Gluing Rawhide To Leather For Cowboy Holster

[bushpilotmexico]

I have searched all over including this forum for hints on how to fasten rawhide between two pieces of leather when forming a fast draw cowboy holster.

I Googled one gentleman who makes them and when it came to his process he politely said it's a trade secret.

I'm a custom knife maker and in all my years never met a knifemaker who wouldn't share any or all the information he possessed. Nothing was a trade secret. The thing that separated the master knife makers from the amateur was the quality of the finished product. I make all the sheaths for my knives as well as archery quivers.

Rawhide has to be wet to be formed, seems like glue won't adhere to a wet surface, the rawhide shrinks when it dries, if you sandwich it between two layers it will shrink and possibly bubble up the liner and on and on, lots of horror stories.

It would be much appreciated if anyone be able to tell me how to proceed or maybe give me some helpful tips?

I use 8-9 oz leather for my sheaths and for holster making was thinking of using 8-9 oz and then 3-4 oz for the liner and sandwiching rawhide in between.

Some photos:

[Dwight]

My one and only rawhide project was a knife sheath, . . . for a special, . . . home made knife for a young man who wanted a Native American look.

The photo is that sheath, . . . I took a piece of rawhide, . . . wet it, . . . formed the "general" shape of what i was wanting by wetting and bending it.

A few days later when I was certain it had dried, . . . I contact cemented it to the suede that makes the sheath. Haven't heard any complaints, . . . and that was several years ago.

May God bless,

Dwight

[bushpilotmexico]

My one and only rawhide project was a knife sheath, . . . for a special, . . . home made knife for a young man who wanted a Native American look.

The photo is that sheath, . . . I took a piece of rawhide, . . . wet it, . . . formed the "general" shape of what i was wanting by wetting and bending it.

A few days later when I was certain it had dried, . . . I contact cemented it to the suede that makes the sheath. Haven't heard any complaints, . . . and that was several years ago.

May God bless,

Dwight

Thanks Dwight,

What I don't understand is why is it such a big secret, Obviously because the rawhide needs to be wet and supple to be able to sandwich it and then form the holster there is a certain technique that should be followed, type of adhesive, etc. if adhesive is in fact used (I doubt it).

This guy on Google who says it's his trade secret shouldn't be afraid to pass it on. The proof of the pudding is the end result if he is, in fact, a master leather smith then his final product should speak for itself and blow away any competition if they use his technique.

I see some individuals use metal between layers rather than rawhide. In a lot of my knife sheaths I use the old boiled leather process and after I wet form the knife the sheath dries as hard as nails. I'm kind of thinking that if you sandwich the rawhide (wet) between the outer and inner lining leather but don't have the rawhide extend into the area to be stitched. Then sew the holster, use the boiled leather technique and form it to the firearm which has been wrapped sufficiently ( remember in fast draw we don't want a friction fit it has to fit loose) with layers of saran wrap or what ever to get the loose fit and then let the holster dry.

If and when the rawhide decides to shrink it will do so trapped between the boiled leather outer and inner layers. Not being held by the stitches it shouldn't cause the liner to bubble up as it shrinks. It should follow the predetermined shape of the holster.

I think this has to be the way it's done as I can't think of any glue that will bond to wet leather and you really don't want it bonded if it's going to shrink.

[TwinOaks]

tip:

If you don't know of an adhesive that will work with damp things, you haven't researched enough adhesives.

[bushpilotmexico]

tip:

If you don't know of an adhesive that will work with damp things, you haven't researched enough adhesives.

Let's put it this way whether there is a glue or not (Gorilla glue will work but foams) I think the rawhide has to be free floating and let it shrink if it wants between layers and form to the predetermined shape. Trapped between leather that has been subjected to the cuirboulli process I think you would be able to jump up and down on the holster without affecting the shape when it dries.

Just looking for comments from leather artisans who have worked with rawhide.

[Dwight]

Let me go back to my original post, . . . I contact cemented the rawhide to the suede, . . . it did not shrink, . . . the pieces are still together. And I might add that they are by this time as near as can become, . . . one piece. No floaters.

AND, . . . If the boiling process does such a wonderful job, . . . why bother with the rawhide????

May God bless,

Dwight

[bushpilotmexico]

Let me go back to my original post, . . . I contact cemented the rawhide to the suede, . . . it did not shrink, . . . the pieces are still together. And I might add that they are by this time as near as can become, . . . one piece. No floaters.

AND, . . . If the boiling process does such a wonderful job, . . . why bother with the rawhide????

May God bless,

Dwight

Good point Dwight,

Leather armor in the old days was made using the cuirboulli process. At the moment I'm just tossing ideas around looking for someone who might want to share their secret.

Sounds like some holster makers use thin metal between the two layers. Sounds like these competition fast draw competitors want and expect a zero retention holster with absolutely no friction to slow down their time.

With the amount of work making a rig because all stitching is by hand i kind of want it to work out the first time with no maybes or try this.

[Dwight]

OK, . . . if you are dyed in the wool destined to do this, . . . forget the rawhide.

Go get some 20 / 22 / 24 gauge sheet aluminum, with the brushed finish, . . . no shiny stuff, . . . get a good sharp set of left & right cutting metal shears, . . . and an old tee shirts you never want to see again.

If you have ever done a pattern on manila folders, . . . do one for this project, . . . if not, . . . youtube search, . . . there are a couple that will show you how to come up with a usable pattern. The metal should be the same shape in the back as you make for the front.

The metal, . . . after it is cut out, . . . needs to be formed to the weapon, . . . wrap the weapon in the tee shirt and hold in place with some masking tape, . . . put a dowel rod on top of the barrel to make a sight channel.

DO NOT TRY TO FORM THE METAL VERY CLOSELY TO THE WEAPON, . . . just follow general countours, . . .

Next, . . . cut out the "outside of the holster", . . . 5/6 or 6/7 veggie tan for this, . . . this is the piece that will show hair side against your leg, . . . and on the front / outside of the holster. Make it big enough so you have a good 3/8 to 1/2 inch of sewing room all around your aluminum piece, . . . plus the piece to loop over and make the belt loop out of.

Next, . . . cut out a 3/4 or 4/5 liner, . . . leaving enough on the edges to be able to sew it. The liner will be the exact same shape as the outside of the holster, . . . and cut it out using the other leather piece as the pattern. When done, . . . you can lay the two on top of each other, . . . and they will be an exact fit.

Make sure your metal is shaped as you want it for the holster, . . . apply contact cement to the outside of it, . . . and the inside of the outside piece of leather, . . . bond the two together. Let is set for about 12 to 18 hours.

Gently pry the metal/leather piece apart, . . . enough to coat the entire inside with contact cement, . . . coat the inside of the liner, . . . bond them together. Let is set for about 12 to 18 hours.

Sand the edges smooth all around the holster.

Sew the top and bottom of the holster together, . . . as well as the pieces making the belt loop. Bevel and burnish these edges as well.

Next make a filler piece, . . . a gusset that goes between the front and back of the holster, . . . at the seam edge. It should be about 1/2 inch wide, . . . and go from the top to the bottom of the holster, . . . it should be specifically cut to the exact shape of the holster, . . . not just a 1/2 inch wide strip you found laying around. It should be of good solid 8/9 oz leather, . . . Contact cement that all in place, . . . which will then close up the holster.

Sand the edge smooth, . . . bevel, . . . and burnish.

Punch and stitch the leather edge of the holster.

Once you have this all done, . . . the holster should be ready for final "forming". Wet the holster real good (don't soak it overnight, . . . just a good quick 10 second dunk will do), . . . and with the weapon in a plastic bag, . . . use your thumbs, knuckles, fingers, . . . to form the final shape you want. Just realize that you are not going to get a really tight fitting form, . . . just a general shape.

Hang it up to dry, . . . in a cabinet at 130 degrees or slightly under, if you have it available, . . . and leave it. Let it dry, . . . completely, . . . thoroughly, . . . fully.

Then stain and finish to your hearts content.

I'll caution you before you start, . . . the first one will not turn out right, . . . they never do. It will be a learning experience, . . . it will not be wasted leather and effort, . . . but rather a "hands on" schooling expedition. You will do something wrong that will make the holster not be "what you wanted". It may be useful (mine almost always are), . . . but just not exactly how you originally wanted it to turn out.

Just remember it really is as the old saying goes "We make the first one for practice, all the rest are production."

Good luck, . . . may God bless,

Dwight

Edited April 11, 2015 by Dwight

[Red Cent]

BPM, if you are making holsters for a member of the Cowboy Fast Draw Association, we are not allowed to use metal for lining. I hate making metal liners and I don't like rawhide. So......I use an 8-9 for the outer and 6-7 for the liner. Make the holster as usual, adhering to the rules, wet form, and bake it in the oven. 170 is low as I can go for about 20 minutes. Then, I let it sunbathe if the sun is out. Then a heat lamp. As you know, rock hard.

Most CFDA members learn very quickly, do not cause outside pressure on the holster. Store it carefully and transport it carefully.

[Red Cent]

BTW, this guy is known for his rawhide uses. He built these. Those dark strips top and bottom are rawhide. However, they are on the outside of the holsters.

http://www.rodkiblersaddlery.com/

Edited April 11, 2015 by Red Cent