Heading To Tandy Tomorrow - But Need Advise. Want To Make Carved Collars.

[meagain]

Hi. Total newbie here. I'm interested in making leather collars - for myself and friends. Around 2 inches wide. They will me limited slip collars. No sewing. Hoping to do Sheridan-ish - florals, scrolls, and basic stuff to start. Hardware to be held by rivets of some sort. I also hope to add swarovski crystals with rim sets unless I can find them ready to go.

I think I'm going to get a Barry King swivel knife and maul (16oz?) but am lost on the tools.

And the size of them for a 2" wide design. I'm also worried a bit about buying bad tools yet don't want to spend $25-30 a pop for each. I'm hoping to get by with maybe 6 tried and true tools for now. Go-to tools.

Tomorrow I plan to go to Tandy and buy scrap, and I'm not sure what else. Are there any tools at Tandy that are ok or should I search for Vintage types? My fear is spending a ton of cash on stuff I won't be happy with when I get better and playing the upgrade game.

Taking advise on a nice go-to set of tools that are the gold standard. Thanks much!

[LTC]

You get what you pay for. If you want good quality tools, they ARE going to cost around $25 or more unless you get the imported trash tandy sells. Before anyone tries to correct me, I'm talking about edge bevelers and tools like that.

If you get the junk tandy sells, you're going to eventually end up replacing them with good quality tools and no one will buy that tandy stuff off of you.

But if you're just doing this as a hobby and are not a perfectionist like I am, who knows. Maybe the tandy stuff will be good enough for what you want to do.

[Bob Blea]

If you are already planning on a purchase from Barry King, I would recommend getting some of his bevelers. They work well and you will never need to replace them. The pro series tools at Tandy I am told are comparable (never tried them myself) but I think for the price Barry King has them beat.

[papaw]

Most of tandys is junk or scrap buy once and be done. It is maybe a good place to buy practice pieces but even that may not give you a good sense of what good leather will be to carve or stamp, I've learned the hard way don't wish to see others doing it that way. Just my .02

[CTaylorJr]

BK tools are hard to beat, however, if this is your first venture into leather working, I'd get a starter set of the Tandy stamps, a Tandy backgrounder, and the BK swivel knife. The starter set of stamps will get you going and let you know if you'll like this hobby (madness?).

Before trying to make your first collar, cut some scrap pieces into 2" strips and practice your casing, carving, and tooling. That would also be a good time to practice your finish work as well.

Once you decide to get serious about leather work, then you can begin to amass your tools one or a few at a time. As I began selling pieces of my work, I would take 50% of my gains and apply it toward tool upgrades or tool needs. If you plan to make a lot of collars, I highly suggest a quality strap cutter as well.

Fill in your information about location and such and someone local to you may be able to provide a bit of mentoring or assistance as well.

[Red Cent]

Research, research, research, ................................

[silverwingit]

+1 for anything Barry King.

You might be interested to know that Barry has a recommended size list in which he lists "starter" sets for different sized work. He offers these sets for $400, and they are a $480 value. You would never have to replace these quality stainless steel carving tools.

http://barrykingtools.com/sizelist.htm

Thanks,

Michelle

[Jimbob]

Well, seems you are a beginner....dont even know if you like it and not shure what to do....guess what....thats how I started 30 years ago....( still dont know what I am doing...according to my wife...hohoo..)

Tandy has cheap stuff and no way it is usable to do pro stuff...BUT the only place to buy leather tools for small amount of money...that one said, I cant afford to spend 25 dollar on a single beveler so I buy what I can and make it work for me.....think about making your own stamping and beveler tools if your handy with metal !!

You need basic stuff like a rawhide mallet, a good swivel knife BArry King is GOOD ( keep it sharp and learn how to sharpening it...) , small and medium beveler, a modeling tool and some border stamps to do amazingly lots of stuff...buy lesser and do more...then learn and buy more educated...Sheridian is a hole different world....stay with basic floral designs and have fun....look for some hardware at other places too, like Ohio travelbag company, buy leather by the full side and cut your own straps and as said here...research, research and research some more....thats it...you good to go !!

Ohhhh and always practice, practice, practice and....well you get the idea...hahaha

James

[meagain]

Thanks guys! Well I did make that trip to Tandy and felt compelled to buy their Pro Swivel knife which was on sale for $54.99. I wanted a smaller one but ended up with this. The bigger diameter with 3/8" blade. Yes I bought some tools and scrap leather.

Well - I've watched a ton of Youtubes and I'm not getting the swivel knife results I want. The videos I've seen - notably Bruce Cheaney - show the blade flowing like butter and the blade making a thick or wider cut than I'm getting. I.e.; My lines are thin - more like Exacto blade/razor and just - pissy. The lines I see on Youtube are wide and pretty/interesting in themselves.

Detail lines I'm trying to make are wiry thin and 'nothing'. So I'm not sure what I'm doing here but something's not right I think. Maybe I should return it.

[camano ridge]

Ok, several thing could be the reason or reasons you are not getting the results you want. THe first one it is a Tandy knife, so did you sharpen and or hone the blade? I can almost quarantee it is not as sharp as it should be. If you don't have the eqipment ot the knowledge to sharpen the blade. Call your Tandy store speak with the manager and see if they will sharpen it for you since you just boght it. I know the manager at my local store will. Next are you casing your leather before your trying to cut or are you cutting dry? By casing i don't mean just quickly wiping a wet sponge over the face of the leather. What style of blade did you get? I think the tandy library has some tip sheets on using the swivel knife, you also should be able to find some tutorials on using the swivel knife. Practice, practice, practice, there is a learning curve with the swivel knife. Also post a picture of some of your cuts we may be able to give you soem help.

[meagain]

No I didn't sharpen/hone the blade. Was figuring for $55 bucks (on sale from $70) it would be good enough initially out of the box I did practice with wetting the leather and learned too wet is a very bad thing! I tried with different degrees of damp and I 'think' I was in the proper realm. It seemed 'smooth' flowing but just not wide enough or 'pretty'?

If you all think the BK knife/blade is better - I'll return this one and get that.

[barehandcustoms]

I wouldn't use rivets to secure the hardware for those dog collars unless its for a small dog. Large dogs are very rough on their collars overtime and rivets tend to bust when they get yanked on a lot. I would use Chicago Screws to secure all the hardware.

[meagain]

They won't be daily 24/7 wearing collars - just for walking/visiting (being with owner). Will be for Sighthounds - around 40-60 pounds. They have long skinny necks so they wear wide collars and are pretty calm/docile types. Was thinking at least 3 rivets to secure 2 D-rings as the only hardware. Well - I'll look into it but I'm not at that point yet. First need the right tools.

Maybe I should just spring for one of the BK 'kits' and be done with it. Hopefully at most get 1-2 more tools like the pebble backgrounder. IF I go crazy and buy that - I assume the Sm-Med 'kit' the way to go?

[papaw]

One other thing do you have the blade all the way in the leather or are you just cutting on the back edge of the blade? The other thing is are you cutting deep enough?

[Northmount]

Sharpen the blade.

There are lots of posts about sharpening swivel knives here and the amount of difference it makes to ease of cutting. You can always buy additional blades later from whomever you want; different widths, angled. But you really need to learn to sharpen and hone and strop your blade, regardless of the manufacturer. Yes some do come sharp, and some stay sharp longer, but not forever. If the rest of the knife fits your hand and is comfortable, doesn't cut into your finger, then it is good and no need to return it.

Tom

[meagain]

Yes I need to get the stuff to hone the blade but I think this barrel diameter (1/2") is too big for my smaller female hands. I've not used it much and my gut is telling me to get a 3/8" from BK. Assuming I do that - I'm still conflicted on blade 'thickness'.

For decorative cuts - wouldn't one want a thicker blade? Or - would anyone know the difference between the Craftool Pro 3/8" blade thickness vs. the thick or thin Barry King blades so I can compare? This is my last sticking point. And yes, I'm going to buy the 'kit' from BK (sm-med toolset). I have no doubt I'll get into this in a serious way at this point.

[papaw]

I always tell people that are on the fence so to speak call and talk to Barry about what you wish to carve. just my .02

[meagain]

OK - I did. He says most people get the thin blade. Hopefully we were on the same page re thin vs. thick blade and not glad width I was a bit surprised by this and asked 'wouldn't the thicker blade produce nice decorative cuts vs. the smaller?' I don't recall what he said about that.

I guess I want to rely on the knife alone for some decorative lines that won't be beveled. He wasn't sure how wide the blade is that I tried (craftool pro 3/8") so I can't really compare. So I'm still a tad lost and perhaps I should get 2 blades.

There isn't much talk on here re the 2 blade thicknesses he sells and I can't find any comparison of the basic lines they make. IDK

[camano ridge]

Go with one blade for now you can always get the thicker one later if you need to. You will find that technique can help you get different width cuts with the same blade. If you need to widen a cut use, the pointy tip of a modeling tool.

[silverwingit]

Meagain - I have a bit of a different idea for you to consider regarding swivel knives and blades.

You are concerned about the diameter of the barrel and the differences between blades. I think that out of inexperience you are over analyzing.

Here's something that no one has yet mentioned. A given swivel knife barrel size is chosen according to more than how comfortable it is holding it in your hand. The different barrel sizes have different uses. A large barrel diameter is best for long, more or less straight cuts. This is because larger diameter barrels are less sensitive to small twists between your fingers and hence it is more difficult to make rapid changes in the angle of their path, as one must roll the barrel the circumference of the barrel to execute a 360 degree turn. Smaller barrels require less of a twist between your fingers to undergo the same angular change. In practical terms, this means as I said that larger diameter barrels are best for long, relatively straight cuts, where smaller diameter barrels are best for shorter cuts that undergo quick changes in the angle of their path. As examples, I use my 1/2" barrel for straight cuts, say at the borders of a belt, and my 3/8" barrel for decorative cuts that have that quick 180 degree "fish hook" turn. You can also experiment with the different width blades and see the difference in performance between thin and thick, straight and angled blades.

The bottom line: BK swivel knives are inexpensive and so are BK swivel knife blades. You are dropping $400 on carving tools. Why not get several knives and blades? You will experience the effects of barrel size for yourself and be able to make intelligent decisions about which to use for a given cut (cuts). After all, the quality of your carving starts with and is largely dependent on good swivel knife cuts.

You will end up having separate barrels for each of the blades you like to use frequently so that you don't have to change blades constantly.

One last note. Many experienced leather carvers recommend learning to use a wide blade first, even a 1/2" one. One can pick up bad habits using a narrow straight or especially a narrow, slanted blade. In learning to use a wider, straight blade, you develop good habits that will reap benefits down stream.

At least that's the way I see it.

Michelle

[meagain]

OK - So I got the BK swivel knife in 3/8 barrel and 1/4" blade. The blade IS thinner than the 1/2" Craftool Pro 3/8" blade I have. So for various cuts like decorative - the Craftool Pro seems to make a prettier wider cut.

They are both so different. Craftool Pro is heavier for sure and I almost think that benefits me sometimes. So I'm keeping both swivel knives. I'm 'fairly' happy with what I'm able to do at this stage tho my decorative cuts need improving and it seems the leather has to be in some perfect sweet spot to get 'pretty'.

My current main issue (besides dye/paint hell) - is beveling. I've learned if my cut isn't great due to leather being too wet, etc. - the beveler doesn't like to get inside the cut well or will push the inside. Proper casing I guess.
But - I think I might suck at beveling in that I'm still hitting, moving, hitting. Then going back to clean up. When I try to run it down the line - tap tap tap - it just doesn't work. Like the leather is sticking. Maybe some of it is the quality of the leather as I'm still working on scrap and now 2" wide precut strips from Springfield. I have a giant piece of Hermann Oak that I'm reserving till I go through my 2" wide strip.

In the mean time - I'm wondering if there's any way around the bevel tool 'sticking' (for lack of a better word) to the leather. I'd like for it to slide/glide a little. Not sure if it's possible. Would this Lexol product help? I've read dish soap? I only have Dawn so IDK if that would work. Maybe these things would help swivel knife and beveling.