How To Best Apply Neatsfoot Oil?

[MerlB]

Hi all,

I am still fairly new to leather craft, so please excuse if this sounds like a dumb question to you...

I recently bought a big can of Fiebing's Neatsfoot oil, as I have read in many posts, that people like to apply this stuff for various reasons. My main goal by using the oil would be to get the leather soft and flexible again as dying with Fiebing's tends to stiffen the leather quite a bit (I only use Fiebings Professional Oil Dye as thats pretty much what you can get at affordable prices here in Germany so dont bother recommending other dyes ).

The big can comes with a built in brush, so my first attempts were applying the oil with this brush. However I ended up with my leather being soaked in oil in some areas and not enough oil in others and it is pretty uneven all in all.

Instead of wasting a lot of time and material I thought I'll better ask here for some advise in using neatsfoot oil.

So far I have applied the oil first and dyed afterwards, but while searching the forum for similar threads I figured that many only apply the oil after dying.

So, question: how do you apply neatsfoot oil to get an even coverage and do you apply the oil first and dye afterwards or better the other way round?

Thanks a lot!

Cheers,

Nils

Edited July 18, 2014 by MerlB

[barehandcustoms]

I buy those huge sponges from the hardware store and cut them into small sizes.I will reuse the same oil sponge numerous times to apply my finish until it gets discolored. I keep one next to each type of oil finish and they work great. I tried several other methods before settling into using a soft sponge. It is just what works best for me.

Plus the oil will stay in the sponge for days so you aren't wasting oil.

I have always dyed first and then applied oil afterwards. I generally let the leather dry out overnight after I wet mold and then dye the next day. A few hours after I have dyed a piece then I will apply a heavy coat of oil. I also apply one more thin coat before I ship an item.

I always do the oil dye first because the oil finishes tends to prevent the oil dye from soaking deep into the leather. I expect the product to be oiled throughout its lifetime but I doubt it will ever get dye applied to it again. So I want the dye to penetrate as deep as possible when I apply it.

Edited July 18, 2014 by barehandcustoms

[JoeSnuffie]

I do the same thing barehandcustoms does with sponges. You pay a couple dollars for a large sponge and turn it onto a bag full of tiny sponges. I try to cut them into about 1x1x2 inch pieces.

[camano ridge]

I dye first then apply neatsfoot oil. The dye as you stated will dry the leather it draws out some of the nutrients. THe idea with the oil is put soe back into the leather. I do finger tip applications. if you do get blochiness wait a couple of days. It takes time for the oil to migrate through the leather, if you get a lot in one area it will take longer for it to even out.

If you do oil first give at least 24 hour for the oil to migrate before dying.

Edited July 18, 2014 by camano ridge

[MerlB]

Thanks guys!

[Bob Blea]

I warm up my Neatsfoot oil prior to applying it (was a suggestion from a saddle maker) as it supposedly makes it penetrate more evenly. I use either a piece of sheep skin or a cotton ball depending on what is convenient. I don't usually dye my pieces so I oil after tooling is complete, but if I am dying something I will do that first then dye.

[DavidL]

I warm up my Neatsfoot oil prior to applying it (was a suggestion from a saddle maker) as it supposedly makes it penetrate more evenly. I use either a piece of sheep skin or a cotton ball depending on what is convenient. I don't usually dye my pieces so I oil after tooling is complete, but if I am dying something I will do that first then dye.

I find some leathers may have accumulated oils unevenly or something similar because when I dye my piece one area will absorb more of the dye. Would you first remove the oils from things like from your fingers or from a rag your wiped the leather with some naphtha, saddle soap, or degreaser then apply the neatsfoot?

[Bob Blea]

I'll use an Oxalic acid solution to clean leather on occasion, but often I don't if I'm just antiquing a piece. If I was going to dye it then I would clean it by gently wiping it with the Oxalic acid solution to remove any oils. I would definitely recommend oiling well after the cleaning (any dyeing) because the Oxalic acid really seems to dry out the leather.

[footrat]

I use synthetic wool daubers from Tandy. Big bag of about 100. I wait until I have several pieces to oil, and one dauber usually fares well for the entire lot. The rough sides of leather will usually smash the dauber down so it's not as fluffy and absorbent, but it still works fine.

What I make is expected to last years in the hardest environments (structural firefighting), so I use heavy harness leather, and I oil the crap out of it. I oil it front and back until it won't hold any more, and I also oil the edges. Then I rub it down with Aussie Leather Conditioner to hold the oil in.

[NVLeatherWorx]

I was taught long ago that you should apply your Neatsfoot Oil after your leather has dried from stamping/tooling and before dye/stain application. I pour some oil into a small glass bowl, put it into the microwave for about 30 seconds, apply liberally using sheep's wool/synthetic wool pads, and then let it set for about 8 hours so it can penetrate. I apply a second treatment following the same process. Once the second treatment has set for at least 8 hours I can then apply my dye/stain and then let it dry for at least 8 hours. Apply another treatment of dye/stain if necessary and let dry at least 8 hours. Once my dye/stain has set, buff off any excess/pigment materials, apply another oil treatment (following same process as in the beginning) and let set at least 8 hours. From here you apply your top coat/sealer/protectant as needed and you should be done. This is how I was taught years ago (before microwave's we would heat it in a small pan until you could see the surface shimmer). Heating the oil does allow it to penetrate better and it also mixes the oil elements and keeps them bonded together. You will notice that once you have heated the oil, you will not see the typical separation of the lubricating elements from the particles.

[BDAZ]

I decant oil into a smaller bottler and keep a Tandy wool dauber in the bottle which I reuse until it becomes too discolored. I only oil after tooling and wet forming and the item is completely dry, assisted by the Arizona sun. My workshop is cooled to 85F and the oil penetrates well at that temperature. In the sun, a black item can reach 140F and the oil is distributed quickly. I re-oil once more before waxing and shipping.

I don't oil between production stages to save time.

Cya!

Bob

[oltoot]

All the Saddlemakers I've known dye then oil, then topcote then then buff.

[MerlB]

Thank you all for the tips!

I've tried the sponge, and it works much better than the original brush in distributing the oil evenly.

However I dont think I like neatsfoot oil much. For one thing I had hopes, that treating the dyed leather with neatsfoot would soften it up again since the oil dye makes the leather pretty hard. This does not seem to be the case though.

Then the oil darkens the leather very much. Too much for my liking. And third the oil seems to penetrate more at the edges, so around the borders and along stitchholes it becomes even darker. It does not look too displeasing but it certainly was not the look I was after, either... The pieces in the middle and on the right have gotten a single treatment with neatsfoot oil, the left scrap piece is dyed with Fiebings Spanish Brown Professional Oil Dye diluted 5:1 with denatured alcohol.

[Gump]

There are two basic neatsfoot oils, one is just called "neatsfoot oil", the other is "neatsfoot oil compound". The compound isn't as dark as the straight neatsfoot oil, but will still darken leathers slightly. Gump.

[MerlB]

Thanks Gump, didnt know that.

But since I already used the Compound... ...I dont need to try the real neatsfoot

[camano ridge]

Actually I use 100% Neatsfoot oil all the time. Neatsfoot compound is hydrotreated heavy naphthenic distillate (a petroleum product) and is not necassariy good for some leathers. 100% is now made primarily from lard. Neatsfoot will soften the leather some and the more you put on it the more it will soften. The important thing is that all of the action of Neatsfoot oil is not immediate, you need to give the oil time to migrate through the leather. Neats foot will initially darken the leather then as it is absorbed through the leather the lieather lightens again in most cases almost to the natural color. You will see more absorbtion around stitch holes and raw edges because there are open fiber to more readily grab te oil. However again given time the color will even out in these area also.

Edited July 25, 2014 by camano ridge

[MerlB]

Hm, the treated pieces on the image I posted earlier have dried for six days now.

[camano ridge]

Here is a little demo I did for you after my last post.Again I use 100% Pure Neatsfoot Oil. When I was first learning leather back in the early 70's I was told by an experienced leatherworker to never use the compound as it was a petroleum product and not good for leather. I do know if it will hurt the leather or if it will darken the leather more or less then 100% Pure Neatsfoot Oil. I just know I have never used the compound and I am usually happy with the results of using the Pure Neatsfoot. The first picture is of a piece of scrap leather as I got it out of my scrap box. The second picture is the same piece imeaditely after a finger tip aplication of 100% Pure Neatsfoot oil, the third picture is the same piece 4 hours after the application of the 100% Neatsfoot oil. You can see that it has returned almost to the same color it was before the oil was applied. I do a lot of western holsters and belts and many are left natural or are suntanned after the appliction of Neatsfoot oil, but they all get 100% Neatsfoot oil and I do not usually have a problem with them being to dark. Having said that I do notice when I use horse that the oil will darken itmore. What type of leather are you using?

Edited July 26, 2014 by camano ridge

[MojoGeorge]

Huh, I apply neatsfoot with my hands, I was taught that way by my grandpa and have never thought twice about it. He had a saddlery and harness shop and was a third generation maestro. He always felt that the leather needed to be handled, but he always claimed that items have souls and needs. He was a different kind of feller, but I still miss him. RIP

[MerlB]

Here is a little demo I did for you after my last post.Again I use 100% Pure Neatsfoot Oil. When I was first learning leather back in the early 70's I was told by an experienced leatherworker to never use the compound as it was a petroleum product and not good for leather. I do know if it will hurt the leather or if it will darken the leather more or less then 100% Pure Neatsfoot Oil. I just know I have never used the compound and I am usually happy with the results of using the Pure Neatsfoot. The first picture is of a piece of scrap leather as I got it out of my scrap box. The second picture is the same piece imeaditely after a finger tip aplication of 100% Pure Neatsfoot oil, the third picture is the same piece 4 hours after the application of the 100% Neatsfoot oil. You can see that it has returned almost to the same color it was before the oil was applied. I do a lot of western holsters and belts and many are left natural or are suntanned after the appliction of Neatsfoot oil, but they all get 100% Neatsfoot oil and I do not usually have a problem with them being to dark. Having said that I do notice when I use horse that the oil will darken itmore. What type of leather are you using?

Thanks a lot for the photos! A really nice demonstration. I use veg tanned cow leather 3.5mm thick, no idea what that is in oz... 7/8oz I think.

[papaw]

Could it be you are putting to much oil on or letting the sun hit it.

[MerlB]

Could it be you are putting to much oil on or letting the sun hit it.

Too much oil? Very well possible, thats why I'm asking for help cause I've got no clue

Sun? Nope. For an hour maybe, but else sun's not getting past the trees outside...

[papaw]

I would try small sponge not as wide as the leather, ring sponge out very dry and wipe a pass down the middle liter than you would normally and let it set in the shop. You could dampen the leather with water first so it soaks up the oil slower. I sun tan and it looks like maybe to much oil, try a couple of scraps. the reason is said down the middle cause your not going to get it on the edges and the oil will migrate through out the leather. Camano Ridge is good at this but you have to try thing till they work for you.

[camano ridge]

I agree with pawpaw, you may be putting on to much at one time. Use light coats, with the Neatsfoot compound you would have to use aan applicator like a sponge etc. as the MSDS and the can say that it can be a skin irratant. However with 100% Neatsfoot Oil I use finger tip application this allows plenty of control as to the amount and where I am applying it. As pawpaw pointed out exposure to sunlight will darken the leather, however exposure to any light that emits UV will also darken leather.

Attached is a thickness conversion chart you might find helpful.

[oltoot]

If you can find it, try Lexol nf. won't darken and with any oil, try having your leather a little damp when you oil. Needs to be evenly moist, actually cased is about right