Layered Belt Question

[SpruceMoose]

I've just started making tooled layered belts(made many unlined belts, got new machine, am venturing out into lined items).  8-9 oz front, 6 oz back roughly. I skive the billet a hair as well.   I find that too thick to nicely go through a buckle, yet I see them everywhere by professionals the same weight if not far heavier weights with a standard brass buckle. 

What am I missing here?

Thanks for any input in advance.

 

[bruce johnson]

I skived mine back past the fold at least 1 to 1-1/2 inches past the fold so the trophy style buckles would have clearance for the tip to easily pass through the loop. My standard work kind of tooled belts were 8/9 with a 3/4 liner and even those could get tight on some buckles. 

[Dwight]

Mine are generally in the .180 to .220 inches thick when it is done.

Starts out as Tandy leather 7/8 oz . . . same thickness for both pieces.

Toward the ends of a side of their leather . . . it is usually a bit tougher leather . . . so I make the buckle end out of that tough leather . . . and it is only one thickness . . . the outer leather.  

It then folds nicely back over . . . gets two Chicago screws and a buckle and a belt keeper.

Have never in over 20 years had a belt "wear out" in that buckle area . . . or have problems slipping thru belt loops or buckles.

Truthfully never saw any sense in a double layer attached to the buckle.

Jus the way I do it though . . . and it is not universal.

May God bless,

Dwight

[JLSleather]

first issue, ya kaint say "made many belts" and not git withda pics. We like leather pics   nofair.nofair.nofair.

That said, I do not make my belts that heavy.  Absolutely no need for that much cow to hold in people.  Save the 14 oz stuff for saddle fenders.

My tooled belts are - short of a specific reason or request otherwise - 7/8 oz lined with 3/4 oz.  I do not know how many belts I've tooled over  the years.  Prolly a lot to some, maybe not so many to others  Plenty of depth in the carving in 7/8, and the 3/4 is both a weight that gives me a nice feel and firmness to the belt and is a weight that I use for other 'stuff', so I don't need to stock or split every weight of leather.  I do use a good bit of 4/5 for other projects, but I find that's the upper limit of where i want my belts (and I'd prolly be lookin fer the thinner end of that hide for the belt lining).

 

There are exceptions. 

When I make a belt unlined, which isn't very often any more (big in the 80's), I go a bit heavier with 8/9 or sometimes 9/10.   

And there's the occasional outlier, like that filigree belt I made for that couple which needed to be "like the old one", made to replace one he inherited from his dad.  If I remember right, that was two layers of 5/6 with some snake 'tween em.  This worked with the look, the feel, and went through the loops in his jeans   Still, definitely an exception to the rule (but still ends up about 11/12 oz overall).

AND of course, ranger belts are a category on their own, almost.

ALL OF THAT to say, there's rules, and then there's other stuff done without the rules

As a RULE, I allow 3 1/2 inches for the 'fold over" in a belt.  Meaning I skive about 7" of the top layer down about 1/3 or so... so it's like maybe 5-0z-ish.  Then I don't skive the lining, so you end up with leather about maybe 9 oz thick in the fold and snap (or screw) area.  But the last 3 1/2 inches, as in from the fold to the end of the strap, is tapered down to about 3 oz so it reduces the bulk of the 'step' in the end (against your waist).  ... Uhh... I'll make a sketch wut I'm talkin bout..

 This results in a belt that retains strength, lays flat without creating a big pile of leather in the front, looks smooth when worn. This is the top (tooled) piece of leather, flesh side up. Course there's not a hard sharp corner at the start of the skive, it's shown that way to mark the 7" spot but actually tapers in (like any other skive).  This also allows the use of snaps without 'special' posts if ya want snaps instead o screws.  This is purdy much what Bruce was on about above, i just go a tad further so the entire fold-over leather sits in a 'pocket" on teh back side.

 

SERIOUSLY, I question these 'professionals" making 14-, 16-, 18-oz belts.  300-lb guys STAND ON 14 oz leather fenders to get in the saddle and it holds up just fine.  To the guy who says he can "blow out" or even stretch a belt with his stomach "muscles", I say 'show me'. 

 

 

Edited July 22, 2023 by JLSleather

[Dwight]

Belts is a "to each his own" . . .  which incorporates the customer as well.

Many of mine carry heavy guns and other stuff on those belts . . . they don't want them bending and twisting out of shape . . . and the bulkier belts make that happen longer than a fat single layer belt . . . or a thinner double layer . . . at least that has been my experience.

Plus I also make a steel lined belt that is even more adept at not bending and twisting . . . 

May God bless,

Dwight

[SpruceMoose]

Thank you for the feedback everyone, means a lot coming from experienced long time professionals!

I think I will cut the lining back to 4-5 (I've tried 3-4 previously, but i found the edges wrinkled up to much, though the side was a little soft)

To mitigate the wrinkling I also utilize the technique of gluing the liner on while giving the belt a gentle curve, found here, I believe a Dwight tip on some buried thread (I'm reading back through every page in most categories, a ton of priceless information here)

Needless to say, those are very nice belts JLS.

 

I don't have many photos of regular or tooled belts(made the old classic mistake of not backing up a computer, lost everything a few years ago). 

Below I have a few older examples of un-lined kilt belts, and a little tooling(excuse the tooling, they are about 8 year old photos)

 

 

[SpruceMoose]

The basketweave is a trial belt i've made for myself. (excuse my wonky stitching, made a dumb mistake of not turning down the speed after bobbin winding, once i did that i didn't follow through with the rest of the edge finishing either, i need far more practice on my machine before i touch things, i am impatient sometimes, which leads to mistakes, lessons learned lol.

And as someone who has hand-stitched for what feels like eternity, i got a little excited on it, techsew 2700, pretty nice, i've read a ton on here about it, much appreciated info from wizcraft.

 

Edited July 23, 2023 by SpruceMoose
wrong file