Grab Strap

[ArtS]

It's real experience like this that makes this site a pleasure to read. It's worth it's weight in gold.

ArtS

I once seen a Ray Hunt clinic and have seen others like it where the people were instructed to grab the horn with one hand and cheyenne roll with the other untill thier horse stopped pitching. At the time I was a fairly young 19 or 20ish year old rough stock rider fresh from filling my permit and working for a trainer where we often took in remidal horses in. I was in shock to see anyone grab leaher in that manner and completely gie over all form of control untill years later and seeing as well as being involved with many more clinics that the reason for that was about the safest way a person can show a group of strangers a one doesnt know thier abilities on how to stay abourd. Now to my eyes not one horse at that clinic that did do much more then fart was in anyway pitching but now i understand the reasoning, the trouble was and still is that I garentee, alot of those people came away thinking thats how it should be dont because Ray said so, i say this because i did ask someone who was there if they still did and they did. My reply was, "what you gunna do if you have a calf dallied on, its cow with her head inder your horse, your horse pitching a fit and your dogs having a high time of it all?"

Losing that whatever control you have left over the situation is about the worst thing one can do for all involved. Obviously best not to get in those wrecks but it happens and anyone it hasnt happened to hasnt cowboyed enough. It just happens. I rode rough stock for a LOOOONG time and my best rides (or worst depending on your outlook) I ever had there wasnt a judge, pretty girl or ambulance in miles to my dismay.

I once watched a pretty lil english rider gal ride a hell of a pitchin horse without hardly so much as pullin rein much less saddle( I had been watching her close before hand so seen the action )

Now I have been in a roping saddle before on some lil sneaks severaltimes that caught me paying attention to cows then them and have grabbed some coils to get my seat but from exsperiance I know to let go, was pitched and drug by the arm from a coiled catch rope across a track once and the rope scar on my arm is a super reminder why once ya get your seat to let go , trust your balance ,riding ability and horsesense enough to calm the storm.

A nightlatch as said is a interesting peice of history but though I cant directly quote the man i do recall Will James mentioning them in a book saying somthing to the effect of "No cowhand worth his salt would be caught dead with one" or somthign like that. By all accounts it would be hard to find a better bronc hand then that fella but then again look at the saddles they used, I have rode in some of them and ya about have to want to be dumped to have it happen. Horses today are bigger, more athletic, maybe not meaner but definilty on a average harder buckers when they do then about any period in time, unfortunitly riders seem to be going the opposite way.

All this is just my opinion ofcourse and not ment or directed at anyone in this post, just coffee talk, but i know how to get bucked off and on a real pitchin horse not just crow hoppin and farting, grabbin anything other then you wits will allow ya to test your soil content goin FORWARD, read head first. Friend of mine have a picture of me doing just that, head first,saddle betwix my thighs about to taste mud and horse goin the other way, if i find my copy ill scan it and post. Youll get a chuckle, though i did crack 2 vertebrea in my neck..

Musta been a tandy billet, JOSHIN YA!

[jwwright]

After 30 years of full time cowboyin, ranchin, and training horses........I too, have been my fair share of storms. I did put a rope type nightlatch on one of my wades one time. Did me no good, personally. Heck when a storm was brewing, reaching for that nightlatch was the last thing I needed to do. Hard to find it, and dropping my shoulders forward fishing for it was counter productive for sure. I think it was on that saddle for about 1/2 day. I will grab leather, but it is usually not grabbing, it is pushing back with the palm of my hand on the horn. Even though I have started a large number of colts, I never was a good bronc rider...........I have always done my best to keep one from feeling like they need to pitch. Not always successful, for sure.

"If you see your stirrups slap together above the horn, you're probably bucked off". Dave Stamey.

[BondageMaster]

That was a most enjoyable read and I feel obliged to post just to say thanks.

Joining this forum has been quite the pleasant surprise.

Thanks again for sharing.

BM

[Cora]

I am a firm believer in Less is More, the less you have between you and your horse the more you will learn from him. That's just my $0.02

Cora

[TwinOaks]

All this talk about night latches and the problems with using your hands....and not one person has bothered to mention to the youngin's that a horn ain't a handle. With all the interest in "western pleasure" riding I'd think that some saddle makers would just make a quick detachable horn. Nice little twist lock jobby so that if the saddle needs to be used for roping it can be, but for the 'rent-a-ride' crowd you can just take it off. I like the comment about cutting off the horn, then taking the saddle away. It seems like sometimes that's the only way to teach a person to use their butt. Now, for all readers that don't already know it, A Horn Is Not A Handle. It's an attachment point for the dumb end of a lasso, so that the poor horse ain't got to hold the rope with his teeth. There, I've said it, and I'm sure there will be dissenting opinions, but there it is.

Now before anyone goes too far in their assumptions about me...No, I'm not a ranch hand; and my wife's horse died before she'd let me ride him. However, I was taught by a 'lifer' from Idaho, using an unbroken 4 year old stallion as the class room. A few moments after getting on his back, the show started and I wished to high Heaven that the horn on that saddle had never been invented. It was like the launch tab on a rubber band gun. ( I can still hear Lynn yelling "Let go of the @$%$%^$%^ horn, you idiot!") Two days, and three fifths later, the stallion and I came to an understanding- If I didn't hold on to the horn, he didn't give me flying lessons. Besides, if your hand has a death grip on the horn, you can't use it to flap with.

Edited January 18, 2008 by TwinOaks

[bruce johnson]

Ok, we are getting into some training and philososphy of riding, which gives us all some perspective of our backgrounds and needs/wants of our customers. To weigh in on the saddle horn thing, grab or not to grab. I am a grabber, I am not a choker or a puller usually. Yes those things will get you in wreck. But also horns were put there for a reason, and they serve a purpose, one of which is to be an anchor point. If I am getting bucked off and am loose and pitching forward, there are certain anatomical considerations. You can bet I am going to grab and push myself back down or push on it to stay back. I have had a couple of injuries. Two compression fractured vertebrae from being bucked off. That was kind of a bad day, as was the 40 mile ride to the hospital. I have fractured my pelvis and wasn't bucked off, that was a worse day. I then had to figure how to get off him after I got the playday stopped. As an aside, don't refuse help from the neighbor lady driving by. I thought I had aggravated an old chronic groin injury when I felt the pop. Right after she drove off, I felt the bones grating. I have no shame using a horn. Kiskaddon talks about it some of his poetry. The old farts will all admit to doing it if they are pressured into being truthful. Yeah they did it when they needed to.

Most of what we are talking about is way different than someone holding on the saddlehorn nose-to-tail-down-the-trail or learning to ride in the ring. Yes you need to learn balance, rythm, feeling the horse, knowing their feet, all that to really be a rider. I worked for a cutting horse trainer, and used to show them too. You want to see a horn, look at what they use now. It is a handle, and every one of them use it. Mostly to push on, but sometimes you pull jumping out of a sweep. A horse pops into run, leaves a roping or bulldogging box, pull yourself up or steady yourself with the horn. Barrel racers pull up leaving a barrel. Reined cowhorse riders on a tight turn on the fence sometimes need to push back up. There are always exceptions, but by an large, it is pretty common for some darn good riders to lay a hand on the horn.

[HorsehairBraider]

And here I thought all these posts would be about how my intsructions were wrong! :D

I used to have one of those really old "colt-breaking" saddles and the last thing I worried about was falling off... usually not through the mechanations of my mount, but just through sheer ability to fall off on my part. I don't ride this type of saddle anymore, the type I ride don't have horns, or I hitch up to a cart and drive. What has kept me alive is getting along with the horse, although I would not be ashamed to grab something to keep from falling off, if I ever thought that would work. My feeling has always been, once you're going, you're going.

[ArtS]

An acquaintance of mine that is a horse trainer (or so he says) had one buck him into the air and he landed on the horn fracturing his pelvis. I bet that is one time he wished that he didn't have a horn.

ArtS