Splinter’s Sheridan Style Beginning

[splinters]

After some time I’m back into leather work after a long absence from my early learning period in Phoenix, Arizona using Al Stohlman documents to make belts, wallets, etc. It was a fun time and I’m now learning how much I have missed it.

I have at least one project now that I’m holding off doing until I begin to feel comfortable with my swivel knife work and stamping before proceeding. It happens to be a holster kit put together for me by JLS. Looking forward to that but not to hurry to prevent a mess in my nest if possible. So, in recent days I’ve begun to think seriously about styles and have been looking at various works like Bob Park’s for example, and find I’m drawn to the Sheridan Style which has led to the beginning of this thread in hopes things I may post you folks will respond to help keep me on the straight and narrow….. LOL. Hate duplicating my mistakes.

With that I decided I should begin with what I could find on Sheridan Style work to start building some foundation. Yesterday I ordered a copy of Bob Gardener’s “Sheridan Style Carving” and this morning I order a copy of Bob Park’s “Creating Western Floral Designs”. Received notice this afternoon that both are in the mail and on their way. Looking forward to starting those and getting into Sheridan Style in earnest.

While looking around Barry King’s website, from where I ordered hidebound’s book, I noticed Barry has a Sheridan Style Tool List for small to medium work and a package deal if one is interested. Since I won’t be doing any saddle building the small to medium package looks like a possibility for me but study will precede that. Also I think I saw somewhere that “Creating Western Floral Designs” has that kind of information too.

So, from time to time I thought it would be good to have a thread to post questions to along with some thinking out loud so to speak. This should be fun……… Fingers crossed.

[JLSleather]

Well, that explains why we haven't seen pics of the finished holster!  Go on tear in -- holsters is simple (which is why you have a thousand thousand people doing them).  Plus, a mistake doesn't cost you the rent money (just lunch money)

 

[splinters]

5 hours ago, JLSleather said:

Well, that explains why we haven't seen pics of the finished holster!  Go on tear in -- holsters is simple (which is why you have a thousand thousand people doing them).  Plus, a mistake doesn't cost you the rent money (just lunch money)

 

Hello JLS,

I'm still here ..... LOL, and in the final stage of finishing up your Vertical Card Wallet design to carry two card documents for me. Planned on thanking you and posting a photo of the finished product. Going to do a follow up with some basket weave as practice for the holster.

Edited June 15, 2016 by splinters

[JLSleather]

You're welcome (a pic is worth 1000 thanks, or something like that)! 

Seriously, holsters is simple stuff.  Maybe a level-9 retention be a bit involved, but who even knows what that is?  

I should maybe put that up on my site, near the pattern section, like a big ole web banner (remember those, before they were called "widgets" and "headers"?):

Something like:  IF I CAN DO THIS, THEN YOU CAN DO THIS

 

 

 

[JLSleather]

OH, yeah...

Each his own, but I think that tooling within borders looks pretty good on a holster if the borders aren't the same width.  I tend to run 'em 3/8" in on edges and bottom, and 1/4" across the top.  Don't remember why... just know I like this proportion

 

[splinters]

2 hours ago, JLSleather said:

because of the small eyeOH, yeah...

Each his own, but I think that tooling within borders looks pretty good on a holster if the borders aren't the same width.  I tend to run 'em 3/8" in on edges and bottom, and 1/4" across the top.  Don't remember why... just know I like this proportion

 

I agree with you about tooling within borders on holsters and thank you for the proportion. I'll sure keep that in mind.

Here's the photo of your wallet design that I finished stitching this morning. All was going well until I turn the corner at the bottom and about 2/3 of the way to the end the thread broke leaving me with the choose of a splice....... grrrrrr. Another issue occurred here as I could not get the needle threaded again because of the small eye and had to use a larger needle to finish. I wish I could find a tad smaller waxed linen thread than I get at Tandy online. Looking in the holster kit you sent me you can see the two threads that you sent. The dark brown appears to be the same size I used on your vertical wallet but the bundle of natural you sent feels and looks to me to be a smaller diameter. Would you mind telling me were you purchased that, size, and do they have it in brown or black too? Do you every use any of the synthetic threads for saddle stitching?

Looking at the holster kit and your encouragement I may get underway sooner than I had thought. Looks fun and though it maybe a challenge for me I know the gent who knows about these puppies..... LOL

P.S. Your vertical card wallet design was just what I was looking for to carry my ID and a permit in my front pocket. I do plan on another attempt at the wallet with a little tooling on the front. Will try and get a better stitch job too. Thanks Jeff.

Edited June 15, 2016 by splinters

[JLSleather]

YIKES>.. that wallet pattern WORKED?  Who'da thought! @!#!@$!!

Don't remember right off where I got that lighter thread, but I'll see kin I find a receipt.  Meanwhile, I got about a ton of it, so I'll send ya a chunk.  Matter of fact, I'll just git ya a few different types of thread I use, and you can see what you like 'n' what you don't.  Stuff is cheap.. measured by teh mile (really!).

On those little wallets, I like 138 machine thread, personally.  I likely got the address, but I'll double check...  trying to get this belt tooled, but it aint dryin' fast enough to get to toolin ...

 

 

[splinters]

Grand! Thank you.

[splinters]

The Sheridan Style Carving book arrived yesterday and I'm enjoying the way the authors present their work. Also, enjoying the history that has been included and of course a question that came quickly to mind is if Barry King is any relation to Don King? I suspect so. Would any care to comment on that. Also, seeing that Don King did some work for Porter I thought about the Porter Saddle Shop in Phoenix and wondered if it was the same. I was in that shop a few times many, many years ago as a very young man, and always stood in amazement when able to watch some tooling being done by what I considered very gifted hands.  

[Bob Blea]

I believe Barry King is Don King's grandson.  And yes, I'm pretty sure the Porter's he worked at was the Porter Saddle Shop in the Phoenix area.  If you got to visit there in it's heyday you may have seen some top talent indeed.

[splinters]

44 minutes ago, Bob Blea said:

I believe Barry King is Don King's grandson.  And yes, I'm pretty sure the Porter's he worked at was the Porter Saddle Shop in the Phoenix area.  If you got to visit there in it's heyday you may have seen some top talent indeed.

Bob, thanks for the reply. Yes, it was a special time, though I didn’t know any of those folks I did realize I was seeing some grand artists at work. I have never forgotten it. One of the reasons I was there was our dad was having a custom saddle made for my younger sister as a surprise present. I recently e-mailed her to see if she had any photos of it. It was a beautiful thing to see. The saddle’s first mount was my sister’s quarter horse named “What-A-Broad”. A deserving spot for such wonderful work.

Well, Bob Park’s “Creating… Western Floral Designs” arrived in the morning mail from Barry King’s Co. this morning. So, as I was having my lunch I started reading and by page 10 I knew it was a keeper and another great addition for my education. What enjoyable, fun stuff.

Now, I must go back to the “Sheridan Carving Style” less I get ahead of myself. Plan on following the swivel knife practice suggestions first out of the box and follow any of the other ideas until my feet are at least on the ground with some tooling. Looking forward and hoping I will actually make progress. Fingers crossed!

 

[Bob Blea]

You're going to do great!  With those books as reference and some practice you will be surprised how quickly you progress.  I was planning some tooling practice last night but our power went out!  So much for getting any work done.

[splinters]

Thanks for the encouragement Bob.

I did manage a short session of freehand practice this afternoon and the next session will be to get after the practice patterns starting on page 16 of Sheridan Style Carving. Something I found interesting was the mention to try pushing as well as pulling the swivel knife. Tried a little of that and now want to try more of the push stroke...... interesting.

Here's a couple of photos one of which is my stropping setup and the other how my freehand looks with the first attempt with the Barry King swivel knife. What a difference compared to my old Tandy that I managed to hang onto all these years. I'm going to like getting use to the Barry King.  AT this time casing the leather to the right point is going to take a bit for me I think.

 

Edited June 18, 2016 by splinters

[splinters]

My sister surprised me by sending the following photo this weekend. Hearing that I was starting to get active in learning to carve and tool again she thought I would like to see a photo of an photo album cover I did for her some 50 + years ago.  I had forgotten all about it. Had to be around the time I was living in Payson, Arizona. The pattern was one of Al Stohlman’s if I remember correctly.  Anyway, I thought some of you may be interested in seeing it too.

 

Edited June 19, 2016 by splinters

[JLSleather]

Sweet!  50 years of faded, but still lookin' good.  Honestly, Al might have had a tip or two to share with you on the figure carving, but the floral is nice and the overall looks great.  Nice swivel knife work. Your sister obviously proud of it, too.

 

[splinters]

Jeff, thanks for taking a look and your critique. I had finally reached the point of being comfortable using the tools but realizing I had a long way to go. Oh, how enjoyable to try and the doing. Hope to get back to at least that point again.

 

Edited June 20, 2016 by splinters

[splinters]

Decided it was time I ordered a small piece, sq. ft., of Hermann Oak #2 tooling leather from SLC and give it a try with my practice. Have never used any leather except from Tandy's so I need to start learning the difference in what maybe rated as good tooling leather. Also, wondering now if I should have purchased a #1 grade from them and how does #1 or #2 relate to grade A/B ...... ???

[JLSleather]

There will be a line here to bash me for it in a minute... but I gotta say in good conscience that I would get leather somewhere OTHER than SLC (though, they seem to do okay with dye and buckles).

This is an issue I've 'answered' repeatedly over the years, I can feel another web site article coming on.  I mean, recognizing good leather -not bashing any one supplier

• Fat wrinkles happen.  But they shouldn't span the hide.
• Color should be consistent across the piece.
• Bellies are 'spongey'.  But that should be no more than about 20% of a side.
• The back side should be level and free of pits, 'fuzz', and stains.

SLC does NOT carry H.O. "A" grade.  In fact, they've repeatedly stated that their HO comes from the tannery already marked "B", but ... well...    I've seen HO "B", and ... ?  

Keep in mind the purpose of some suppliers.  As in retail.  As in marking up something someone else provided.  H.O. does have a minimum order, but the "A" grade is about $8 / foot ... not $12 / foot for "B" (or what is getting called "B").

And Wickett/Craig is down for annual maintenance this month, but their tooling leather is about $10/ft, and carves very nicely.

 

 

 

[splinters]

Thanks Jeff. That's a big help and my plan is to buy in some quantity soon and after reading their info on their website Wickett/Craig sounds like a good place for me to start. Since my cash wagon has its limits, will be popping for some more tools from BK shortly, I'm wondering what weight of tooling leather I should order to get me off the ground and that would be related to the projects I'll be interested in doing I assume.?

Thanks again, its much appreciated.

[JLSleather]

Oh, hey.... just poppin' back in to point out that when I say W/C is $10/ft, I mean BACKS (sides minus the belly).  I don't use belly leather, so I don't order it.

HO will sell you backs also, but that runs about $9.25 (ish) per foot.  Advantage.. no belly crap   Still not $12+

Hopefully folks can get an idea what they want to use (and do) without spending hundreds of $$ to find out that isn't what they wanted.  Your holster is 7/8 oz, and the wallet is 3/4 oz.

You'll find a range of answers about weights to use, not everybody likes it just the same.  As a rule, I like

• 7/8 for pistol holsters, bumping up to maybe 10 oz for the BIG ones, and as low as 6/7 for small pocket holsters or mag pouches.
• 3/4 for wallets / checkbooks / other pocket items
• 5/6 or 6/7 for small to med carved handbags (usually lined with 2/3 oz chrome tanned for a total of about 7/8)
• about 12/13 oz for belts, which is 7/8 or 8/9 lined with 3/4
• And that binder you did, depending on the size I would likely go with 6/7 or 7/8 for that as well.

 

 

[splinters]

More good stuff Jeff. Thanks. Will print your comments off and put in my shop notebook for quick reference.

I saw the layout on W/C of how the hide is sectioned which is more for the notebook.  

[splinters]

I’m still reading and rereading “Sheridan Style Carving”. This is a wonderful book that is filled with very useful information and will be a life time reference for me. If you don’t have it then I would suggest you make the investment. It’s another quality tool for the inventory.

I’m in the section on “Notes On Finishing Techniques” and would like to follow the finishing sequence of products applied in the text and shown with the pictured example.

#1 Light coat of neatsfoot oil

#2 Neat-Lac or other lacquer based finished

#3 antique

#4 Tan-Kote

Now that Neat-Lac has gone by the way, in my time away, I understand that a product called Clear-Lac has taken its place. Are there any other sealers that could be used in place of Clear-Lac?

Would really like to try the above on a practice test piece, but I’m sure not opposed to learning and trying another sequence of products that could be substituted.

I would appreciate any comments or suggestions from you all.   

Thanks.

[splinters]

Since I haven’t received a response to the previous post about the Neat-Lac, Clear-Lac question I’m going to try a practice piece using Tan-Kote and another practice piece using "RTC Sheridan Resist" in the Sheridan Style Caring finish sequence.

In my practicing to learn Sheridan Style Carving I’m fast becoming convinced that even the leather you practice with should be leather from a quality tannery such as Hermann Oak that has been properly cased. My thinking is one should be using leather that he or she will be using for projects in order to get the feel of the swivel knife, stamping and practice finish. May even save money instead of wrestling with unknown quality or portion of hide that came with a lessor price and ends in the waste basket.

[splinters]

Got some more practice in this afternoon and thought I would share with you all so you could see how I’m doing. If you have any comments or suggestions about the work please don't be shy.

First I want to point out that I used Bob Park’s method to case the leather and what a difference I noticed although I think I may have bagged it a little to soon last night and it may have been a little damp to start the work. 

Since I had to stop for now  I’m wondering how to store the practice piece for at least 24 hours since I will be out of town tomorrow. It’s back in the zip lock bag and I’m thinking of putting it in the frig until I return. Concerned about mold starting???

Anyway, here’s the work in four photos. Photo #1 is the pattern tracing, Photo #2 is the carving, Photo#3 is the border beveling and Photo #4 is a small bevel around the leaf.

After some more beveling I’ll be stuck until I order more stamps which I plan on doing this coming week. Can hardly wait. I'm really enjoying the practice and learning.

[JLSleather]

Yep, tha's still awfully wet.  "Smooshy" and heavily darkened where ya bopped it.  Flip it over on the other side, and note the "negative" of the pattern on the other side.  A wide, dark outline 'drawing' is a sure giveaway yer toolin' too wet.

Yer pattern aint centered on the leather, but the cuts look purdy smooth .. not broken 'n' choppy.

FYI,, FWIW kinda thing... I use a "shader' or "thumbprint" before a beveler (as a rule, more often than not) but each his own.

And I AIM to get a project completely done once I start.  On those times where it's not going to happen, I FINISH the part that I can.  What i mean... I generally would use (on a pattern like that one), a 'shader' (likely 2 or 3 different ones), then bevel, then selective modeling (too long story to include at the moment), then camo tools, veins, then background and decorative cutting.

So, if I know I'm running low on time, I might do the flower where you did, and all the stems / leaves leading up to that, and background, and cut, so that whole side is DONE, then cover the other side with a piece of (plastic) tracing film and leave it right where it is on the marble block. Come back tomorrow, uncover the work, and wait 'til it's ready.  With marble under it and plastic over it, it AINT gonna dry out.  Truth is, doing it 'in one shot" uses less time.

Tooling, I know.  But I didn't reply here cuz I don't know that resisty / paint / antstreak / wax off thing