anybody here use the holster needle plate for an Artisan or Juki?

[bruce johnson]

Ed,

I see, said the guy who didn't read closely. I missed the part about you changing the feed dog too. I was visualizing my Adler's toothed feeddog beating on the bottom of a slotted throat plate. You might need to grind a bit off, or if it has the elongated screw hole like a toothed feed dog, just lower it more.

It is strange that it seems to require less bobbin tension. You would think the pull of the takeup arms and tensioners on top and the bobbin tension on the bottom shouldn't change. Listen to what the machine is telling you it wants, it doesn't always read the "book".

I don't see a big difference between the oval or diamond hole in the smooth feeddog on the 441s. Biggest problem I had with the Adler was the smaller round hole in the feeddog. The 205-64 doesn't have a lower needle guide and the needles will deflect on some hard leather or following old needle holes in curled leather. When I used a bigger needle and it deflected even slightly, it missed the hole, made a spectacular sound as the needle snapped, and sent you looking for the end. I had been forwarned of that happening, and heard the stories of not finding the needle end. It rolls around in the race, makiing grooves in something that ain't supposed to be. It can also bend or break feed dogs, so that needed to be checked too.

Regarding the oil hole, mine get changed enough that oil spot gets hit.

[esantoro]

All I needed was the stirrup plate for gusset corners and the flat slotted plate for everything else. I got the holster plate thinking I could compromise if I had to and leave it on for everything. I figure if I can raise the material guide, which I really like, just 1/4" with spacers (off to home depot Wednesday), I'm back in business.

Right now I'm using the narrow harness makers foot with the holster plate...making some progress. The only rt and lt toes I have are sawed off mods of the blanket foot that came standard with the machine. No can do there...will have to get normal rt and lt toes with narrow center foot. I'll post pics of everything later.

At least for my applications, the raised portion of these needle plates could be 1/16" to 1/8" lower, as I figure one would want to save as much presser foot clearance as possible.

Writing down my experimentation helps me work through the kinks. Thanks for listening.

ed

[esantoro]

Well, my dremel and I have become more intimately acquainted over the past two hours. All is well with the stirrup plate, the for the flat slotted plate I need to grind off a bit of the bottom of the feed dog..................

......................Then it occurred to me, do I even need this feed dog? As long as the needle makes it into the slot of the flat needle plate it should be oriented fine. I remember hearing once that these walking foot machines work fine without that feed dog.

Ed

[esantoro]

And after more hours of experimentation with the new needle plates and passive feed dog, she's behavin' like a different woman. It's like I've got to get to know her all over again.

Ed

[Art]

Hi Ed,

You can just take the feed dogs off, they don't do anything but what feed dogs do. My 4000P came without dogs installed, but I got a set included with the blanket foot system which I install when Rose does elevator blankets; I remove it when going back but it could be left in and lowered if you like the idea of a lower needle guide (the hole in the feed dog for the needle). Personally, I don't think it is necessary as there is always a chance of missing it (and I'd rather skip a stitch than break a needle). So if you leave it in and lowered, make sure it is lined-up properly.

Happy Holidays,

Art

Well, my dremel and I have become more intimately acquainted over the past two hours. All is well with the stirrup plate, the for the flat slotted plate I need to grind off a bit of the bottom of the feed dog..................

......................Then it occurred to me, do I even need this feed dog? As long as the needle makes it into the slot of the flat needle plate it should be oriented fine. I remember hearing once that these walking foot machines work fine without that feed dog.

Ed

[esantoro]

Hi Art,

I think I'm going to try without the dog.

On another note, last night I had one needle crash into the flat slotted plate and break. If I run into problems with the needle crashing on any of these needle plates, I think Ill try widening the needle slot in the plate, mainly to the right side. Do you forsee any problems in doing this?

Does it also make sense that there would be a difference in spi, tension, and general stitch look when going from the blanket/nylon needle plate/feed dog setup to these slotted/passive feed dog setups? With the blanket/nylon set up, I really didn't have to push the leather through, as the feed dog did help out in that respect. With these slotted needle plates/passive feed dog setups, I seem to have to nudge the leather ever so slightly, the thicker the leather the less I need to nudge it.

Are all of your plates from Artisan, or do you have any from Ferdco?

Thanks and best wishes during the holidays,

Ed

Hi Ed,

You can just take the feed dogs off, they don't do anything but what feed dogs do. My 4000P came without dogs installed, but I got a set included with the blanket foot system which I install when Rose does elevator blankets; I remove it when going back but it could be left in and lowered if you like the idea of a lower needle guide (the hole in the feed dog for the needle). Personally, I don't think it is necessary as there is always a chance of missing it (and I'd rather skip a stitch than break a needle). So if you leave it in and lowered, make sure it is lined-up properly.

Happy Holidays,

Art

[esantoro]

After looking more closely at Ferdco's and Artisan's raised needle plates, I came to the conclusion that the original maker of these plates must have had the same understanding bruce has. Any plate that is meant to stay installed for a long period of time, flat plate and holster plate (though ferdco's and artisan's holster plate don't seem to have the hole), will have the lube hole. THe stirrup plate, on the other hand, doesn't have a hole because it isn't meant to stay on the machine that long. .

That said, I really like the holster plate. Because of its plateaued stitching surface, I can, as Bruce has mentioned elsewhere, stitch for long sections and many applications without having to switch to the slotted flat plate.

One last thing: It seems if there is ever any needle deflection, it will happen on the right side of the slot of any of the needle plates, and possibly the lower passive feed dog/needle guide, if installed. Would there be any drawback to widening this area on the needle plates and feed dog by about 1/16"?

Thanks again to everyone who talked me into getting a dremel, which, in my opinion, should come standard with all heavy stitcers that have an array of attachments.

Ed

[Art]

Hi Ed,

Needle strikes are caused a lot by the leather moving under the foot or the foot raising before the needle gets through the needle plate hole. I am not sure I would go making the hole larger before seeing if some other fix is necessary like increasing pressure foot spring pressure, checking the foot timing, etc.

Art

[esantoro]

Hi Ed,

Needle strikes are caused a lot by the leather moving under the foot or the foot raising before the needle gets through the needle plate hole. I am not sure I would go making the hole larger before seeing if some other fix is necessary like increasing pressure foot spring pressure, checking the foot timing, etc.

Art

Hi Art,

Thanks for pointing out these other issues to be aware of. Often I ask questions anticipating certain issues not currently a big problem, and sometimes I like to fix things that don't need fixing.

Ed

[Art]

Hi Ed,

If you like to tinker, get a machine to fix up. On the production stuff, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Art

Hi Art,

Thanks for pointing out these other issues to be aware of. Often I ask questions anticipating certain issues not currently a big problem, and sometimes I like to fix things that don't need fixing.

Ed