Going Blind!

[Shelly]

OK - here's a new one that many of you may already be experiencing! I don't really have a heavy prescription for my glasses/contacts - but, at 49, and after all the years of very close work with the braiding, etc, I've now found I'm having some frustration 'seeing' what I'm tooling, hand-stitching, etc...mostly because of age related focusing issues, I think. I have plenty of light over my work area, but I like a more concentrated, yet not blindingly white light, directly on the area I am working on - also, I don't 'see' what I'm working on as well as I could - even with the glasses on - probably need a new prescription...I have a light that has a 'circle' tube, and the center is a magnifier - I actually used it yesterday and today, to carve, tool, and finish cut a floral belt...I couldn't believe how much easier it was! Like doing flowers and leaves 4" in diameter! (1 1/2" belt)

So, my question formed while I was doing this and feeling really dumb looking thru the top of this magnifier, and having to be very careful to not break the glass on the tube while running my tools - surely someone on this forum is using some type of magnification device that also has light with it to illuminate the work! I'm thinking about what would a gun engraver be using - they have such a tiny area to fill with so much, and I know it must be much more tedious than the carving that we do - so, if there is something out there available that will do this for them, I want that tool myself!!

I've even tried to wear my contacts (for distance - from the ends of my fingers to...), to the shop, and when I needed to sew a binding, etc, I put those magnifying readers on - works better than trying to see what I'm doing that closeup with just the bifocals (no line type). I believe if I keep on like this I'll strain my eyesight even more than necessary, then what!?

Can't wait to hear what the suggestions are - in the meantime, I'll try surfing the net for something interesting!

Thanks to all,

SL

[bruce johnson]

Shelly,

I am with you on the bifocal deal for sewing bindings and horns. They aren't designed to tip your head in that direction.

I use the magnifiers for some surgeries. I have used from the low end Optivisors up to good quality clip on lenses. The problem I have with them mostly is that they have a fixed focal distance. Some may be as fixed as 16-18". If you are outside of that, you are blind. I can see the area, and not be able to tell one tool in the using rack or one instrument from another. I look around or under the lens to find them, and then continue to look around the lens to use them. We gave a ride back fromKings reception at Sheridan to a guy from Kentucky. He was there selling kind of a decent little light and lens setup. His business is QED, Inc. They advertise in the LCSJ, and I just found a web address - www.qedisit.com.

For lights, if I need a focused area light, I have an exam room floor lamp like the doctors blind you with in the little rooms. They are a floor lamp with a stiff gooseneck up higher. They can be had at medical surplus and used medical equipment suppliers. Kind of handy around a sewing machine at times, and will really light up under a Cheyenne roll. If they are not shining directly at you, they are good.

[cybertracy]

Hi Shelly,

A couple months ago I began using the same setup as you, circle light/magnifyer, even though I had to contort my arms/tools/lamp to avoid striking the underside. It made the work so much clearer it was worth it (although I believed I've never had vision problems nor the need for glasses). What seemed to happen is after using the setup for several weeks I seemed to NEED the magnifyer to do smaller details work. It may just be my imagination, but now I even use it to trace and for the larger work as well.

Does anyone know if using magnification can train your eyes to not focus as well close up?

[ClayB]

Shelly,

I have been having the same problem you describe now for about a year. I have never worn glasses in my life and the eye doctor says most people would be thrilled to have my distance vision. But close up work is getting tougher all the time. Last year I got prescription reading glasses that I wear when I am carving and they help a lot. They are a real pain when I get up and move around though. I think now that I should have gotten bifocals, but he thought those would be tough for me to get used to at work walking through matts of rebar when we pour concrete or are hanging rafters on building. The other thing is that my eyes seem to be getting worse all the time. I can tell that the prescription isn't working all that great anymore (less than a year old). Now when I carve I am wearing a headband magnifier over the glasses and it makes a big difference. Here is one I have been using. It's a pretty cheap one and the light broke off after the second or third time I tried to adjust it, but I have used the magnifier quite a bit. I also have a swing arm light with a magnifier on it kind of like the light tube magnifier you mentioned. It's tough to use that when tooling, getting the right distance to see and not bang the magnifier with your maul. I've seen a few people use the magnifier and light in classes that Bruce gave the link to and they really liked it. They did suggest the plug in version so you weren't constantly changing batteries on the light. There is a chart on the website that shows working distance with different magnification levels, and the higher mag, the closer you have to be to your work. Four inches doesn't seem very practical. The cheap ones I use have four different magnifications and I use the weakest one. Just checked and it is 1.2X. With that, I can see pretty good at normal working distance. I tried the next one 1.8 and I had to lean a little closer to my work to see clearly. With the 3X one, I had to get right up to the 4 inches they say. It really brings the work up to you, but there is no way I could tool like that. It also lets you see things WAY too good anyway.

Not sure if any of that helps you out, but at least you know you aren't alone.

[CitizenKate]

Hi Shelly,

I have the same issue with close-up vision. I've always had better than 20/20 vision in both eyes, until I hit about 40 and started noticing I couldn't focus on the date display on my wristwatch. But I can still read a road sign more than a hundred yards away. My eye doctor explained it this way:

The tissue that makes up the lenses in our eyes is rather flexible, and when we look at objects at different distances, the lens changes shape to focus on what we are looking at. As we age, the tissue continues to grow new cells, and becomes more dense. That, in turn, makes the lenses less flexible, and less able to focus at as wide a range of distances. This happens to just about everyone eventually.

I also asked my optometrist the question asked earlier of, "Can we train our eyes to focus better?" She said maybe making your eye work harder might help strengthen the muscles that move the lenses, but because the problem is that the lenses are getting stiffer, it won't make much difference, and you'll still be straining all the time. The good news is, there is new medical technology coming that will, in effect, make it possible for us to trade in our old stiff lenses, for new flexible ones.

But that's not here yet, so in the mean time, I got a pair of no-line multi-focal lenses (or "progressive" lenses) which change gradually from one focal length to another as I move my head. I really like them, because they give me a very wide focus range without having to change head gear.

I use flood lights mounted at different angles to light my work space, to minimize shadows as much as possible. For really close-up work (like most of my swivel knife work), I use a Magnivisor similar to the one Clay mentioned. That has made a huge difference in being able to see exactly where my knife blade is.

Kate

[David]

It sounds like you all could benefit from a trip to the eye doc. I have a pair of glasses with a prescription for computer work.... the same could be done for leather work. All you need to know is how far the workpiece is from your eyes.

In the meantime, check out some of the lighted headband magnifiers at MicroMark

http://www.ares-server.com/Ares/Ares.asp

That should get you there....

If I messed up the link, go to www.MicroMark.com and type in magnifier in the search box.

Dave Theobald

[TroyWest]

I've been wearing the optivisor to tool with for several years, the one that Dave just showed.

I already had one as I use it for engraving silver.

[TroyWest]

One other thought Shelly is that most western bright cut engravers simply use the optivisors.

Gun engravers have gone to using a microscope system where you are literally looking through eye pieces like a microscope with great magnification looking down at an engraving block. Not at all practical for tooling, and they are pretty expensive, starting around $1250.00 and up from GRS.

I get along well with the optvisor for tooling because you can flip it up and down easily but I do hate to wear it.

[JRedding]

You guys are really encouraging.

[anne newkold]

One of the people in my Wednesday night class has one of these. http://www.joann.com/joann/catalog.jsp?CAT...p;source=search

it hangs around you neck and rest against your chest. tried it out and it was comfortable and seem to hang where I wanted it to and it is lighted also

[ETW Grumpy]

Tool and die makers where I work use something similar to these:

http://www.rehabmart.com/product/2032.htm

[hiloboy]

when i first started engraving. i use only my eyes.. if you don't need magnification don't start until you really need it. don't do what i did..i first worked with reading glass then wanted more power went to a optvisor. then reading glasses with optvisor.. and now most of my work is done under a microscope.. just to see what i use to see with only my eyes before(old age part of it not takeing care of my eye big part of it) the thing to look at before magnification is your lighting get the best you can..

Edited July 29, 2008 by hiloboy

[Jordan]

First sign I know my glucose is off is blurry vision. I have worn hi index progressive bifocals for years. Best things I have found is natural light from a large window and task lighting from above and slightly behind. Ahh the wonders of age progression, wiser but blinder, a youngster at heart but physically a geezer The hot tub helps!

[Shelly]

First sign I know my glucose is off is blurry vision. I have worn hi index progressive bifocals for years. Best things I have found is natural light from a large window and task lighting from above and slightly behind. Ahh the wonders of age progression, wiser but blinder, a youngster at heart but physically a geezer The hot tub helps!

Well, I don't have any glucose problems (yet), and I do wear Progressive bifocals - I am considering just having the 'reading distance' shortened to be more 'user friendly' for my work...funny thing is, now that I need a new prescription, I see the computer screen best by just taking the glasses off entirely - I find myself looking over the top of them to see the screen clearly! But, when I'm up close to a cantle binder, and sewing, to look under the binder is a royal pain in the -ss!! Can't see at all at that distance! I first noticed this at 39 - would be sitting in my chair, braiding, which I have always done at about chest level - with elbows bent, that's about where it has always just been comfortable, not because I couldn't see, and would look up at the television, and would have to squint a little until my eyes readjusted to the distance...and it was like that for awhile, having to wait for the eyes to readjust when looking farther away, especially noticeable when working on braiding in my lap, which was clear - have had 20/20 vision all my life, until about then - didn't notice my distance really going South until we would be in an area (I do about all of the driving), that I wasn't familiar with, and found myself not being able to make out street signs until they got about a trucklength away! (If I take the glasses off now, I can't read anything really clearly past the end of the quarterpanel, but could still drive)... Around home was different, since I just didn't have to read the street signs, already know where I'm going! So, I ended up with a prescription for distance - a few years ago, add in the 'near' part, and we are now in no line bifocals - I don't mind them too much, but do miss being able to see clearly to the outside edges of my vision - pain to have to always turn and look directly at something in order to see it...and my vision isn't that bad! I like wearing contacts when I ride, etc - I don't have to turn my head for things to be focused! But, absolutely no good to be able to read anything that is closer than the windshield of my Dodge - everything closer than that, find the readers!! Ever notice how many of those things we end up with, and still can't lay your hands on a pair when you need them??

when i first started engraving. i use only my eyes.. if you don't need magnification don't start until you really need it. don't do what i did..i first worked with reading glass then wanted more power went to a optvisor. then reading glasses with optvisor.. and now most of my work is done under a microscope.. just to see what i use to see with only my eyes before(old age part of it not takeing care of my eye big part of it) the thing to look at before magnification is your lighting get the best you can..

I don't think 'not taking care of your eyes' has anything to do with this deal - totally age-related! I am only 49, but feeling more and more that youth is really wasted on the young!!

Tool and die makers where I work use something similar to these:http://www.rehabmart.com/product/2032.htm

Thanks for the link - checked this out, not quite what I had in my mind...but appreciate the help and the recommendation!

One of the people in my Wednesday night class has one of these. http://www.joann.com/joann/catalog.jsp?CAT...p;source=search it hangs around you neck and rest against your chest. tried it out and it was comfortable and seem to hang where I wanted it to and it is lighted also

This I saw today in my errand rounds - I did give it alot of consideration, but finally decided that it won't work for me when I need to sew binders on the saddles, etc...thanks!

[Shelly]

You guys are really encouraging.

Can't wait to welcome you into 'our world'! No one said getting old was for the faint of heart, and it sure isn't for sissies!! (At least I have a good excuse when I show my reining horses - if I miss a marker when running to a sliding stop, I can just tell my trainer (husband), 'I just didn't see it!!')

[Shelly]

It sounds like you all could benefit from a trip to the eye doc. I have a pair of glasses with a prescription for computer work.... the same could be done for leather work. All you need to know is how far the workpiece is from your eyes.

In the meantime, check out some of the lighted headband magnifiers at MicroMark

http://www.ares-server.com/Ares/Ares.asp

That should get you there....

If I messed up the link, go to www.MicroMark.com and type in magnifier in the search box.

Dave Theobald

I agree - I'd already planned to take a measurement of how far my eyes are from my rock when carving/stamping, as well as another when sewing binders and horns, so I can give that info to my opthamologist when I go in next...and I do go every year, seems I think my vision is changing a bunch, and it's only a tiny bit - amazing to me how sensitive I am to these changes!! Thanks for the input and the link, I've checked these out as well...giving them consideration, as well as the Opti-visors...

[Shelly]

One other thought Shelly is that most western bright cut engravers simply use the optivisors.

Gun engravers have gone to using a microscope system where you are literally looking through eye pieces like a microscope with great magnification looking down at an engraving block. Not at all practical for tooling, and they are pretty expensive, starting around $1250.00 and up from GRS.

I get along well with the optvisor for tooling because you can flip it up and down easily but I do hate to wear it.

Last night I got a good dose of 'sticker shock' when I went on my web search for lighted magnifiers - doctors, dentists, etc, have some really fancy stuff, and I thought they were pretty pricey at $750 - $950, but figured the optics are/have to be 'over the top'...then I finally found a few gun engraver sites that sold good equipment, and it was a good thing I was already sitting down! I'd like to watch some of these guys do this kind of engraving under these microscopes...it would be interesting!

I did find an opti-visor with a dual led light setup that will add direct light to what you are looking at, so that may be what I'd be most interested in pursuing...and I agree that this is probably not going to be something I look forward to wearing! Thanks for the feedback, Troy - I'm enjoying all the replies this topic has generated!! Makes for some fun reading!! (Thankfully, I still see well enough for that!)

[Shelly]

Hi Shelly,

I have the same issue with close-up vision. I've always had better than 20/20 vision in both eyes, until I hit about 40 and started noticing I couldn't focus on the date display on my wristwatch. But I can still read a road sign more than a hundred yards away. My eye doctor explained it this way:

The tissue that makes up the lenses in our eyes is rather flexible, and when we look at objects at different distances, the lens changes shape to focus on what we are looking at. As we age, the tissue continues to grow new cells, and becomes more dense. That, in turn, makes the lenses less flexible, and less able to focus at as wide a range of distances. This happens to just about everyone eventually.

I also asked my optometrist the question asked earlier of, "Can we train our eyes to focus better?" She said maybe making your eye work harder might help strengthen the muscles that move the lenses, but because the problem is that the lenses are getting stiffer, it won't make much difference, and you'll still be straining all the time. The good news is, there is new medical technology coming that will, in effect, make it possible for us to trade in our old stiff lenses, for new flexible ones.

But that's not here yet, so in the mean time, I got a pair of no-line multi-focal lenses (or "progressive" lenses) which change gradually from one focal length to another as I move my head. I really like them, because they give me a very wide focus range without having to change head gear.

I use flood lights mounted at different angles to light my work space, to minimize shadows as much as possible. For really close-up work (like most of my swivel knife work), I use a Magnivisor similar to the one Clay mentioned. That has made a huge difference in being able to see exactly where my knife blade is.

Kate

Yep, I also noticed I couldn't see the blade well enough as well - especially for finish cuts...when I used the magnifier, I found I felt I was able to make some of the best I've done in awhile, and with a much steadier hand! Amazing what can happen when you can actually see it while you're doing it!! Looks like a Magnivisor is getting the most votes, so will probably end up with one of these...Thanks!!

[Shelly]

Shelly,

I am with you on the bifocal deal for sewing bindings and horns. They aren't designed to tip your head in that direction.

I use the magnifiers for some surgeries. I have used from the low end Optivisors up to good quality clip on lenses. The problem I have with them mostly is that they have a fixed focal distance. Some may be as fixed as 16-18". If you are outside of that, you are blind. I can see the area, and not be able to tell one tool in the using rack or one instrument from another. I look around or under the lens to find them, and then continue to look around the lens to use them. We gave a ride back fromKings reception at Sheridan to a guy from Kentucky. He was there selling kind of a decent little light and lens setup. His business is QED, Inc. They advertise in the LCSJ, and I just found a web address - www.qedisit.com.

For lights, if I need a focused area light, I have an exam room floor lamp like the doctors blind you with in the little rooms. They are a floor lamp with a stiff gooseneck up higher. They can be had at medical surplus and used medical equipment suppliers. Kind of handy around a sewing machine at times, and will really light up under a Cheyenne roll. If they are not shining directly at you, they are good.

Thanks, Bruce! You feel my pain...,or, I feel yours?? I checked out the link, and will probably print out the front-runners in this deal, and compare apples to apples, that sort of thing...I lean toward a visor with a light, that will illuminate whatever I am looking at. And thanks for the tip on using when sewing - I was more focused on tooling/hand sewing, but you are right! I have lights on both my Landis 3 and my Campbell, and find these are ok for now, but this magnivisor or Optivisor may be great there as well!

[CitizenKate]

Yeah, sorry... facts of life.

Kate

You guys are really encouraging.

[Shelly]

Hi Shelly,

A couple months ago I began using the same setup as you, circle light/magnifyer, even though I had to contort my arms/tools/lamp to avoid striking the underside. It made the work so much clearer it was worth it (although I believed I've never had vision problems nor the need for glasses). What seemed to happen is after using the setup for several weeks I seemed to NEED the magnifyer to do smaller details work. It may just be my imagination, but now I even use it to trace and for the larger work as well.

Does anyone know if using magnification can train your eyes to not focus as well close up?

My doctor said it does happen to a small extent - that your eyes will come to 'depend' on the help, but overall, not really much that you can do as the lenses in your eyes harden with age...I'm very much interested in what Kate mentioned about being able to 'replace' our old hard lenses with the 'softer' ones of our youth...wonder how long that will be?? I'm sure finding a workable solution is going to be the ticket for me, as it is for all of us in this boat. Once we find a tool that works well, I think we all get that feeling of 'why did I wait so long before trying this??'...

[Shelly]

Hi Shelly,

A couple months ago I began using the same setup as you, circle light/magnifyer, even though I had to contort my arms/tools/lamp to avoid striking the underside. It made the work so much clearer it was worth it (although I believed I've never had vision problems nor the need for glasses). What seemed to happen is after using the setup for several weeks I seemed to NEED the magnifyer to do smaller details work. It may just be my imagination, but now I even use it to trace and for the larger work as well.

Does anyone know if using magnification can train your eyes to not focus as well close up?

I think it sucks - it sneaks up on you when you're sleeping...I didn't think I would have to have glasses either, and get to be one of those lucky ones that you see that go their entire lives, into their 90's, that have sharp vision and a sharp mind...unfortunately, I've suddenly realized that my mind seems to have taken a vacation somewhere, and didn't invite me along!! Hope it gets back soon....

[Shelly]

Yeah, sorry... facts of life.

Kate

DITTO!!

[bruce johnson]

Shelly,

I wear the progressives too, and can never tilt my head just right handsewing anything. I used to make fun of mall-walkers and people who looked over their glasses. I don't do the Sears to Penneys laps yet, but I look over the top of my glasses a lot. As far as magnifiers, I have used a few different surgical loupes that fit on glasses, and the flip-down that goes on a headband. I am with Troy. My favorite is still the Optivisor I have used for 25 years. It flips up or down with the back of your hand or arm, is tolerably comfortable, and the lenses are really pretty decent. Most affordable to try for sure. You can wear glasses under it if you need to. Like I said before, I usually flip it up to find the tool or instrument, and then forget to flip it down to use them. I tried a knockoff with a light source on either side, didn't like it. Enough spread to have two lit areas on either side of where you really need it.

[Shelly]

Shelly,

I wear the progressives too, and can never tilt my head just right handsewing anything. I used to make fun of mall-walkers and people who looked over their glasses. I don't do the Sears to Penneys laps yet, but I look over the top of my glasses a lot. As far as magnifiers, I have used a few different surgical loupes that fit on glasses, and the flip-down that goes on a headband. I am with Troy. My favorite is still the Optivisor I have used for 25 years. It flips up or down with the back of your hand or arm, is tolerably comfortable, and the lenses are really pretty decent. Most affordable to try for sure. You can wear glasses under it if you need to. Like I said before, I usually flip it up to find the tool or instrument, and then forget to flip it down to use them. I tried a knockoff with a light source on either side, didn't like it. Enough spread to have two lit areas on either side of where you really need it.

The Optivisor now has an addon light (Quasar Lighting System), for 22.50 - can add the binocular magnifier for another 35.10, each lens plate runs 24.35...www.all-spec.com sells Aven, Head Band Magnifier with Light, AV26415 - $41.58...has a 3 lens system and produces 4 magnifications. Bausch & Lomb Magna Visor Loupe comes with 3 lenses, no light, for 6", 8", and 12" distances, #81-42-00, didn't get the price in the printout...JSP Optical Super-Visor - $10.00, with 4 different mags ranging from 1.8X - 4.8X...Optical Supervisor II - Rosenthal - www.rjsintl.com - 4 separate lenses - from 4" to 20" and can be combined to 12 combinations, comes with a light - $18.00...then lastly, www.widgetsupply.com, SFB1 - (comes in different colors) - OptiSight - 3 lens plates, 1.75X at 14", 2X at 10", 2.5X at 8" - no light, and a simple headband, without the velcro on the back...

I'm narrowing down to these - Optical SuperVisor II, the Aven (headband looks like it may be the most comfortable), and the OptiVisor, with the lighting and an optional attachment loupe. This one has LED lights (6), that are arranged around the entire lens...might take a look for me and see which would interest you most if you were looking for one for yourself, considering that you already use the Optivisor, and know how it feels, etc. You may be able to tell me more than I can tell about reading specs and various info on these three products...would certainly help me in my decision as to which to order...do I go with the $18.00 special, or the Optivisor, with all the add-ons, for $150+? The Aven then looks pretty decent at $41.58...