How Come I Have Never Seen This Stamp In The Tandy Catalogue?

[556guy]

A variation of this was used by the 3rd Infantry Division up until WWII when they switched to the diagonal blue and white stripes. The 3rd ID's badge had the "legs" facing in the opposite direction.

Also used by a number of American Indian tribes as a good luck symbol.

OK, so I lied....well maybe it was just a case of old timers disease and I got my infantry divisions mixed up. This was the symbol of the 45th ID until about 1935 when the symbol became so associated with the N.S.D.A.P. The 45th then adopted the thunderbird design and continues to use it today as a Nation Guard Infantry Brigade.

[newfiebackflip]

Thanks for sharing this, and everyone sharing what is truly means. I'm 17 - I interpreted it to be, well make a guess.

Good info to know!

I always knew Hitler stole the original design and meaning, but I just didn't know it was Native American. If I remember correctly and I usually do, someone told me the original design was Asian. Wrong info gets passed around all the time.

I do agree with everyone that it should be brought back to its original meaning but that will be one hard thing to do. Its just going to be a major stigma in history, heck Germans (from what I am told) won't even mention that period in their country. Don't really blame them!

HorseGirl your only 17?! Wow I really wished someone introduced me to leather craft when I was that age, my skills would be a lot better today..... I hope!

Instead I enlisted into the forces and went that route. It actually wasn't until I was about to leave for Afghanistan until I started to get interested into it. Thank god all that sand I breathed in didn't make me lose interest.

Its actually really refreshing to see young people getting interested in this old trade, just don't make any custom with Justin Bieber on it PLEASE! lol

[JJLeatherworks]

A variation of this was used by the 3rd Infantry Division up until WWII when they switched to the diagonal blue and white stripes. The 3rd ID's badge had the "legs" facing in the opposite direction.

Also used by a number of American Indian tribes as a good luck symbol.

It was the 45th.

The history of the 45th Infantry Division can be traced back to 1890 with the formation of the Militia of the Territory of Oklahoma.^[3] That militia was mobilized in 1898 during the Spanish American War but was never deployed. In 1916 the First Oklahoma Infantry Regiment deployed for border security duty during theMexican Border Conflict. In 1917, the First Oklahoma Infantry Regiment, redesignated as part of the 142nd Infantry Regiment of the 36th Division fought in the final month of World War I.^[3]

Before the 1930s, the division's symbol was a red square with a yellow swastika, a tribute to the large Native American population in the south-western United States.

On 19 October 1920, the Oklahoma State militia was organized as the 45th Infantry Division of the Oklahoma Army National Guard and organized with troops from Arizona, Colorado, New Mexico, and Oklahoma.^[4] The division was organized and federally recognized on 3 August 1923 in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma.^[5] It was assigned the 89th Infantry Brigade of the Colorado and Arizona National Guards, and the 90th Infantry Brigade of the Oklahoma National Guard.^[6]

The division's original shoulder sleeve insignia featured a left-facing swastika,^[7] a common Native American symbol^{[citation needed]}, as a tribute to the south-western United States region which had a large population of Native Americans.^[2] However, with the rise of the Nazi party in Germany, with its famous right-facing swastika symbol, the 45th Division stopped using the insignia. A new shoulder sleeve insignia featuring the Thunderbird, another Native American symbol, was approved in 1939.^[2]

[reddevil76]

I always knew Hitler stole the original design and meaning, but I just didn't know it was Native American. If I remember correctly and I usually do, someone told me the original design was Asian. Wrong info gets passed around all the time.

The info could be right or wrong. It definitely is in Asian culture, but I cannot say if it originates from here. This symbol can be seen on many Buddhist statues here. But I can't be sure who is older, Buddha or the Native Americans. Probably someone can chip in.

One thing, I love the carving on your profile! I myself ride a 09 Triumph Speedmaster!

[newfiebackflip]

The info could be right or wrong. It definitely is in Asian culture, but I cannot say if it originates from here. This symbol can be seen on many Buddhist statues here. But I can't be sure who is older, Buddha or the Native Americans. Probably someone can chip in.

One thing, I love the carving on your profile! I myself ride a 09 Triumph Speedmaster!

That question is almost like asking what came first, the chicken or the egg.

Thanks for the comment, that was actually my very first attempt at carving. I owned a 1971 Triumph Bonneville Bobber at the time I had made it. I wish I still had it, it was a real head turner but that thing spent more time in the shop then on the road.

[mugwump]

A BSA summer camp that I taught handicrafts at one time had one of those, but didn't use it. The next year I had some extra stamps that I was going to trade for ii, but someone broke into the lodge, and stole the stamping tools. That was the only one that I had ever seen until now. I figured that it was pre WWII due to the design. Swastikas are very old symbols, and have been use by many cultures. I would have no problem using that stamp today, and use it to educate people about its historical usage.

actually, i saw that tandy had that in their catalog (in a set) until either the 1957 or '58 issue.

eric

[WyomingSlick]

There is a nearly comple set of the Indian Craftool series up for bids on eBay now. The wheel of life tool is included. For more info on this series check out my blog.

[manji]

I'd love to get my hands on one of those. Anybody know where else they can be found? I use the whirling logs symbol quite often.

Edited March 21, 2011 by manji

[WyomingSlick]

That is one of the strangest things I have ever seen on this site. :rolleyes2:

Please explain exactly just what the heck that is in the first picture.

As for getting a wheel of life stamp, I believe there will be one up for bids on eBay in the very near future.

As to the origin of the design, it is pretty well established that it arose at many differant places around the world. Hitler probably got it from his interest in the Aryan culture which came out of India.

[Mijo]

the word swastika is derived from the sanskrit word svastika which means welfare. As others have already mentioned it's ancient symbol used in different parts of the world (it actually appears on coinage from ancient mesopotamia). Hilter took the japanese version of the swastika called a manji, which moves in the counterclock wise direction and is considered a buddhist or solar symbol, and used it for their own purposes. it's a shame that such an acient symbol has such negative associations today...