Pricing Holsters

[Dwight]

It's not lumpy. Mine might have been a touch heavy on the oil this time, it's in the realm of Vaseline for consistency. I'll probably add some paraffin wax next time to give it a bit more body. Seems to still work just fine. Just a bit more messy this go around. FWIW, the beeswax is from a NEW (very important) toilet seat ring. Just don't tell anyone. lol

Chiefjason, . . . next time you make a batch, . . . get some real beeswax, . . .

The toilet seat ring is only partially beeswax, . . . and the rest of the ingredients are very probably some sort of polar bear grease or some similar goo. The recipe for the beeswax / neatsfoot oil combo requires virgin beeswax which is impossible to use for a toilet ring in its true state.

Using only beeswax and neatsfoot oil, . . . it always comes out just a bit harder than Kiwi shoe polish, . . . but still a firm paste that has no lumps or bumps. Your batch that is thin like vaseline is because of the "extra" ingredient you got in the wax ring.

May God bless,

Dwight

[charlescrawford]

Interesting might have to give that a try. I have a ton of bees wax because that's what I was (past tense) using for burnishing. So after I dye my holsters then I do my 50/50 split resolene/h20 right? My Tandy order came in yesterday so I am wondering do you apply it with a sponge or dauber?

[mlapaglia]

For the Resolene? I use a 1 inch foam brush. As long as its 50/50 im not sure it really matters Straight Resolene is a pain to apply. Lots of bubbles and streaks. Try what ever you have on a scrap piece and see what looks good. 2 thin coats area better than 1 thick coat.

[humperdingle]

I'm intrigued by this 'toilet ring'

[charlescrawford]

Yes I ment the resolene. Cool when I do it I will do 2 thin coats. Also interested in trying mop-n-glo lol

[J Hayes]

I like the Mop n glo myself, 50/50 kept in an ice cream pail, one quick dunk and hang to dry, easy as it gets.

[humperdingle]

I just tried the 50/50 neatsfoot and beeswax mix... Melted nicely in the microwave.

Tried it on a piece of scrap belly and wasn't too impressed until I put the heat gun over it as suggested... Wow... Really brings out all of the natural leather grain. I poured the mixture into long silicone icecube trays to set so it'll be easier to use.

[chiefjason]

Chiefjason, . . . next time you make a batch, . . . get some real beeswax, . . .

Dwight

Dwight, thanks. I'll give that a shot too. The first one went well, but I had some left and the second batch was not quite the same. Still works well though. But a firmer past would be easier to apply and you don't get much extra on the leather. It's not the first time I've been told to quit being a cheapskate and buy the real thing. lol

I just tried the 50/50 neatsfoot and beeswax mix... Melted nicely in the microwave.

Tried it on a piece of scrap belly and wasn't too impressed until I put the heat gun over it as suggested... Wow... Really brings out all of the natural leather grain. I poured the mixture into long silicone icecube trays to set so it'll be easier to use.

I use a small crock pot to melt them together. I do a very cool brown dye on a lot of holsters. It really deepens that dye nicely and improves the look of it. The other's it's hard to tell a difference other than I really like the end result better.

[katsass]

Charles, something has continually bugged me about your holster design, and I think I finally figured it out. (being old I guess - things seem to take a while to ease into my consciousness) After I took a good long look at your rig, I think that you have tried to modify a revolver holster pattern into a holster for an auto pistol. I may be wrong, but I don't think so. Also, you are using an old Stohlman carving pattern that is adaptable to a pot-load of wheelgun holsters, but not so much for an autopistol rig. JMHO. Mike

Edited October 25, 2013 by katsass

[charlescrawford]

Charles, something has continually bugged me about your holster design, and I think I finally figured it out. (being old I guess - things seem to take a while to ease into my consciousness) After I took a good long look at your rig, I think that you have tried to modify a revolver holster pattern into a holster for an auto pistol. I may be wrong, but I don't think so. Also, you are using an old Stohlman carving pattern that is adaptable to a pot-load of wheelgun holsters, but not so much for an autopistol rig. JMHO. Mike

Mike - Yes and no is the short answer. It is one of the patterns in the Holster book by Stohlman. I have found that for me anyway you have to expand his patterns by 1/4" sometimes even more. The guy this was for wanted 2 separate belt loops options in different orientations to except a 1 1/2" western belts. So to accommodate all of this I had to make some adjustments here and there. The pattern I used was originally for a Colt 1911 Gov Issue which is the 5" rather then the normal 4". So you are totally correct I did have to expand the pattern slightly.

Now the pattern pack from Tandy the 4418 has like 16 different patterns. Most are fold over western style but each one pattern list what specific guns its for which is good. Most I think are older ones. There are a couple patterns for SW M&P but its very similar fold over patterns for both autos and revolvers From what I can tell. Do you By any chance have this pack? I think I got it leathercraft library. Your comment just brought this to mind.

[katsass]

Charles, I'm afraid that the only books no leather work I have are "Packing Iron" and "How to Make Holsters" I have no patterns or pattern packs -- I bought Stohlman's book way back in the early '60s, subsequently I was taught how to stitch, (properly, according to the old WWI cavalry soldier that taught me)and how to draw my own patterns. I still draw a separate pattern for each client and/or each firearm he wants a holster for, even if they are the same model. Sometimes I do kick myself, but I just toss them after I complete a rig. I just do not want to rig up an alphabetical file and mess with it for all the patterns that there would/could have been over the years. Mike

Edited October 25, 2013 by katsass

[Red Cent]

Hey Charles, just FYI. The "full" size (Colt) 1911 has a 5" barrel. The Commander has a 4 1/2" barrel and the Officer's model has a 3 1/2" barrel. The full size is much more prevalant.

[charlescrawford]

Charles, I'm afraid that the only books no leather work I have are "Packing Iron" and "How to Make Holsters" I have no patterns or pattern packs -- I bought Stohlman's book way back in the early '60s, subsequently I was taught how to stitch, (properly, according to the old WWI cavalry soldier that taught me)and how to draw my own patterns. I still draw a separate pattern for each client and/or each firearm he wants a holster for, even if they are the same model. Sometimes I do kick myself, but I just toss them after I complete a rig. I just do not want to rig up an alphabetical file and mess with it for all the patterns that there would/could have been over the years. Mike

Mike I might have to look more closely on youtube on how to do just that. Some of what throws me about doing what you do is doing avengers. I have a Adams leatherworking pattern for a M&P 9/40 that I can sometimes jerry rig to fit like Glock 22 stuff thats close size wise.

Hey Charles, just FYI. The "full" size (Colt) 1911 has a 5" barrel. The Commander has a 4 1/2" barrel and the Officer's model has a 3 1/2" barrel. The full size is much more prevalant.

Ya red thats what I am finding out. That's my next BG purchase.

[katsass]

Charles, hereis the result of the very first avenger style holster pattern I drew. Go for making your own - just takes a bit of effort. Mike

[charlescrawford]

Charles, hereis the result of the very first avenger style holster pattern I drew. Go for making your own - just takes a bit of effort. Mike

Mike You seem like a good one to ask this to. What makes an avenger an avenger holster? Is it the narrow height? I always use to think it was the large tooled reinforcement piece but yours throws everything I thought I knew from my adams patterns right on its proverbial arse....lol So now what I am starting to learn please correct me I am wrong here avenger patterns are low height holsters that technically the reinforcement piece can be of any size and can or can not have tooling done and the main frame of the holsters are fold over. Is this correct?

[camano ridge]

Charles, I know you were looking for a response From Mike, however since I stumbled across this first I will tell you what I know and Mike can had his information in. The Avenger style is believed to have begun with the Milt Sparks 55BN. It became popular style and many major manufactures began making them they became more of a style in vogue when Bianchi in conjunction with input from Col. Charles Askins began to produce one with a fairly extreme FBI cant this style is comonly refered to as the Askins Avenger. The things that make it an Avenger Style are that it is a fold over with a trailing wing to the rear that has a belt slot and there is a belt loop on the back of the holster giving two atachment points. The re enforcement piece is utilitarian in that it is meant to help keep the mouth of the holster open for reholstering. The re enforcement piece can be decorative but that is not a requirement to make the holster an Avenger. If you google avenger holster you will find many examples the thing they all have in common is the foldover with the trailing wing belt slot and the belt loop attached to the back of the holster body.

Edited October 26, 2013 by camano ridge

[SooperJake]

Kat,

What I have been using is the waxed nylon thread. I saddle stitch most of my projects. Should I not be using the waxed thread? The sealer I use is probably giving the "plastic" look. I use Tandy's Super Sheen and usually do 2 coats. All of my dyes are the Tandy Eco Flo dyes. I know I am probably going to catch holy hell for that but my reason is simple I have to watch what products I use and what fumes these products. I hit the health lottery not only do juggle issues with the MS but severe asthma as well. Eco Flo doesn't send me into an attack. The other reason is cost it's cheap and when you're on a limited income cost comes into play. So if there are things I need to change let me know I am willing to try new things I just have to stay within parameters. My leather shop if you will is the upstairs landing. Don't have a garage to work from like a lot of guys do as well.

I've had decent results with Eco Flo " PRO" as long as I pretreat the leather with Bick 4 conditioner, wait 10 minutes for the conditioner to soak in, then apply the Eco Flo with a sponge just barely wetted. I also blot off the sponge on paper towel to remove excess material. The leather doesn't absorb water as easy after, so for wet forming you need to soak it more.

[katsass]

Charles, camano ridge has said it perfectly. It's just your basic folded holster, with the addition of a wing with belt slot, plus a stitched-on belt loop on the back of the holster. It is a very concealable holster to wear, They posses the ability to keep the front of the holster tight to the body, arguably better that most other styles The reinforcement is rather redundant IMO, but it now has morphed into an (almost) mandatory palate for damned near any form of decoration you can come up with. I personally believe that the reinforcement was the result of Milt saying to himself, "well, after the belt loop is stitched on, how do I make the damned thing look decent, and the belt loop not being just an afterthought?" I am quite sure that Milt and those that followed after, (Bianchi, etc.) were not at all worried about the collapse of the mouth of their holsters, after all, they had been making damned good holsters for years without the problem OR even the thought reinforcement. The only place that I can think of that the problem with the mouth of the holster actually collapsing, is on an IWB rig. As far as that goes, I have some personal opinions on that style, which others may feel a point to argue over. I think I do have a bit of an edge on many folks on here, in that I have been able to watch the evolution of holster design(s) since the 1950s. I've seen 'em come -- and go, and in my opinion, I'll mostly stay with the old traditional designs - with slight modifications here and there. Mike

Edited October 26, 2013 by katsass

[charlescrawford]

Ok this is making a lot more sense now. Thanks to both of you for explain this out. Thing are a heck of a lot clearer now.

[leatherjunkie]

everyone gave you some great information. but wondering why no one mentioned evoo(extra virgin olive oil) as a finish oil?

also there are natural dyes you can make for dying your projects. for example you can use used coffee grounds, walnut hulls and rusty water for old time dyes.

the vinger black dye may not work for you due to the smell of vinger.

i also have great results using leather balm with atom wax as a finish. you can get it from tandy.

Wyosheen is the new name of Neat Lac since tandy does not carry it any more.

it has a very harsh smell but it works real good as a finish.

the following link is to cas city that has a lot of information on making old time dyes in your house:

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,11991.0.html

[J Hayes]

Charles you can get yourself a good 3M paint respirator for around $30-$40 that may allow you to use anything smelly and not affect your breathing. It could very well open up airbrushing and other tjings to you as well.

[camano ridge]

The problem with using cartridge filter masks or APRs is that it may cause other problems for people with asthma as you have to work harder to breath through a filter you are drawing the air through the filter cartridges, some people with respiratory conditions can become fatiqued more easly. The powered air purifying respirators work pretty well for people with asthma and other respiratory conditions however they are more expensive.

[J Hayes]

Ah. I never thought about the added resistance, I wear one daily and just never noticed, but I don't have breathing issues. Thanks for pointing that out.

[camano ridge]

Not a problem, I wore breathing aparatus for thirty years and have taught and still teach classes on the various types of breathing aparatus and their limitations. SOrry for straying from original post.

[charlescrawford]

It is something to definitely look into. To be honest I never even thought about this avenue. When I use to sharpen skates I would wear one years ago and I always felt a bit claustrofobic but I would imagine things have improved since then. I know tomorrow I see a ENT to see why I am having chronic sinus infections that are are moving into my airways. So while y'all are tooling away I get the "joy" of having my sinuses scoped..... Yea me lol