Nail Carving?

[bruce johnson]

     I am going to politely disagree with a few posts here. There is no stamping on this piece. It was not made from nails made into stamps. It was drawn on with a blunt tip tool. Blow up the picture sizes and that is pretty obvious. This piece you referred to has been antiqued or had HiLiter used to get the darkened effects in the tickled lines. In the older era, it could have been drawn on with a lightly heated tool to burnish the design (not hot enough to scorch) or just drawn on damp leather and over time the lines filled with dirt and grime to pop the design. 

I would really like to get some background on the term "nail carving". I am wondering how historic that term is and am reaching out to some reproduction customers for info. I would bet the previous couple inquiries I have had regarding "nail carving" may have all come from this one page or whoever makes these holsters. I just don't have a lot of holster references to backtrack through. There is a book called "Packing Iron" that shows a lot of holsters but mine is out on loan. My mind is trying to draw a parallel with the accepted term of "finger carving" - free handed designs using just a swivel knife and no stamps. 

[chuck123wapati]

1 hour ago, bruce johnson said:

     I am going to politely disagree with a few posts here. There is no stamping on this piece. It was not made from nails made into stamps. It was drawn on with a blunt tip tool. Blow up the picture sizes and that is pretty obvious. This piece you referred to has been antiqued or had HiLiter used to get the darkened effects in the tickled lines. In the older era, it could have been drawn on with a lightly heated tool to burnish the design (not hot enough to scorch) or just drawn on damp leather and over time the lines filled with dirt and grime to pop the design. 

I would really like to get some background on the term "nail carving". I am wondering how historic that term is and am reaching out to some reproduction customers for info. I would bet the previous couple inquiries I have had regarding "nail carving" may have all come from this one page or whoever makes these holsters. I just don't have a lot of holster references to backtrack through. There is a book called "Packing Iron" that shows a lot of holsters but mine is out on loan. My mind is trying to draw a parallel with the accepted term of "finger carving" - free handed designs using just a swivel knife and no stamps. 

In that instance its used as a buzzword just to sell a holster. Period. you are right it wasn't stamped with nails, but its a copy of one that may have been.

 I've heard the term used in folk art, basically it came from people using whatever metal they could scrounge to create tools for their project nails being the most common, Scrimshaw for example is nail art, so is some metal engraving. the old tin lanterns punched with nails and made from cans is another.  i have a great piece of nail art, my dad after ww2 was a rough neck, he made a graver out of a nail to tool his aluminum hardhat with all his travels, pictures and such. Leather work was no different holsters, saddles and about any leather was ornamented at some point by people with the very basic of skills and tools. Its all under the heading of folk art.  You want to see it go to a museum only the best examples go in books. I've seen a ton of it in museums, i love that book but its only a few holsters out of hundreds of thousands so limited in its knowledge base.

[CharleyS]

3 hours ago, bruce johnson said:

     I am going to politely disagree with a few posts here. There is no stamping on this piece. It was not made from nails made into stamps. It was drawn on with a blunt tip tool. Blow up the picture sizes and that is pretty obvious. This piece you referred to has been antiqued or had HiLiter used to get the darkened effects in the tickled lines. In the older era, it could have been drawn on with a lightly heated tool to burnish the design (not hot enough to scorch) or just drawn on damp leather and over time the lines filled with dirt and grime to pop the design. 

I would really like to get some background on the term "nail carving". I am wondering how historic that term is and am reaching out to some reproduction customers for info. I would bet the previous couple inquiries I have had regarding "nail carving" may have all come from this one page or whoever makes these holsters. I just don't have a lot of holster references to backtrack through. There is a book called "Packing Iron" that shows a lot of holsters but mine is out on loan. My mind is trying to draw a parallel with the accepted term of "finger carving" - free handed designs using just a swivel knife and no stamps. 

There is a picture of the original holster that shows a carving, not stamped, that they reproduced.  The one I referenced is obviously a copy, but the reason I asked was mostly about the term of using nails to carve leather. As I said if it’s truly from the correct period and "nails" were used they would have been square nails which did not have sharp points.  I’m interested in the folk art side as references by Chuck123wapiti.  The only decorative work I’ve done on leather was to press and burnish the leather leaving a somewhat embossed design. It’s crude work but I was only 10 at the time.  But thinking back on it now I like the idea of using what is at hand to do these kinds of work, and a square nail has some appeal to me. Im thinking the original design was not really carved in the traditional sense, but deeply scratched in and burnished to deepen it.

I too have a copy of "Packing Iron" that I need to get back from a friend and go through it again.  Thanks for your thoughts. 

[chuck123wapati]

14 minutes ago, CharleyS said:

There is a picture of the original holster that shows a carving, not stamped, that they reproduced.  The one I referenced is obviously a copy, but the reason I asked was mostly about the term of using nails to carve leather. As I said if it’s truly from the correct period and "nails" were used they would have been square nails which did not have sharp points.  I’m interested in the folk art side as references by Chuck123wapiti.  The only decorative work I’ve done on leather was to press and burnish the leather leaving a somewhat embossed design. It’s crude work but I was only 10 at the time.  But thinking back on it now I like the idea of using what is at hand to do these kinds of work, and a square nail has some appeal to me. Im thinking the original design was not really carved in the traditional sense, but deeply scratched in and burnished to deepen it.

I too have a copy of "Packing Iron" that I need to get back from a friend and go through it again.  Thanks for your thoughts. 

nails were only square until they took a file to them lol. they made many different tools from the raw stock including sewing awls. po folk got po ways but they got the same grey matter as rich folks.

[CharleyS]

2 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

nails were only square until they took a file to them lol. they made many different tools from the raw stock including sewing awls. po folk got po ways but they got the same grey matter as rich folks.

Only lack of imagination holds folks back.  I have a rosewood foreplane that my great grandfather made and used in the 1880s and 1890s doing custom stairs in the Dakotas. He made his own because he couldn’t find one he needed in the hardware stores.  There is always a way to find the right tool.  

[fredk]

Whilst you lot are waiting for your books to come back I have my copy of PI handy.  I'll have a look

[YinTx]

Lots of references to "decorated" "incised" "carved"  "tooled" etc., but nothing I have found yet about nail carving in "Packing Iron" that I can find.

 

[CharleyS]

Back to what Bruce said, I can see the similarities to “finger carving”.  I looked that up today and my highly uneducated guess is that it’s the same principle just that the antique I mentioned was probably just done with crude tools like a nail, compared to a swivel knife.   Thanks everyone for great input. I need to do more research lol. 

[billybopp]

8 hours ago, CharleyS said:

Back to what Bruce said, I can see the similarities to “finger carving”.  I looked that up today and my highly uneducated guess is that it’s the same principle just that the antique I mentioned was probably just done with crude tools like a nail, compared to a swivel knife.   Thanks everyone for great input. I need to do more research lol. 

Several years ago, Serge Volken did a video on incision knife carving on YouTube that was fairly interesting.   

- Bill

[fredk]

I now wonder if 'Nail Carved' is a buzz phrase to sell the item and the phrase is based on just a couple of lines in Al Stohlman's bio

I've no doubt that cowboys, settlers, farm workers, soldiers, anyone who had personal plain leather items spent time carving designs into that leather in their spare time and used whatever they had to hand, nails, knives, bullet shell cases. Archaeological finds are full of items where man left his personal mark, from neolithic stone markers carved with dots & spirals, medieval castles with game board designs carved on flat window stones, an ancient holy site with a medieval monk's carving on a stone near a doorway translated as 'Brother xxx was here (and the date)'

When I was young (yes, I was once) I used to do wood chip carving. I couldn't afford proper carving chisels so I reshaped and sharpened old screwdrivers which I scrounged off friends' parents. Someone always has an old screwdriver somewhere     Would that now be called 'Screwdriver Carved' ?

 

Edited April 6, 2023 by fredk