Sold My First Tooled Dog Collar On Etsy!

[lightingale]

I just sold my first collar, and I'm ecstatic! I've attached a picture.

I actually didn't anticipate a sale for a long time, as I don't think most people would pay more than $50 for a dog collar. My piece sold for $60 plus shipping within days of posting it.

Could I be undervaluing my work? For the number of hours I put into it, I'm "making" less than minimum wage. However, this is something I enjoy doing and doesn't feel like work. I'm also not a master (I only started a couple months ago) and might be taking more time to create something than someone who has been at this for a long time. I also can't crank out a bazillion collars like some sellers seem able to. I'm not old by any means, but my arm can only take so many hours before it really starts to hurt!

Us crafty people are funny, eh? Instead of spending $100 on a beautiful, expertly-made dog collar, I spend over $1000 on supplies to learn to do it myself. At this stage, at least, I'm not trying to turn it into a business. My leathercraft hobby has turned into something of a money sinkhole so I'm hoping to make enough profit to pay for my supplies.

What say you? How do you price a piece to make it worth your time and effort and still able to get a sale?

[McJeep]

"Instead of spending $100 on a beautiful, expertly-made dog collar, I spend over $1000 on supplies to learn to do it myself. At this stage, at least, I'm not trying to turn it into a business. My leathercraft hobby has turned into something of a money sinkhole so I'm hoping to make enough profit to pay for my supplies."

Welcome aboard

[Spinner]

Congrats on the sale. The color stage is what will kill you on price. If you're looking to make money & a livable wage then look for ways to minimize the time spent like doing solid color or using inlays, colored lacing, etc. instead of dying/painting the color. I do quite a few full color pieces, some rather large paintings and more often than not the color ones kill me on profit but they serve as awesome advertising when they are shown off. To be honest, the reason why it sold so quickly is it was probably underpriced in the purchaser's eyes.

For pricing, I set some rates for my shop that I know are comparable to the market in regards to skill & time and look how that translates into a price. if the item looks to be seriously overpriced then I either look for ways to speed up the process or adjust the pricing accordingly. Hopefully, after awhile you get to the point where your skill level and product quality is good enough that the price stops to matter to the buyers.

[Cyberthrasher]

Way to go on the sale!!

Personally, I've been trying to loosely base my pricing on $20 p/h and then trying to push myself to do higher quality with faster times. Usually I will also go looking at other peoples similar work and see about what they're charging to see if I'm in the ball park.

yeah - What Spinner Said

Edited April 24, 2012 by Cyberthrasher

[Chavez]

Congrats on your first sale! Thats a nice looking collar.

I think I'm at least half a year away from mine=) Need to improve before I can even ask for any consideration in return for my products!

I also was after a new wallet, iphone case and a briefcase when I was starting leathercraft=) £1k later I still can't make a wallet I want, I'm nowhere near briefcases and I've only made one prototype iphone case which I have to wear cause the old one I bought in a shop 2 years ago fell apart. But every time I look in a mirror and see the case I made on the belt I made, I feel that the money was well spent =)

But I'll need to plug this money sinkhole sooner or later=)

[Cyberthrasher]

That's pretty much the same thing I did. I saw Joker making some cool motorcycle gear on a different forum and decided I wanted one, but didn't want to pay someone $350 + for it when I could make it myself for $1,000 by the time I'm ready.

It's a good thing I have a loving wife who I can blame for buying me my starter kit

[Mijo]

Congrats on your sale! IMO you under charged for your collar. I know another forum member that also makes tooled dog collars and their collars go for almost double what you charged. Is your collar hand stitched? It looks like it is but I can't actually see the stitches in the picture.

[rickybobby]

Hi,

Welcome to the leather workers nightmare! Pricing our work so it sells and feeling ripped off when it does! We are a sick bunch but do love our craft!

I would agree with Spinner and everyone else on multiple color work. Work with some antiques to get depth, and then a finish sealer, it is the only way to make it work for you timewise.

Keep practicing on your tooling. I think you stated you spent "hours tooling" , with practice, the tooling for that should take about 20 to 30 minutes. It will be a while but you will find yourself automatically grabbing for the next tool and knowing just where to place it in a quicker and more positive motion.

If you hand stitched that, STOP! you will never make enough sales to return the amount of time spent doing it. If you feel you must stitch something for a "look" you are trying to achieve, do a few items and go to a saddle shop or shoe repair shop and have them stitched. The few bucks a piece you pay will more than make up for the time you spent hand stitching.

If you do not have a sewing machine, there are edge treatments and small borders that you can apply to add interest and dimension to the sides (framing the tooling) that will take far less time and enhance the tooling as well (many are tools that you can buy use) can you see a spending trend here? There is always another tool to buy!

Congrats on your first sale! Now go do another to pay for this bad habit! :brainbleach:

Rick

[scott312]

That's pretty much the same thing I did. I saw Joker making some cool motorcycle gear on a different forum and decided I wanted one, but didn't want to pay someone $350 + for it when I could make it myself for $1,000 by the time I'm ready.

It's a good thing I have a loving wife who I can blame for buying me my starter kit

Oh I would blame her too. Bless her heart.

[lightingale]

Thanks for the feedback, folks!

Good to see I'm not the only one with a leather spending habit! Yesterday, I went to the only leather store in the province (Tandy) to physically see where all my supplies are coming from. Heck, they've made a lot of money off of me already from my online orders! To be honest, I much preferred the Zelikovitz store in the neighboring province... they carried all of Fiebing's products. Tandy mainly seems to sell Eco Flo, and a lot less selection in leather and hardware (and poorly displayed in boxes in aisles), but I digress...

The person who bought the collar actually requested it in a smaller size, so I made another one. The process was much faster. By "hours of tooling", I meant to include the time it took to sketch the design, scan it, size it, make a template for cutting the leather, carving... the whole process. The second one didn't take nearly as long, though of course I had to wait between layers of dye, mink oil, and top coats.

And no, the collar was not stitched. I got the stitching kit from Tandy last month when it was on sale, but discovered while practicing on a piece of scrap that not only did I need a lacing pony, but some sort of tool to sharpen my awl (I think it came dull, as it's a huge struggle to pierce it through a single layer of 8-9oz leather). So, I just used the groover and the spinny wheel thing because I liked the effect even without the actual stitching. I bought the cheaper lacing pony ($25) while I was at Tandy, and I do intend to hand-stitch some collars in the future, as I'd like to try some filigree work.

I can see how easy it is to just get "one more tool". Heh. $100-$200 later... and a few days later you think of another tool or dye or finish you'd like to try...

Here's the link to my new Etsy Store, to which I've added a couple new collars. I welcome constructive criticism. I'm a newbie and I know you folks have been at this a heck of a lot longer than I have!

[Mijo]

I checked out your etsy and the two collars posted are very nice. I really like the collar with the feathers / wings, your tooling looks great to me (but I myself don't do any tooling so I'm not the best judge of what good tooling is). I think your edges look very good too.

[Cyberthrasher]

Your collar's are looking pretty good. I really like those wings.

But, I think you should work on your focus with the pictures. I think there might be some people turned away by the simple fact that they can't get a clear image of what they're looking at.

[immiketoo]

I recently sold my hummingbird holster for 100 dollars! It was my first sale, and I too was ecstatic! I have three more orders, and I'm trying to increase speed for production. I know exactly how you all feel. I have spent over 1200 bucks to earn back 100. And II don't care because I LOVE workng with leather. I love the look on people's faces when the see somethng so personalized. It's worth it:)

Nice job and keep it up!

[DoubleC]

Congratulations on your sale. I guess it's already too late to tell you to run, you've got the bug. Let's see, I'm up $93.00 on etsy and down over 1200.00 in NON consumable supplies, don't want to talk about the consumables, you know the little things like leather.

So, I just used the groover and the spinny wheel thing because I liked the effect even without the actual stitching.

You are seriously having too much fun. And I wont tell you what I charged for a handmade dog collar black with nickle hardware and pyramid spots. Lined and sewn so the spot stays don't touch the dog. It was SO not as much as yours I feel even more foolish than I already have been because I can't get the guy to even pay the pittance I charged him, LOL. They call that 'stupid tax' here. Man I've paid some serious stupid tax.

Your collar is beautiful. Cheryl

[immiketoo]

Don't want to thread jack, but has anyone else experienced regret when handing over some of their first sale able work? I had a very hard time letting it go even though that was the whole point!

[DoubleC]

I've had trouble with that although I haven't sold that much and am still pretty new to this. I have a hard time finishing projects sometimes and I think it may still be some regret that they are leaving 'home.' I get better with new projects, well some of them and it makes the whole thing like it's all new again. I'm doing a lot to push selling locally and maybe I think it will give me a chance to 'visit' some of my things. When someone buys something from you it's a validation of your hard work and effort and an appreciation of your art. So suddenly you want that art back. I don't think you thread jacked so much as brought up a complex subject and I know I really had to think about what some of these feelings are. Anyway, maybe all people who create things feel that way, I don't really know Mike. Cheryl

[Chief31794]

Don't want to thread jack, but has anyone else experienced regret when handing over some of their first sale able work? I had a very hard time letting it go even though that was the whole point!

I have no qualms about selling things, I sell on ETSY and at craft fairs, I have two this month. I prefer to sell at craft fairs because people like to ask questions and I like to talk. I enjoy answering their questions about leather working. What I do not like is custom work, I do a lot of it, but people have trouble conveying their specifications or what they want done. I have an order in the shop now for 20 cases to hold 4" long Iron Rods and a card slot, this order is from the "Engineering Department" of an Iron Works Company. The order was placed by the Senior Engineer who had seen a case I had made to hold a flip phone. Just to show how it goes here is how the order communications went:

1. Customer: Can you make a case like the flip phone case to hold five 3/16" Rods and one 1/4" rod, all 4" long with our Logo on it. I need 20 of them and then I may want to order more.

2. Reply: Sir, I would be glad to custom make 20 cases per your specifications, please send me a set of the rods and a line drawing of the logo and I will make a prototype without the logo and send it for approval and order placement. If you place the order, I'll have a stamp laser engraved with your logo to use in the production run.

3. Customer: Excellent, about how much would you charge for this case.

3A. Reply: After recieving the rods, I layed out the case. I sent the graphic to Black River Laser and got a quote from Joyce on how much to made a 1-1/2" square stamp of the logo. How would you like it to close, I can use a Pull-the-Dot snap, Normal Snap, tuck closure, or a tuck catch closure like is used on some attache cases. The tuck catch is the most secure, the pull the dot is next, the snap is next and then the tuck closure. I recommend the tuck catch where you press in the button and slide it out of the keeper to open the case.

5. Customer: The tuck catch

6. Reply: After calculating about 2" wide by 4-1/2" tall fold over case with a 2" Flap, I quote him a price of $40.00 per case plus shipping.

7. Customer: Excellent, can you make a divider for the rods?

8. Reply: After throwing away all my design work for the 2"X4-1/2" case, I design a inner "Bullet Loop" piece that will separate the rods by sewing the loops to the back of the case. I reply, "Yes, but it will cost $55.00 per case.

9. Customer: That's fine, I understand more leather, more labor = more cost. Can you make a place to put a 4X4" Laminated Card in the case?

10. I make and send the prototype with my 1-1/2" makers mark where his graphic would be, the bullet loops wet molded to the rods and the case hand sewn. I send it off and he recieves it. I leave the cost at $55.00, I'm still making money, the case cost me about $8.00 in materials, no carving, $1.50 per case to cover the cost of the stamp and another $.50 for shop supplies and consumables per case, and I'm making $45.00 per case profit.

11. Customer: This case is perfect and it is beautiful, very nice work.

12. Reply: Thank you, let me know if you want to proceed.

13. Customer: I would like to order 20 cases. Can you make it so it will hold one 1/4" rod and six 3/16" rods? I reply yes. He replies "How do I pay you."

14. I send an invoice through PayPal.

15. He pays it, I am working on the order. Would have been easier if he'd have stated all of his requirements at the beginning. I'm not complaining!

This is how it goes with an engineer, accustom to working from supplied requirements and specifications, imagine what the conversation is like when a non engineer is designing an item through email!!!

Chief

Edited September 30, 2012 by Chief31794

[DoubleC]

Chief as you may or may not know, most of my work is custom because I DO enjoy that. I know people have a hard time conveying things at times, but I think it's like us, as we work through the process of a new project often times we'll think of something else we'd like to do differently the next time, or get too many ideas of new projects we want to do. But of course I've never had a custom order of that magnitude and I'd have to think long about taking it. None of my items are alike, they are all one offs. Not the most time efficient way of doing business and often I have to do a project twice because I'm so new I may not have done anything similar before. The thing I like the most about custom work is I usually surprise the customer by interpreting their ideas that may have been nebulous to begin with into something they hadn't even imagined. When they show off what I made them, knowing no one else has something just like it, and they think I did something magical it's just really what keeps me interested in the work. People have different ideas of what custom is. I was researching guitar straps last night and found custom straps for $110.00 that actually were identical. You could choose to put your name or initials on it, and choose from three colors. That's not a custom order to me. They were very nice straps but not custom. The last strap I finished the guy didn't know what he wanted. Finally he said he liked oak leaves because he used to live on Oak Street. That's all he could come up with. So instead of doing a traditional Sheridan style strap I carved and tooled oak leaf 'litter' on either side on an oak tree. He was delighted with the way I did it, and he'll never go somewhere and see that same guitar strap. I attached a picture so you could see what I mean. Maybe that's why it's so hard for me to let things go sometimes. My new strap I'm working on the guy wanted the state of VT on it and a tree of life. I listen to his music a lot and he has a lot of songs about the plight of family farms so I cut out a farmall tractor to put on it as a leather overlay along with the state. The rest will be carved and tooled. He'll never walk into a music store or go online and see 'his' strap somewhere for sale. And that really pleases me. And gives me incredible freedom when I do a project. Sometimes too much because I get so many ideas sometimes I have a hard time making decisions. Cheryl

[bluesman1951]

I am at a loss for words here .First thats a nice collar nicely done any one with a pet would enjoy having it . Second there appears to be no substitute for "LOCATION,LOCATION, LOCATION . In the end this is all just FISHING ,a product is created the hook is baited and the wait for a customer begins . I know a man on the plaza in Santa Fe who routinely sells nice dog collars for around 60.00 no tooling just a few conchos and nice clean work . I am begining to realise that being here in the art center of the US has its pluses despite the difficult living conditions from time to time . For a quater of a century I have watched the winners and losers in this business come and go here in New Mexico . I can say there is no magic formula for sucess no magic product either . Many have sought financil sucess with this and failed . Some here say they dont wish to manufacture ,but they wish to have money . Thats a dilema because only a very few suceed at producing ART for Art's sake . Good luck and sucess to all . Bill

[lightingale]

It's been 5 months since I started this thread, and I've made about 20 sales so far (not all of them on Etsy). I'm with DoubleC in that I enjoy the custom work. I think perhaps the difference between those who enjoy custom work and those who don't is whether you're doing this for a living. With this as a hobby, I have unlimited time to work with a customer with their design ideas, and bring it to fruition. If I were doing this as a job, I wouldn't have the time for that kind of one-on-one contact and it would thus become tedious.

I haven't had much time to come up with new designs for my Etsy store, as I've been busy with orders, and I got married this summer. I'm thinking in winter I'll have more time. I've also made a "shop" out of the spare bedroom, because my leather paraphernalia was taking up WAY too much space in the kitchen, even with those plastic space saver bins!

Since April, I've learned to hand sew, to cut from a hide (instead of using precut straps), and to mix my own paints and dyes, sometimes including metallic pigment powders for effect. My tooling has improved a lot also. I check the new posts on this forum every other day or so, and I've learned a ton of things without even having experimented on them myself. I have more inspiration than time to put then to leather.

I've also started a leather website and blog, and while it doesn't have that many posts yet, I have tons of ideas to post in the future! I've already made some fast-forward making-of videos of some collars. http://salukifeathers.com

I'm nowhere near paying for my supplies. I think I'm at about 3-4k now in what I put out, including Barry King tools, a Bearman maul and leather burnishers, and a myriad of other tools, leathers, and dyes/liquids. I've made some of that back, and the "sinkhole" rate is slowly shrinking, though right now I'm still losing money as there's always another tool I want to try. I try to buy from Tandy only when things I want are on special, and so far my Elite membership has more than paid for itself. Everyone says that Tandy leather is no good, but I've found that their European single bends are excellent, and I bought a bunch at a steal price. Their stamping tools are still not the best, but you can't beat the price if you're starting out.

I actually don't have trouble letting things go as I tend to make a "trial" run of a new technique first before selling it. I'll take pictures of it, post it, and have one of my dogs or a friend's dog wear it to see how well it stands up to regular wear. I'm always experimenting with different dyes and finishes (just recently picked up the entire Eco Flo Professional Waterstains plus edge dyes, finishes, and conditioners for $99 on sale), so it's good to see for myself how well it stands up to doggie abuse! Sometimes I fall in love with something I make, but every time I make it, it gets better and better, and I know I can always make it again, as I scan and save all my designs in Photoshop.

Anyways, just wanted to post an update from the original .

Edited October 6, 2012 by lightingale

[DoubleC]

Unfortunately I'm trying to marry custom with a business and that is a problem. I'm much too slow in my production right now because of all the different things I try. I think once I really get up and running I'll be able to settle into my original line of products and stay with those They'll still be custom but they won't be any project a person wants done. I have a hard time saying no to any new projects because I like doing different things. I'm in the process of making a new custom strap, finishing up a dog collar, and I just finished making me a messenger bag. That's kind of all over the map but I do have a couple of projects I'm working on that will be similar to each other for my etsy store and increase production time but I'll still primarily be doing custom work, and those will just be fillers I can work on when I'm feeling tired or not in a creative mood. There's room for all kinds of things when you work with leather and as long as I love what I'm doing I won't stop. Even things like the similar bracelets I'm going to be doing I love the part of sewing the lining on with my old Singer 28 hand crank machine. I really like doing that and use it most of the time because it does such a good job and it relaxes me. I have two other old Singer's I use too besides hand sewing. People keep telling me I can't use machines like the ones I have but they forgot to tell the machines and I have a love of old things. I'm so new to this work I'm still finding my way or more like letting a way find me maybe. Cheryl