Members spotty Posted December 23, 2015 Members Report Posted December 23, 2015 So I've got one of the flip up needle clamps to install on my 112w140 and then noticed that the needle bar is not threaded to accept the new clamp. I know that I need to cut a needle bar down to accomodate the extra height of the needle clamp but anyone know of a needle bar with a threaded end which would could be used as a donor part. Quote
Moderator Wizcrafts Posted December 23, 2015 Moderator Report Posted December 23, 2015 I do believe that this item may require an industrial sewing machine dealer to install it safely. The "needlebar rock-frame" may need to be cut away to accommodate this extra wide needle clamp (according to one eBay item I just read about). Quote Posted IMHO, by Wiz My current crop of sewing machines: Cowboy CB4500, Singer 107w3, Singer 139w109, Singer 168G101, Singer 29k71, Singer 31-15, Singer 111w103, Singer 211G156, Adler 30-7 on power stand, Techsew 2700, Fortuna power skiver and a Pfaff 4 thread 2 needle serger.
Members gottaknow Posted December 23, 2015 Members Report Posted December 23, 2015 All of my 112's have threaded needle bars. It's how you change the needle guage. Now if the needle holder has been in there for 50 years, you may have to work at it a bit. I use a piece of suede on the needle bar, then clamp a large vise grip over the leather. I then use an adjustable end wrench to unscrew the needle clamp from the bar. There are two different size bars. I believe the 140 sub-class uses the larger thread size. On the split bar adapters I've used in the past, no modification was required to the machine other than adjusting the needle bar height and retiming. They were actually made by Singer. I have both 112 140's and the newer 212 140's. I have seen some mechanics braze the needle clamps in place due to stripped threads in which case I just replace the bar and the needle clamp. You can also gain a little room for the needle clamp by using 135x7 needles instead of the longer 135x17's. Good luck. Regards, Eric Quote
Members spotty Posted December 24, 2015 Author Members Report Posted December 24, 2015 I do believe that this item may require an industrial sewing machine dealer to install it safely. The "needlebar rock-frame" may need to be cut away to accommodate this extra wide needle clamp (according to one eBay item I just read about). I too read those instructions but have now been told by someone who installed the clamp in the 112w140 - that you simply need to shorten the needle bar. No modification to the rock frame was required. If that was the case I would be much more hesitant as the difference in cost on parts is 15 bucks for needle bar vs 115 bucks for a rock frame. As far as I can tell there are two needle bars that can be used on a 112w140 which have different part numbers. The original had a push in clamp which was secured with a set screw. The needle bar part I'm told now that is needed is Singer PN 267267 which is threaded on one end. And the total length with the clamp needs to be cut down to 17cm in length. The timing marks on the needle bar are useless because of the increased height of the clamp but it will work just fine at that length. Thanks for thoughts... Quote
Members TinkerTailor Posted December 24, 2015 Members Report Posted December 24, 2015 (edited) I too read those instructions but have now been told by someone who installed the clamp in the 112w140 - that you simply need to shorten the needle bar. No modification to the rock frame was required. If that was the case I would be much more hesitant as the difference in cost on parts is 15 bucks for needle bar vs 115 bucks for a rock frame. As far as I can tell there are two needle bars that can be used on a 112w140 which have different part numbers. The original had a push in clamp which was secured with a set screw. The needle bar part I'm told now that is needed is Singer PN 267267 which is threaded on one end. And the total length with the clamp needs to be cut down to 17cm in length. The timing marks on the needle bar are useless because of the increased height of the clamp but it will work just fine at that length. Thanks for thoughts... You were not just told by someone random, GottaKnow is an expert on these things, and has set up these types of machines professionally for decades He has probably worked on the needle bar of a 112 dozens if not hundreds of times, and has probably worked on more machines than any of us have even seen. He is head mechanic at Filson. I would take his advice very seriously, You will be hard pressed to get advice from anyone who knows more. Don't get me wrong, Wiz is a wiz, and gives great advice and for sure has forgotten more than most of us know, however he was pretty clear that he was not 100% sure in this case. Edited December 24, 2015 by TinkerTailor Quote "If nobody shares what they know, we will eventually all know nothing." "There is no adventure in letting fear and common sense be your guide"
Members gottaknow Posted December 26, 2015 Members Report Posted December 26, 2015 All my experience just means I'm old. I'd love to have Wiz in the factory, much like my file cabinets full of machine manuals. I could pick his brain like the resource he is. Like me, his knowledge has come through practical life experience, and I'm sure like myself, plenty of missteps along the way. Industrial machines are not something you just figure out in a weekend on a forum. I try to present information as simply as I can, and hope I don't lead someone astray in the process. I applaud the efforts of everyone who contributes here. Regards, Eric Quote
Members spotty Posted December 27, 2015 Author Members Report Posted December 27, 2015 All my experience just means I'm old. I'd love to have Wiz in the factory, much like my file cabinets full of machine manuals. I could pick his brain like the resource he is. Like me, his knowledge has come through practical life experience, and I'm sure like myself, plenty of missteps along the way. Industrial machines are not something you just figure out in a weekend on a forum. I try to present information as simply as I can, and hope I don't lead someone astray in the process. I applaud the efforts of everyone who contributes here. Regards, Eric I appreciate all the advice - and this is a great resource for people who have a lot more experience on industrial sewing machines than me. Quote
Moderator Wizcrafts Posted December 27, 2015 Moderator Report Posted December 27, 2015 All my experience just means I'm old. I'd love to have Wiz in the factory, much like my file cabinets full of machine manuals. I could pick his brain like the resource he is. Like me, his knowledge has come through practical life experience, and I'm sure like myself, plenty of missteps along the way. Industrial machines are not something you just figure out in a weekend on a forum. I try to present information as simply as I can, and hope I don't lead someone astray in the process. I applaud the efforts of everyone who contributes here. Regards, Eric Wow, thanks Eric! I'd probably enjoy the challenge of working in your factory. It would be a heck of a move though. Quote Posted IMHO, by Wiz My current crop of sewing machines: Cowboy CB4500, Singer 107w3, Singer 139w109, Singer 168G101, Singer 29k71, Singer 31-15, Singer 111w103, Singer 211G156, Adler 30-7 on power stand, Techsew 2700, Fortuna power skiver and a Pfaff 4 thread 2 needle serger.
Members Constabulary Posted April 20, 2017 Members Report Posted April 20, 2017 I´m pulling this old thread again. I´m just about installing flip up double needle holder son my 212G141 and I figured they do not work - I have in stalled a new threaded needle bar (had to cut the old one as the original needle holder won´t come off) and just received the holders (1/4 + 3/8 gauge). Installing is no problem BUT the needle bar rock frame is to long as it seems. Pictures show NB at TDC and BDC so the only way would be cutting down the needle bar rock frame, right? I have checked the parts list and G140 and G141 have the same NBRF. In this add the G141 is not mentioned but the G140 and G145 So is the add wrong or the parts list? I don´t think I will find a shorter NBRF for a decent price (machine was a bargain). So my solution would be cutting the NBRF and use (probably) a shorter needle. Or do I overlook something - I don´t think so. Quote ~ Keep "OLD CAST IRON" alive - it´s worth it ~ Machines in use: - Singer 111G156 - Singer 307G2 - Singer 29K71 - Singer 212G141 - Singer 45D91 - Singer 132K6 - Singer 108W20 - Singer 51WSV2 - Singer 143W2
Members Constabulary Posted April 20, 2017 Members Report Posted April 20, 2017 Now that I see the pictures I wonder if the 3/8 needle holder will work at all since it is a bit wider than the 1/4"... it may hit the casting.... Soooo is someone out there who successfully has installed a flip up needle holder on a Singer 212 or similar Juki, Seiko or what ever brand? Quote ~ Keep "OLD CAST IRON" alive - it´s worth it ~ Machines in use: - Singer 111G156 - Singer 307G2 - Singer 29K71 - Singer 212G141 - Singer 45D91 - Singer 132K6 - Singer 108W20 - Singer 51WSV2 - Singer 143W2
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