Pure Leather Prints- A New Concept

[k47]

Hi,

Im new to the leather business. However my work is very specialised. Given below is some information about my company and work:

Vaz lifestyle is India's first and only company to print on pure leather. With custom designed products, we wish to offer our customers only the best and the most exclusive.

I want you all to take a look at my company page VAZ LIFESTYLES to gauge the concept of leather printing,and provide me your valuable feedback..The print is totally scratch proof and passes the scotch test.

I would love to enhance my products with master craftsmen in this forum and explore new markets outside india.This technology is new and unexploited, i would want you to understand the massive scope of such products and partner me to market this product. My product is about 10 times cheaper than my closest international rival with no compromise in quality.

Attached Herewith are pictures to give you an idea about my work.

Please feel free to contact me for any sort of query,suggestion etc.

Thanks,

Karan vaz

Vazlifestyles@yahoo.com

Edited February 15, 2011 by k47

[tg lucas]

i have some questions.

What is the image applied with?

What is the dye/ink/paint?

What is the type of leather that is used and are there any restrictions?

What do you classify as "scratch proof"?

Can the artwork be "one off" or would many images need to be produced to make it economically viable?

Can you supply samples of it for consideration?

Edited February 15, 2011 by tg lucas

[k47]

Hi Lucas,

Thanks for your interest,

Lucas we have got machines to help execute the process which we have ourselves built as we have mechanical engineers working for us.

As for the dye/paint/ink we use, sir that i cannot disclose as it is a trade secret.

There are no restrictions regarding the type of leather, we just need a clean skin without hair and marks. We are presently using Sheep NAPA and cow leather for production.

Scratch proof simply means that the print doesn't come off when you scratch it. My product passes through the scotch test which proves my point.The life of the print is minimum 2 years, I guarantee it for upto 1 year.

Currently the screen technology used for printing leather does not offer this benefit.Nor does it allow multi color printing. Both these shortcomings we have overcome.

The art work can be One-off .

I can definitely supply you with the samples. Kindly let me know your requirement. However, you will have to pay the sampling charge of the product.

Tks,

Karan Vaz.

[Jazznow]

The idea is interesting.

But (sorry if this is not what you want to hear) you worte: "The life of the print is minimum 2 years, I guarantee it for upto 1 year."

What will hapen after the 2 years? Will it just get a patina or darken a bit like any other leather or will it start to look bad (fading colours or something). If a piece will lose its beauty, i would not use you technique, sice i try to make my products last as long as possible and look good as long as possible too. Thats a goal that i don't reach always. But thats my fault and not the fault of a technique, from which i know it will never last 20 Years and more.

Sorry for beeing mistrustfully

Jonathan

[Ferg]

i have some questions.

What is the image applied with?

What is the dye/ink/paint?

What is the type of leather that is used and are there any restrictions?

What do you classify as "scratch proof"?

Can the artwork be "one off" or would many images need to be produced to make it economically viable?

Can you supply samples of it for consideration?

tg,

The process is well known in "Transfer Technology" circles. The printing machine aka "Direct to product printer", actually places ink, for lack of a better word, onto any substrate

that will fit in the straight through opening of the printer. Most have a type of conveyer belt that moves the product through. First printers available for small business use were way up in the thousands of dollars.

Some good ones are available for about $15,000. Everyone should have one or two.

The transfer dye or ink is not necessarily a secret. Light fastness is the bugaboo affecting most. I do not really know how much scuff resistance it would have but the one year cycle on a

well used wallet would be about right. Someone that doesn't have the "dirt" I accumulate in my pockets could probably get two years easily. Then you will have a less than great

image.

I am not trying to knock these folks product but please do not begin with the "smoke and mirrors".

ferg

[tg lucas]

Well we obviously assume that it was some kind of "machine" and that you are not painting each one on by hand, is it a press, an inkjet or what?

As for applying any ink/dye/paint to a substrate that is going to be in contact or in close contact to the human body, you have to disclose period, we don't need any kind of issue with lead poisoning or such issues getting into these country as we have had recently .

Are you telling me that any leather will absorb the image regardless of finish?

Lol, ok "scotch test". Are you drinking it or using the tape? Seriously all finishes and dyes will fade and erode after time on leather. All leather is prone to abrasion regardless and that will significantly affect any image applied or dyed to it. Two years is hardly an acceptable time for a product unless you are just giving it away which could be why your costs "are ten times less than any competitor"

well as to being "one off" any image can be set up to run once, but the question is can it be set up to run one print and still be economically viable, I can set up art to make up one tshirt but it is not financially intelligent to do so because of the costs involved in getting that one shirt.

Let me get this one last thing straight, you have a product that you want to introduce that you think is better than anything else out there but you want me to pay for shipping of samples that may or may not exist for one, or more likely would be so low below standards that would render it unusable for market.

No offense, but you might want to rethink your positioning and your presentation as this comes off as just another version of the Nigerian scam, fix those issues and we can talk seriously.

Edited February 15, 2011 by tg lucas

[k47]

Hi ferg,

I don't mean to offend you or anything...but the transfer technology you are talking about is very different.....i know my base,i have done a thorough research for two years before starting production and i know the techniques in use. Besides if im claiming crap, i dont think people would buy it, so i guarantee you, there is some substance in my talk.

And if it were so easy, as uve put it, the world would be doing it. I wouldn't be the only player in a market like India. I dont claim that ive invented this technology, there are a couple of international players operating currently on similar lines.

i have just pushed a certain process further.....

Thanks for your interest,

Karan Vaz

[tg lucas]

i smell smoke.....anyone else?

[k47]

Lucas,

I dont think you understand what ive said, i will not disclose anything about the machine or ink/paint/dye etc....its all right if you do not trust me, its natural, we are thousand miles apart with nothing but a computer screen thats common between us...i would feel the same. As for poisoning fears, they are unwarranted. ive been retailing my products for about 1.5 years now, without any complains. You can test it out , if you decide to order a sample. Im not stupid to put a poisonous product for sale.

As for the viabilty part, yes it is still viable.

As for the life, i will not claim what i cannot deliver, the process is just 2 years old, so even im improving it....As of now, i can only assure you that the life of the print would be 2 years.

As for the sampling, I believe if i were in your position , i would definitely not mind risking a few bucks that might turn out to be really good for business. Business cannot be risk averse.

I completely understand your lack of trust, but im here to do business and not to cheat.

Tks,

karan vaz

[tg lucas]

Vaz,

I really feel like you do not understand where I am coming from. I have represented and marketed for companies that are known the world over and I gave you a little bit of free advise from the standpoint of potential client/partner which is what you stated you were looking for. Your presentation is vague, your product is questionable from many aspects and your responses are somewhat evasive. You have a facebook page as a company website and a yahoo addy for an email, with no actual physical address listed, and your "about the company" says to email for that info...these do not scream out legitimate business. I completely understand operating on a tight budget and would use any free outlet I could as a supplement to my primary company's public face, however anyone can be what they want on the web and no investor who has half a brain would turn loose of any money with what you have presented.

Now the questions I asked you were for a very specific purpose. One, any person with any knowledge of the leather industry, small scale or large, would ask these very specific questions. It would be considered required information from any initial contact. Two, I personally wanted to know if you had any actual working knowledge of the process or just a marketer trying his luck, or worse yet a scammer of which you have no actual product and have lifted images from an actual manufacturer in order to make a website to con people out of money for shipping of a product that doesn't exist. Unfortunately not a new concept, but that some are not aware of. It is easy to create a free website and email addy and pretend to be something you are not, charging possibly thousands of dollars for shipping and then simply disappearing. Now that is not being distrustful, it is called being intelligent.

As for the sampling, I believe if i were in your position , i would definitely not mind risking a few bucks that might turn out to be really good for business. Business cannot be risk averse. Well Vaz, I well make a square deal for you, you send me a PM and I will give you an physical addy to ship to, I will review your product for the forum members here and you can not beat that type of advertising for the few bucks you risked on sending them to me.

So with that being said, if you are truly legitimate and really have a wonderful product to promote, let us see a little more transparency and I would love the opportunity to explore this further. Just be aware as though I may come across as just a hick from Arkansas, you are dealing with a "hightech redneck" and no stranger to ways of the world.

Edited February 15, 2011 by tg lucas

[Somawas]

Apart from whether the company is a "legitimate company" I have looked at the product and I am underwhelmed.

For example, wallets to coordinate with my shirts. Sorry. I'm a guy. I have one wallet at a time. I do not change wallets to have a wallet that goes with my outfit. My wallet has a bunch of stuff in it. Some day I will buy a new wallet, or, more likely, make myself a new wallet. When I get tired of this one. Or it starts to wear out. Then I will transfer wallets. I will throw a buch of ancient receipts and stuff away. But until that day, I only need one wallet.

[tg lucas]

Somawas, that is probably because you and I would not be considered "Gents", if you can imagine that.

Edited February 15, 2011 by tg lucas

[k47]

Mr lucas,

You maybe a very experienced businessman. and i respect that. i am not asking for anything i do not deserve. I have been clear on that earlier too.

I have been put to test by the corporates here in india also, and my answers are the same to them as they are to you.

I have joined this forum to see if something like this exists widely in the west. i haven't come across something like this uptil now. So if it isn't a new concept, please send me a link.

As for sampling. My terms are clear. Pay me for the product and i will ship you the sample. I have had bad experiences before , so i do not mind waiting for a person who is willing to take a risk.

And im not asking for thousands of dollars. Its 40$ for a wallet that has been posted on my thread. I will bear courier charges.

If you feel it is something worth trying. We go ahead. Or else we put an end to our discussion.

Good day,

Karan Vaz.

[k47]

somavas,

I agree the strategy is somewhat "Not male" as you call it. But we are trying to break perceptions out here. it might sound crazy to you and many other people. But there is no harm trying. and that's what we are doing.

Thanks for your interest anyways,

Karan Vaz

[tg lucas]

Mr lucas,

You maybe a very experienced businessman. and i respect that. i am not asking for anything i do not deserve. I have been clear on that earlier too.

I have been put to test by the corporates here in india also, and my answers are the same to them as they are to you.

I have joined this forum to see if something like this exists widely in the west. i haven't come across something like this uptil now. So if it isn't a new concept, please send me a link.

As for sampling. My terms are clear. Pay me for the product and i will ship you the sample. I have had bad experiences before , so i do not mind waiting for a person who is willing to take a risk.

And im not asking for thousands of dollars. Its 40$ for a wallet that has been posted on my thread. I will bear courier charges.

If you feel it is something worth trying. We go ahead. Or else we put an end to our discussion.

Good day,

Karan Vaz.

Well I have to admit my shortcomings with how business is done in India, but here where I am you dont ask for something you feel you deserve, you earn it.

As to your answer for product liability issue over materials and processes to your "corporates" in India dont fly here Bubba.

As to the link, as I can tell you are little slow on the uptake, I will post it here for you.

http://www.snopes.com/fraud/advancefee/nigeria.asp

There are various evolutions to it and this situation sure sounds very familiar to me, "the product is held up by customs", and so forth and so on...

and it is very easy to sit back and wait for someone willing to take a risk when you have no product or overhead to maintain, there is a sucker born every minute.

Oh dont even get me started about your price of $40 dollars for a wallet that will only last two years but you only guarantee for one, I thought you said you you knew your base and did your research?

You know it has been said there are a lot of dummies here in America and it is probably true, but you are going to be hard pressed to find one on this forum and that is a statement you can put your "trust" in.

[bustedlifter]

Reminds me of the "tattooed" leather bike seats I saw. The leather was very thin and no examples of what they look like after some time in the real world. No thanks! If it sounds to good to be true, then it usually is.

[k47]

lucas,

Im not here to bicker .

Lets not waste our time.

Save your accusations and energies for someone else. Because i dont bother.

And why on the earth do you think that i will fly to america? iv got better markets to concentrate than an a declining economy like america, Keep the advice to yourself.

Im not here to be rude, emotional etc....im here to present a product, get "Constructive" feedback and if possible, build a business partnership.

Tks.

[k47]

@ lucas

Bambas

Click on the link.......thats my international competition.......you check the prices , warranties and then decide................

[tg lucas]

@ lucas

Bambas

Click on the link.......thats my international competition.......you check the prices , warranties and then decide................

lol ok, link doesnt work and its not even your link!

What are you trying to say? That you have competition?

That if you show me a website of someone else's that makes you a legitimate business and your market analysis is based on someone else's website?

Oh come on Vaz, do you realize how you are coming across?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with being new to the business world, we all started out somewhere....but buddy you are "out there" but I guess there has to be starving con artists too.

[k47]

http://www.bambas.com.au/

type the above in your browser and check it.

The link was for you and the others to understand that its not a too good to be true concept. and it was for you to understand the pricing and warranty offered at the international level.

Im not trying to prove my legitamacy.....its not humanly possible...we are too far away, for me to attempt that.

im just being as transparent as possible to the people viewing this post.

As for cons, well i can do nothing about that. so it makes no sense talking about it. you are experienced enough to make your judgement, so ill leave it at that.

Tks.

[tg lucas]

yeah buddy i think you are pretty much done here.....

[rickybobby]

Hi,

Im new to the leather business. However my work is very specialised. Given below is some information about my company and work:

Vazlifestyles@yahoo.com

[tg lucas]

I did some checking on this guy, as he had kinda a strange user name, k47, funny that it just happened to coincided with the time he joined the forum. Nothing wrong with that but it struck me kinda odd. I know some people might think that I was bit hard on the guy, but when you come on the forum asking for partners/investors or anything that involves someone else's money you should probably use your real name. His real name as far as I can find from the sparse information he gave is actually Karan Vazirani, not Karan Vaz. Alias's are ok for artists, rockstars and the occasional criminal but are not for conducting business and certainly not when there is money potentially changing hands.

The main location for Vaz Lifestyles is a 2nd story of a shopping mall in India where they sell and I quote from their own ad in Mumbai yellow pages "gifts and troussoue (the personal possessions of a bride usually including clothes, accessories, and household linens and wares, dowry) packing, gifts and novelties, general stationery. You can google it for yourselves to be sure I am not being unfair by my suspicions.

No where can I find any reference to Vaz Lifestyles or Karan Vazirani to a dedicated leather industry or manufacturer/printer of leather of any type in any business directory in India. Surely the best new leather printing technique would at least have a news release of some kind or maybe it is a trade secret or maybe he is just hiding it in his parent's basement.

My personal inclination is to think now that we have a kid, maybe just fresh out college (if my math is correct and he graduated high school in 2006 like he said he did on his personal facebook page) that has not learned that in business "honesty is the only policy" and any deviation from the truth no matter how small will bite you later. I also get the impression that this was all just a ruse to gain advancement in a contest that basically acts like an incubator project for business ideas, to where the company sponsoring would get the rights to the ideas and Karan would get a prize if he won and well any investors would be left out in the cold. Devilishly ingenious but a scam nonetheless.

How is that for transparency Karan?

Edited February 15, 2011 by tg lucas

[Ferg]

somavas,

I agree the strategy is somewhat "Not male" as you call it. But we are trying to break perceptions out here. it might sound crazy to you and many other people. But there is no harm trying. and that's what we are doing.

Thanks for your interest anyways,

Karan Vaz

I think I have a good solid idea for you. Your offer smells like rotten fish to a large number of us on this forum. Your getting $40 dollars sent to you without knowing what we are getting, mostly nothing probably,

has about as much chance as the proverbial snowball in Hades. Sooooo.... I sincerely believe it would be advisable for you to pull your product back into India and snooker the home folks.

ferg

[DaveJohnson]

Dear Karen

I travel to India evermonth and get around to most areas - I attended the ILLG 2011 leather fair in Chennai last month and saw a lot of printed leather coming onto the scene in India> Your samples look interesting - where could I come and see the quality and pick up some samples when I am there in two weeks time. I could give some feedback to the forum and save a lot of these e-mails back and forth.

Regards

Dave