Burrs On Copper Rivets After Doming. Solution Suggestions Please?

[Tallbald]

I've recently begun using the attributes of solid copper rivets to make my holsters and sheaths stronger. I watched a few tutorials online, and read threads here. I thank those who post and share ideas and thoughts too.

I trim a rivet to about 1/8 of an inch above the washer, using side cutters. My setting tool is just a basic one from Springfield Leather. I have tried two ways of trimming---one is a single cut, and the other is two cuts rotated 90 degrees from each other. The first way gives me a chisel looking cut, while the second way gives me a pyramid appearance. Either way I end up with a sharp burr on the post that's hard to file away.

* On the Tandy video I see there's a separate "doming tool" used to give a nicer recessed look to the set rivet. Are these practical in use?

*Am I over-hammering the rivet post causing the burrs to form?

*Would a flat cut using a jewelers saw reduce burrs?

Some videos show the craftsperson peening the post over either before OR after using the setting tool to deform and secure the post.

I believe I'm overthinking riveting, but the burrs are not acceptable. Suggestions sure appreciated. Thank you as always. Don.

[TinkerTailor]

I do not use a doming tool, I use a 6oz ball pein hammer and tap it lightly until the head is smooth. Copper rivets are not one hit wonders, they require a few hits to get nice. I find it is nicer with a hammer than the tool. I do use the tool to set the burr down before cutting.

Here is how they turn out and the hammer i use I call the hammer the little devil

[Northmount]

I learned at about 12 years old how to set copper rivets. The first one I tried was a disaster. I didn't trim the post at all. I just started hammering on the rivet and of course, it didn't behave as I expected it to. Bent over, deformed, ugly, useless, etc. So my dad showed me how later that day.

It makes little difference as to whether you cut across one direction or both directions when you trim the rivet post to the correct length. I was taught using just a ball-peen hammer. Make sure you have a good solid backing to support the work and rivet. Push the washer down tight. Then gently tap the end of the post with the ball end of the hammer, going around the perimeter of the post so you deform it equally all around. It will gradually spread and tighten down on the washer. You can do quite a nice job without the doming tool. It just makes it a little easier to finish it up. So in my opinion, don't pound the heck out of the rivet. Won't get what you want as a result.

Tom

[BondoBobCustomSaddles]

I use one step more than North does. Once nicely peened over with a ball peen hammer I then use a small doming tool I made out of a 1/2" bolt, by ginding the end concave with a dremmel tool and polishing. I use it as a finish strike to give it a nice smooth rounded look.

Bob

[Nuttish]

The rivet is the part with the head and shank. The burr is the washer.

1/8" is quite a lot of rivet shank to leave exposed IMO. You run the risk of bending it when you go back to peen or round the top over and it leaves a long nipple to dome.

TinkerTaylor's strategy is super classy and conveys that the piece was definitely made by hand.

Dimensioning:

To get the more uniform look, cut your rivet to leave yourself about 3/32". You could use a jeweler's coping saw if you wanted. A Dremel is just as good. Pre-dome it a bit by sanding or filing a taper at the end. Polish if you care (sounds like you do since you're concerned about distorting the end of the rivet). This makes it pretty and easier to place the burr before you set it.

Setting:

• Don't set the burr so deeply that it deforms the leather more than just barely compressing the grain. You don't have to whack it in one go. Tap it down until you get it where you want. I think this will help reduce the "burrs" you refer too, since you have more control over making sure you set the burr straight down the rivet vs. gouging the shank by distorting the burr in any dimension.

Doming:

• The doming tools that come on Osborn hand setting tools suck. They make it too easy to mark your piece or further compress the rivet.

• BondoBobCustomSaddles's tool is the way to go — the only thing I would add is make it out of a 1/4 x 2 grade 8 bolt. Grade 8 is tempered, so will be a more durable and safer tool.

• Dome by carefully tilting the tool about 5 degrees per tap and rotating the angle around the rivet until you get the result you want. You don't have to whack the shit out of it. More taps is better and safer.

Edited December 24, 2015 by Nuttish

[TinkerTailor]

I cut them at about 1/8 as well, with side cutters. I have a pair that has just the right offset to the cutting edge from the side so i can just put the cutters on the surface of the leather and cut. This ensures i cut all of them the same length. I then tap lightlyright in the center until the top starts flattening and the edges are rolling over. I then tap around in a circular pattern 2-3 laps. I can do each rivet from punch to finish in less than a minute.

[Tallbald]

This is wonderful and I sincerely appreciate the information.

I will bite the bullet, use some rivets and burrs (thank you for the terminology help)and try utilizing all or parts of the techniques outlined. The price of practice rivets is cheap compared to the frustration I've been experiencing.

As with so many facets of craftsmanship, one does, I believe, tap into the experience of others and develop a personal approach to creating a quality product. Each of you has helped me by sharing freely. I look forward to the next session I can spend at the bench trying these ideas. Don

[Art]

I would recommend you only use size #8 or #9 rivets, especially if you riveting something thick. I have #12 rivets, but they require a lighter hand. Peening #14 rivets requires a light hand and the patience of Job. They are practically useless, they will bend inside the leather before they peen over satisfactorly. I can make them work ok, but go lightly.

I have found that of all the tools I have for rivets (including Douglas sets) the only tools I use are Todd's #3 Blacksmith's end nippers, the proper setting tool for rivet size, and an Osborne Shoe Hammer (face not quite good enough for banging on leather). If you use a good solid anvil (Record 30 lb), moderate tapping will peen the post over with little trouble.

Art

[Tallbald]

Folks I have a 12 ounce ball pien hammer that was my grandfather's. He kept it in his 1963 Chevy Belair's trunk for years. It's mine now, rusted up and pitted, but I took it to our little shop, and using emery cloth and the lathe, resurfaced the face and ball, and made a new un-cracked handle.

I re-read the responses and using a combination of the suggestions offered here, managed to handsomely peen the rivet down over the burr, giving as pointed out a true hand crafted look.

With all your all's help I believe I've found my groove. Thank you each respondent again. Don.

[TinkerTailor]

Folks I have a 12 ounce ball pien hammer that was my grandfather's. He kept it in his 1963 Chevy Belair's trunk for years. It's mine now, rusted up and pitted, but I took it to our little shop, and using emery cloth and the lathe, resurfaced the face and ball, and made a new un-cracked handle.

I re-read the responses and using a combination of the suggestions offered here, managed to handsomely peen the rivet down over the burr, giving as pointed out a true hand crafted look.

With all your all's help I believe I've found my groove. Thank you each respondent again. Don.

That is awesome, glad you got it worked out.