BrianHochstrat

I glue my fillers into the seat fold it over the edge of the cantle, I cut 3 pies out of the cantle back one at center and one on both sides about a 1/3 of the way down from center and loop stitch the cuts back together, shape and dry it. Once it is dry, glue your filler in, also it only needs to be about a 10 oz. thickness and have it pretty wet, pull it over the edge and stick it down to the cantle back. Get it worked down some and skive it down to where it is contoured in the seat and has a square fold over the edge. Let it dry and then sand all the skive marks out with a rubber disc sander.

I don't do any thing special to get that crisp fold other than work it square-ish with my hammer and rub stick, after the seat is glued in place and folded over, work that edge when the leather is about the same temper as when you tool it and it will hold its shape better. And yes the cantle binder is stitched at a pretty good angle, it can be difficult to keep your stitching nice when the thread is pulling some from the side so I run a creaser line along my holes to help that thread lay in the right spot. Brian

I will be down in Missouri May 4-8. The class is going to be pretty cool, we limit the class to 5 students, so there will be plenty of one on one tutoring. And Ray Cover has a really nice classroom. I am looking forward to it. You should try to make it over. -Brian

Thanks for all the positive replies. The hole in the catcher for the string is actually one of the owners idiosincricies, if I did not punch a nice clean hole he would widdle a hole in it with his pocket knife once he recieved it. Yes there is a light amount of highlighter just enough to make the carving liven up, but not so much it looks like fake leather. Brian

Here is one I finished last week. It is for a collector down in the Bay area Ca. I have been focusing on my engraving work more than saddles for the past year or so, but this individual has been a big supporter since early in my career. He keeps a saddle on order at all times and every year or two I will build it, typically I wait until he starts getting anxious then put him into the line up. They are all pretty much the same, except small changes, like going with a cheyenne roll, or different gullet measurements ect. but always a full flower Wade. Anyway, here are the pics let me know what you think. Thanks -Brian [

Elton, One thing I notice on the carving that could be different, is at the stem split you backgrounded over to border, but left the rest of backgrounded untooled around the design. IMHO the design needs to be backgrounded all the way around to the borders or the area at the split should have been left unbackgrounded like the rest of the areas along the border. Also a couple stems could have been run over to the corners by the buckle to fill in that space and balance the design. Try to keep your background area sizes consistent, and the design will keep a balanced look. Please keep in mind I am saying to be helpful, not to criticize. Over all they are very nice chinks and I am sure your customer will be thrilled with them. -Brian

It is not riveted clear through, even though it appears that way in the picture. Had he went all the way through there would be no need for the blevins buckles or even the tail on the stirrup leather, being it would have no length adjustment at all, and could you imagine the irritation of trying the pean the rivets with the stirrup leathers on the saddle. And yes the rigging is at least 3 inches lower than it really should be, IMHO. Brian

Jon, I have never built on a Hamley formfitter but I did build a Bull Moose one time which is similar. It was a pain to cover the swell. There is so much under cut I had to leave the stitching on my welt really loose and then tighten it up like shoe laces once I slid it on the fork. I took the pic of the one I built off of my website so nobody would get any ideas and order one But that is just me, give it a go and at least you can say you did one. Good luck-Brian

Well, you have a starting point to work from. A couple of things I notice right off is the fenders are not turned. You want to wet them and turn them, let them dry, before you oil them. Also, I really do not like the breastcollar rings coming out from under the fork cover, you can mount them under you latigo catcher or have them come out from under the seat. Also, it appears you horn wrap is backward for a right handed roper, wrap your horns clockwise so the wrap will tighten when dallied on, not come unwrapped. Also, there should be an ear on your seat under the cheyenne roll for the concho to be placed look at Jon's saddle or jump on my website and you will see what I am talking about. You are on the right track though, keep building them.

The real impressive part, is all these pieces are done on speculation. These guys invest months of time and their money to build this stuff and there is no garantee it will sell. The outer appearance seems like these guys are building some nice stuff but getting big dollars for doing it. But, when you look into it, it is not all it seems, it is a big commitment with a lot of cost, effort and time. I have really looked into this, they are not an elitist group as I have seen them accused of in the past, its just not everyone has the ability to make the commitments the TCAA requires.

This is a cool forum, I learned something no one ever told when I was an apprentice and after 15 years of building saddles I never noticed. That is to line up your buttons, simple, easy to do, but as you can see this saddle does not have them lined up. Judging by the PM's it seems I am the only one that did not know about this, luckily it was brought to my attention and that will not happen again. After being told about this, out of curiosity I went back through some of the saddles on my website to see how far off the buttons were, and it is a crap shoot, some line up, some don't. Thanks guys for coming out and saying the truth about what you see, atta boys are fine, but real critique is what helps us improve and makes these forums valuable. Thanks-Brian

Jon, You have a ton of hours sitting right there, nice job. I really like how you let the leaves splash over the border, little details like that keep people looking. I look forward to seeing the next one.

You have already received some good advice, but here is how I go about it, after I have fitted the seat I flatten it and let it dry overnight, I rewet the whole thing( not saturated, just some color) and cut my design, and then just rewet the areas as I tool. However, once the area is tooled I try not to get it wet again, even when I block the seat in I only dampen it in the areas I have to, in the blank areas I can go ahead and saturate it. This will help protect the crispness of the carving. Hopefully that all makes sense. -Brian

Thanks for the good reviews. I do not have any close up shots of the saddle, I mostly just get a side shot for my website and call it good, if I did something out of the ordinary I will take a shot of it, but this saddle was basicly patterned after one I built a few years ago. The braid on the twist is a long knot like on a bridle rein turnback, but I just braid the foundation of the knot, so it has a over one under one sequence. -Brian

Here is one I just finished. Its a 16 1/2 wade with a 5 inch cantle. I was pretty happy with my lines on this one, anyone who builds square skirt saddles know it is challenging to get everything running parallel and line up as it should. Normally I would have run the skirt out the back a bit more, but the customer rides smaller type horses so we decided to keep it as short as we could.

You sound alot like me Mulefoot, every time I have to raise my price I hold my breath and wait for the worst. The reality is we probably don't charge enough. Also I too have found that most educated recreational rider do not mind shelling out a bit more to make themselves and Ole'Brownie more confortable on their weekly trail ride. I have done a few talks with riding clubs about the importance of saddle fit and things and one thing I stress is that in all the expense of being a horse owner,pickups,trailers,shoeing,ect. a quality saddle is a small investment, and it will directly effect the pleasure of riding. As a collective we do need to try to get more articles in the horsey magazines about the importance of fit, and that quality costs initually, but saves in the long term, so to displace the notion a saddle should only cost $2000 As for the balance of the welfare of the horse and staying in business, you have to put the comfort of the horse and rider first. Staying in business will follow. It only takes a few back biting saddles to ruin your reputation, at least on the local level, but even on the national level word will get around. So, build the best product you can, with the best materials avaliable and set your prices to where you can make the money you need, if you cannot make a go of it, you may have to do some rethinking about you business venture. Just my outlook on things-Brian

I have ordered the elk from Siegal, and I think Sheridan leather has it as well. Cut your strips a bit wider than normal since it will strech and narrow up when you wrap the horn, I usually go about 3", you will also have to cut around a few bullet holes -Brian

Thanks for the warm welcome. The horn wrap on that saddle is elk hide, its a happy medium between mule hide and rubber. Rubber has never been well excepted in any branding trap I have been in, but I really dislike using mule hide. You can stop the same cattle that would cause blue smoke and a scorched rope on mule hide, with only a couple turns on the elk. Anyway, thanks everyone for checking out my website. I am working on a pretty cool saddle right now, full flower square skirt, should be done at the end of the month I will post some pics when it is done.-Brian

I just stumbled onto this forum yesterday, quite a cool deal. I am a custom saddle maker and engraver here in Midvale Id. There are plenty of engraving forums, and I participate when time allows, but I have always thought it would be cool if there was a saddle forum, well I guess there is and I am just slow on the take-up. All through my career the saddle business has been very secretive, shops just did not divulge information, even when I worked for other shops they taught you just enough for you to get your work done, its nice to see a place where there is a free exchange of information happening. Besides custom saddles as I said, I also engrave, I do my own saddle silver and tinker with bits and spurs as a hobby, My other serious work other than saddles is high end art knives, which makes a nice balance, you can only pound on leather for so long. Brian