How Do Leather Masters Sew 12, 13 Spi. Any One Here Can Achieve This?

[DavidL]

Im only curious as to how a hand stitcher can stitch 13 spi, thinner than some machine stitches. Never mind the skill but even to get an awl to that size and then stitch that fine for over 20 - 30 minutes in some cases is incredible. I stitch 9 spi, and could do 10 spi which is a stretch for me. Are there any of these hand stitchers on these forums, id like to learn how its done.

[WyomingSlick]

It is done the same way as the larger stitches....just finer tools. Even though you might think it would be more time consuming, it usually is not because you are dealing with thinner leathers and smaller articles such as a watchband. Less time to poke the holes. less time to put the needle through, and less thread to have to pull your shorter thread through. In fact, on some thin projects, the pricking iron will make the holes sufficiently so that you don't even need to use a stabbing awl for much of the run.

[fivewayswelshcobs]

Sewing English bridles at 12 spi is normal for me, 8 or10 spi is more common for manufacturing but I do work to 15 spi when needed- I have repaired tandem driving reins at 14 spi and they were not thin leather and very fine work in harness can be done at 17 spi. The only problem I have found was getting fine harness needles until I bought hundreds of John James number 5 needles off ebay as these are not normally made today which made fine stitching much easier although I gather Osbournes do a fine needle.

I think the belief that you need thick thread to hand stitch is part of the problem as this often makes the stitching look untidy and out of proportion with the spi, the main strength is from the hand stitching rather than machine stitching so for wallets etc they can be stitched with thread as fine as silk threads at a higher spi without losing strength and improving the look of the item.

[DavidL]

When sewing 9spi i always get blow out holes at the backside of the leather. I've put beeswax at the backside of the leather and have the awl stab through both the leather and beeswax and still there is a problem. Even my awl is very fine and sharp, 3mm at its thickest. How far do you stab the awl through the leather - just the tip or the whole way through? Would you say .63mm thread is good for 9spi? Trying to sell some card wallets at 9 spi but they still don't look 100 percent perfect because the backside is horrendous at times.

Sewing English bridles at 12 spi is normal for me, 8 or10 spi is more common for manufacturing but I do work to 15 spi when needed- I have repaired tandem driving reins at 14 spi and they were not thin leather and very fine work in harness can be done at 17 spi. The only problem I have found was getting fine harness needles until I bought hundreds of John James number 5 needles off ebay as these are not normally made today which made fine stitching much easier although I gather Osbournes do a fine needle.

I think the belief that you need thick thread to hand stitch is part of the problem as this often makes the stitching look untidy and out of proportion with the spi, the main strength is from the hand stitching rather than machine stitching so for wallets etc they can be stitched with thread as fine as silk threads at a higher spi without losing strength and improving the look of the item.

It is done the same way as the larger stitches....just finer tools. Even though you might think it would be more time consuming, it usually is not because you are dealing with thinner leathers and smaller articles such as a watchband. Less time to poke the holes. less time to put the needle through, and less thread to have to pull your shorter thread through. In fact, on some thin projects, the pricking iron will make the holes sufficiently so that you don't even need to use a stabbing awl for much of the run.

makes sense to me on paper. I asked the question because i stitch 7 spi and 9. 7 spi stitching for me is 1.5times faster. Each stitch takes 2-3secs for both spi so assume that it would take a long time at higher. Mabye one day i will attempt 12-13 spi.

[Matt T]

David, I've been having the same problems with the backside of the stitching. I recently discovered that there are pricking irons that are inversed, with the teeth going a different direction. With this, you can prick on the back side of thicker leather to match up with the other side. I have some on order from fineleatherworking.com

[DavidL]

Ouch your wallets going to feel that. I've considered that option and i came up with a similar solution, a gomph #9 overstitch wheel and run it on the backside. The problem was my pulling strength and i stabbed too far into the leather, i use just the first 1 cm of the awl, and watch it so it goes through properly. The thread is pulled in a slow manner, never pulling too fast and i watch the thread pull into the leather and once it hardly digs into the leather i move onto the next stitch. This is how I do it and may not be the traditional way but works well for me. Anyone with a different technique please do share.

[WyomingSlick]

Back when I first tried fine stitching, I couldn't find any fine needles to use since I live in the boondocks of Wyoming and this was long before the internet came along, at least the internet as we enjoy it nowadays. Being as my mom was an expert seamstress, I was able to get some needles from her which had suitable eyes.....so all I had to do was break off the sharp points, grind them a little, and smooth them with x-fine emery cloth to obtain some good hand stitching needles for fine work. I know I still have some of them because I have since only bought one packet of fine needles one time in Salt Lake City.

I made a pair of ladies gloves out of white doeskin ONE TIME !...... and I will never willingly do that again. The store-bought ones are worth every penny as far as I am concerned ! LOL

[DavidL]

anyone know how to keep the backside line straight. Always a few stitches unaligned and ruins the line of stitching

[Matt T]

You either need to punch through all the way with the iron, consistently punch straight through with the awl, or use the inverse irons.

Edited April 12, 2014 by Matt T

[WyomingSlick]

When stitching you should have a groove, or at least a line on the backside for a guide. As you push your awl through, you watch for the emergance of the awl on the backside, and adjust accordingly to keep the backside on track by moving your stabbing hand up or down as needed. If you are having trouble making the back side even in stitch length, carefully stab the first three holes, and the using the same stitch marker, mark the back side the same as the front, and as before guide your awl by looking for the emergance of the point on the backside.

[DavidL]

tried this today without a guide on the backside (i purchased a 9spi overstitch for the backside holes) and got consistent results for once. Funny enough the only thing i did different was not focus on stitching and let myself stitch without thinking of anything. After a minute its almost like it is automatic and your not doing any work (awesome!). For anyone that reached a barrier where you have the technique and practice down but a few stitches look off try not to pressure yourself because it makes your body subconsciously pull tighter or looser. people who play basketball currently or when they were younger they know that when taking a shot you never think about how much force you need from you legs and your body and arms, it just comes naturally, once you over think you almost always miss.