). I can't tell you for sure so I guess maybe?

I know most of us are part timers in leatherwork, but even there a sewing machine is a lifetime investment. It's nice to get a great machine at a great price, but pros buy their primary machines new and keep their eyes open for good cheap used equipment for their second and third machines. My portable weighs 170# (just the head) so, if I though I really needed a portable, I would go out and buy the LSZ because I know that is the last portable I will have to buy (if it doesn't go overboard in 100ft of water). The first machine I bought (I researched a few different ones), I spent a LOT of time on before I bought, I really wanted to get the right one, and I was still looking at Sheridan, I went to Campbell, Luberto, Weaver, Ferdco, Artisan, and a few clone folks with no name and I still couldn't make up my mind. Prices, features, quality, service, all confusing. I'm dragging the wife to all these vendors and for two or three days on and off she watched me. Finally at the 11th hour she who must be obeyed grabs me and hauls me over to Jerry at Artisan and says what is the best big machine you have, and he starts realing off a speil about the 4000P, she interrupts him and says two words, "best price", at that point in time he could have said $6000 and it wouldn't have mattered, she said, "write him a check, you now have a sewing machine". I asked her why Artisan, and she said, "They were the closest to the front door". If she had let me go, I probably would still be looking. She of course was right, for a straight stitcher, the only real important thing is to have one, buy the best you can afford and you will have it forever and if you need to sell, you can probably get what you paid for it.

My recomendation is to buy the LS if you can afford it, or save-up till you can. If you are going on the road, you need something light that can do the job. If you are looking for a new toy, then the used market is great, but wait till something crys out to you "take me or they will throw me away", and be absolutely ready to walk away if the price isn't right.

My way more than 2 cents, sorry.

Art

[Regis]

Art,

Well said and thanks for the help. That's about how I bought my 3000. Searched and searched, procrastinated, and then just bought the best I could. You convinced me to save my pennies for the LSZ. In the mean time, I'll take my brother up on the offer of a "like-new" 15-91 for 20 bucks shipping.

Thanks,

Regis

[Art]

Hi Ed,

The Sailrite is not going to want to sew half inch stuff too often. The 441 will sew 32oz all day every day. The Sailrite is a light duty chap machine, it ain't the Baby Bull and the motor is much smaller than the 1/2 horse that most shop machines have. Get the biggest flywheel (might be extra cost) to get more power. There is a Sailrite store in Ft. Lauderdale if you are close, I would take some leather over and see how it performs.

Art

Art,

Your cents are their weight in gold and platinum. I hate to fawn, but I am in your debt (and many others here) who have offered such great advice.

My set up:

Jukki 441 Clone

Baby Bull/Mach 1

I love both of these machines. The 441 is reserved for all the leather stitching because of its compound feed mechanism. The Baby Bull is reserved for all the lighter stuff, which is a bit too industrial for.

I may be having to move in the next six months, and I was thinking of selling the Baby Bull and getting a portable, which could do the work I'm asking the Baby Bull to do and save a lot of space.

I may just go with the Sailrite. I need to call them and ask what the presser foot lift is on it. I'd love to have .5" if possible. The used CP206r is .25". I think a new one is .5" but am not sure.

Ed

[sheathmaker]

Hey Art, I read your posts with great interest, particularly about the Artisan aquisition. You obviously know WAY more about sewing machines and various models than I do, but I do know how to run them and make a little money. That brings me up to the Artisan story. I had a well used Pfaff (I don't even remember the model) and I was limping along making chaps and chinks. I went to the Boot and Saddle Maker's Round Up in Brownwood, Texas one year (it's a very mini version of Sheridan). I met Jerry Zonis and came home with the Artisan 797AB and the following year at the same venue I bought the Artisan Toro 4000 with the fancy table. I've lost track of how many times those two machines have paid for themselves and they have been absolutely trouble free. Regardless of how you finally made your choice decision to get Artisan, I believe you made the very BEST choice. Jerry's new Toro 3000 costs about half what we paid for the 4000 and it is even a slightly improved machine. It has less throat depth which I don't use all of any way and has the newer servo motor. Other than that it's the same as the 4000. I use the 797AB with 69 and up to 138 for stuff up to 3/8" and all the fine tune stuff and the 4000 with 207, 277, and 346 for the tougher stuff up to nearly 7/8". I have been totally satisfied with both machines and I don't think I'll be around when they do wear out.

Paul