29K Bobbin Shuttle Issue

[xenajo]

Hi there

The thread is not being caught by the shuttle hook, it appears the hook falls short by a couple of mm so the thread just misses it. Any advice on how to adjust it. Will post a photo showing the point where is just short of catching the thread shortly.

Thanks

Edited February 29, 2016 by xenajo

[Constabulary]

What subclass has you 29K? Some have a timing eccentric some do not. Do you have an manual for your machine? Maybe the hook tip is worn. For uploading pictures click the brown MORE REPLY OPTIONS button next to the black POST button.

[Wizcrafts]

If your patcher has a ~7/16" hole in the lower section of the front right of the head, you probably have an adjustable timing model. You can stick a large flat bade screw driver through the hole and angle it into the large slotted eccentric bolt that couples the mechanism from the top to the racks inside the arm. You may need to loosen the locknut on the inside of the adjuster couplings first. The offset bolt allows for advancing or retarding the hook timing by about 1/8 inch.

If you don't have this adjustment in your patcher, you'll need to replace some or all of the gears and racks under the left end of the arm.

[xenajo]

I have a 29K 1 here is the photo of the bobbin and shuttle

[Constabulary]

I have worked on a 29K4 and 29K3 and both had not timing eccentric so I`m sure your also has none.

Are you using the correct needle system 29x3 / 332?

Your thread also looks quite thick (maybe just because of the close up picture) what needle size and thread size are you using?

You can try to move the needle holder a bit toward the the hook. Loosen the top screw on the needle holder an try to move it a bit to the right. Needle holder could be quite tight...

[Ole South]

Isn't the tip of the hook broken off in that picture?!!?

[xenajo]

I just got this machine which needed a bit of a clean up and a few small parts. The needle pack that came with it are 29x4 3 size 22, the thread also came with the machine so I am assuming this was used with the machine as it was in the small wooden draw of the machine. The needle is pretty much rubbing against the shuttle so I it looked good to me, don't think it can get much closer. When the shuttle is in motion it just seems to be just short of catching the thread. If I move the shuttle with my finger to push it just pass the needle it seems to pick up the thread.

[xenajo]

Isn't the tip of the hook broken off in that picture?!!?

No the thread is covering the tip

[Constabulary]

Then most like the gears are worn or you need a new hook - maybe the hook tip if worn. The hook tip should pass the needle but not touch it (that wears off the hook tip) so I´d move the needle holder a bit to the left.

29x4 is the leather needle so thats okay. I´d probably try a thinner thread and maybe a smaller size needles though 22 should work fine - but you never know these very old machines can be quite self-willed sometimes.

[Wizcrafts]

Open the throat plate and see how far you can rotate or wiggle the shuttle with your fingers. If it has 1/8" or more of slack, the gears are worn out. If that's the case and the machine was using anything thicker than #92 thread, you can guess that the oversize thread wore it out.

[Constabulary]

The 29K4 is almost 100 years old so the theory that an oversized thread wore out the gears is a bit far away, isn´t it? I´d rather say decade of use wore out the gears if they are worn.

[cdthayer]

Try a different or new shuttle first. I have some that won't pick up the thread in either of my 29K70 machines, but better shuttles don't miss a stitch.

CD in Oklahoma

[xenajo]

Thanks for the advice so far, I have taken a photo of the rack box and the shuttle driving pinion. I am going by the manual i printed off for another 29K but not the same as mine but this part looks the same. There appears a little wear on the parts but not sure if its enough to make a difference. I noticed there is a bit of play in the driving pinion, would this cause the problem?

[Wizcrafts]

Yep, the driving pinion needs to be replaced. In theory, if you replace everything under the arm with well fitting but not binding parts, as well as the foot driving cam that lives under the revolving head bushing, the machine should sew like a brand new old one. You can probably buy all these parts, plus a new take-up lever and a new bobbin case, for around $300.00.

[Constabulary]

They are for sure not new but I have seen worse gears. They don´t look too bad in my opinion.

Regarding shuttle hook - I have attached a picture of a NOS original Singer hook and a worn Singer hook - difference is pretty obvious. They both work in my 29K71 BUT I can advance or retard the hook on my 29K71 whereas you can`t on your 29K4 if it has no timing screw. So the condition of hook tip really can be an issue.

oops - Fingers are still dirty from the latest restoration

Edited March 2, 2016 by Constabulary

[xenajo]

Ok here is my bobbin shuttle. I think to play safe I will get a new shuttle and a new shuttle driving pinion. Will let you know when they arrive Thank you so much for the advice so far

[Constabulary]

Be careful with the new shuttle driving pinion - the 29K71 gears you find f.i. at College Sewing do not fit for the 29K4 since the early 29K´s have larger gears. Singer has changed (improved) A LOT of parts on the 29K class over the decades.

F.I. the K50´s subclass machines have much smaller gears with much finer teeth than any other 29K. The K60´s and K70´s gears are the same as far as I know but do not fit the K50´s or earlier sub class machines.

[xenajo]

Thanks, I have ordered mine from college sewing so will have to check it when it arrives, fingers crossed!

[xenajo]

Well the parts arrived and the pinion was half the size of the one on my machine. The new shuttle hook doesn't look much better then the one I've got but I tried it anyway and still doesn't work . So I have called a repair guy in tomorrow to have a look as the parts are costing me more money and they are not fixing the problem. Will let you know what the outcome is.

[jimi]

Hi xenajo, didnt want to sound negative so i waited until your parts arrived. i done the same thing with mine, then the rack and piñon had to get sent back also as it was for the newer models, not the old ones like ours. in the end after looking all over the place the front driving piñon in my 29k was like new as i think i changed it 10 years ago and didnt really use the machine up until recently. anyway i was lucky to get someone in the work to make me two new piñons, one is in the machine and the other is a spare. your best bet would be to try and get someone in your area who does maybe model ingeneering to try and make you the parts? in the UK a lot of people do that sort of thang! hehe. these machines must be one of the most popular amongst leather workers so i am sure someone out there must make these larger piñons for the older machines?? hope you find something, good luck.

Edited March 3, 2016 by jimi

[xenajo]

Final update, one repair man gave up, thankfully the second repair man was more up on these machines and after a few hours found out the issue. The part where the shuttle sits needed bending a bit to make the fit tighter and took some of the excessive 'play' out of the shuttle. A couple of other minor alterations and she works perfectly. In the end it needed a knowledgeable person to eliminate things until he found the problem. I would still be in the same situation now if I had tried to fix myself. Just wanted to thank you all for your help and advice, appreciate your time and expertise.

[shoepatcher]

FYI,

The only place I have ever found that has the pinions (gears) for a 29-1 thru 29-4 is Pilgrim Shoe Company in Massachusetts here in the States. He has them made I believe in China but they are to the 29-4 gear specs. I think these are the same as the 29K1 thru 10 gears as well.

glenn

[xenajo]

Thanks Glenn will keep that in mind