Leather strap folding machine

[Anubis78]

In an effort to improve efficiency in strap production, I am in search of a machine that could fold 1 - 5oz leather for strap making. I have found difficulty finding these machines and have not been able to solidify a purchase from 2 machines I came across online.   Both companies are in Europe.

 

 The first is a German company where the contact seems to have very little interest in finalizing a sale (there might be a slight language barrier and I understand that the tone of German can be perceived as harsh); I was literally told that he was too busy with other orders and projects to give me information on how to make the purchase.   The price point was highly attractive, but I can seem to get the guy to work towards closing a sale.

 

the second is an Italian company who does not do direct sales it would appear.  I was able to track down one of their distributors, but due to dealing with a middle man, the machine plus shipping was over $8k (shipping from Italy to the distributor and then the distributor shipping it to me by freight... not efficient at all).  Also the 2-3 month delivery time made the deal even less attractive. 

 

So if anyone knows of machines or companies that I can look into, I'd greatly appreciate it!  Thank you all in advance. 

[RockyAussie]

I'm curious just what sort of machine you think you need to fold this leather into straps. For the money you're talking I would like to see the machines. Here is a link to one from Campbell Randall which I wonder would do. https://www.campbell-randall.com/machines/leather-goods-machines/folding-machines/star-3000-strap-edge-folder/

At any rate there is some pretty simple machines and devices for doing this job, and they are not all that hard to make, could you perhaps show a picture of how you do it now? I assume you want them glued first to hold together when run through folded and pressed. Does this machine do all this as well?.

I can take some pics of a very simple one here if you want. I only bother to roll stuff through it by hand but it can be attached to a motor as well. Regards Brian

[Big Sioux Saddlery]

There are actually strap folding machines shown in the old harness machinery catalogs. They look a lot like a creaser. I've never seen one in person, but I'd give my eye teeth to have one!

[Anubis78]

11 hours ago, RockyAussie said:

I'm curious just what sort of machine you think you need to fold this leather into straps. For the money you're talking I would like to see the machines. Here is a link to one from Campbell Randall which I wonder would do. https://www.campbell-randall.com/machines/leather-goods-machines/folding-machines/star-3000-strap-edge-folder/

At any rate there is some pretty simple machines and devices for doing this job, and they are not all that hard to make, could you perhaps show a picture of how you do it now? I assume you want them glued first to hold together when run through folded and pressed. Does this machine do all this as well?.

I can take some pics of a very simple one here if you want. I only bother to roll stuff through it by hand but it can be attached to a motor as well. Regards Brian

Brian,

That machine is actually the one that I was looking at from Italy, but I think that the retailer is different.  That is the machine that's was $8000+, which is WAY outside of my budget.  The German company has a folding machines from 695-1200€, plus 100€ for each of the folding guides.  I actually emailed them again to get a dialog going.

I'd definitely be interested in learning a more efficient way of folding and gluing the leather.  Please show me pictures of the device that you have constructed. I've been doing it all by hand from cutting the strips, marking a line on the glued side as a guide line for one edge of the strap, gluing, and then finally folding the strap.   I'll try to attach a photo if I can reduce the size of the image of the bi and tri folded straps.  But I'm trying to find a way to simplify and become more efficient with this process.  The other night it took roughly 5-5.5 hours to create 16  22" straps from start to finish.  So anyway to improve this process, I'm open to trying! 

[Anubis78]

6 hours ago, Big Sioux Saddlery said:

There are actually strap folding machines shown in the old harness machinery catalogs. They look a lot like a creaser. I've never seen one in person, but I'd give my eye teeth to have one!

Big Sioux Saddlery,

I'm assuming that they are no longer in production or are hard to come by?  Do you recall which companies were offering the machines?

[Anubis78]

Here are two pictures of the straps.  One shows and end view of a tri folded strap that was sewn.  The other is of two unsewn straps: one with each side folded to the middle and one folded in 3rds. 

Something I will do is invest in a skiving machine to reduce the thickness of the outer edge.

[Sonydaze]

I have this machine: Omac folder 

Mine is much older and is a Star 2000 model.  It is set up to fold the edges to the middle of the strap.  We make straps from upholstery weight leathers.  Apparently these folders can be set up to work with different weight materials and do different folds.  In Canada they are sold by : Simards   

This machine folds 8' of strap in about 15 seconds.

[Big Sioux Saddlery]

2 hours ago, Anubis78 said:

I'm assuming that they are no longer in production or are hard to come by?  Do you recall which companies were offering the machines?

Yes, the ones I'm referring to were in a catalog from the early 1900's. I think it was International Harness Machinery Company or something like that. I have a collection of old harness catalogs that I can't find since I moved a year ago. I guess I haven't gotten to that box yet!  Those machines specifically are no longer made, but apparently, as Sonydaze points out, there are still machines made to fold straps, although probably for leather much lighter in weight than the old harness machinery.

[Anubis78]

58 minutes ago, Sonydaze said:

I have this machine: Omac folder 

Mine is much older and is a Star 2000 model.  It is set up to fold the edges to the middle of the strap.  We make straps from upholstery weight leathers.  Apparently these folders can be set up to work with different weight materials and do different folds.  In Canada they are sold by : Simards   

This machine folds 8' of strap in about 15 seconds.

Sonydaze,

How about the gluing of the traps once folded? Is that a manual process? 

[Anubis78]

Also, I've seen what looks like a bias tape maker  (picture attached is a bias tape maker) being used by a leather worker on what I assume was maybe a 2oz leather.  8' not for sure if it was some specialty tool or not, but it was something I noticed and the person who used it was being very secretive about it.

Edited December 13, 2016 by Anubis78

[Sonydaze]

I bought my Omac Star 2000 for $200 in good used condition, I think there is some confusion on one costing $8000 from Italy.  I would price them from both Campbell-Randall as well as Simards. Either company should be able to give you info on their capabilities.  If the 220 volt power requirement is a problem, you can get a 110/220 step up step down transformer for $60 - $80 on Ebay.

Instead of glue, try using a suitable width of double sided tape (non-foam).  Much faster, no mess and no fumes.

I tape before running though the folder.. pull the tape backing off just before folding.  Then after folding, I run the strap through a double needle, walking foot sewing machine.  I can probably cut, tape, fold and sew about 100' of strap per hour.

In the past, I have tried several biasing attachments for sewing machines, but could never get one to work well with leather.  Has anyone else had any success with these? 

[Anubis78]

39 minutes ago, Sonydaze said:

I bought my Omac Star 2000 for $200 in good used condition, I think there is some confusion on one costing $8000 from Italy.  I would price them from both Campbell-Randall as well as Simards. Either company should be able to give you info on their capabilities.  If the 220 volt power requirement is a problem, you can get a 110/220 step up step down transformer for $60 - $80 on Ebay.

Instead of glue, try using a suitable width of double sided tape (non-foam).  Much faster, no mess and no fumes.

I tape before running though the folder.. pull the tape backing off just before folding.  Then after folding, I run the strap through a double needle, walking foot sewing machine.  I can probably cut, tape, fold and sew about 100' of strap per hour.

In the past, I have tried several biasing attachments for sewing machines, but could never get one to work well with leather.  Has anyone else had any success with these? 

Sonydaze,

The machine was only $200!?   That's a hell of a good deal!   I've sent communications to both companies, so hopefully the pricing isn't too bad.

Is there a specific brand of double sided tape that you use that you would suggest?  I saw that Tandy has 2 types of double sided tape, one that is repositionable, the other listed as an adhesive.  

Edited December 13, 2016 by Anubis78

[Sonydaze]

I use some import brand tapes but both Tuck tape and 3M of course are good. Just make sure that it doesn't have a foam centre as it will be too thick. Tandy prices/quality are always suspect.... you don't want a re-positional tape.. lower stick.

I'm curious to see what a new folder costs, please let me know.  Also there is a chance that either company may have a used one.

[Anubis78]

1 hour ago, Sonydaze said:

I use some import brand tapes but both Tuck tape and 3M of course are good. Just make sure that it doesn't have a foam centre as it will be too thick. Tandy prices/quality are always suspect.... you don't want a re-positional tape.. lower stick.

I'm curious to see what a new folder costs, please let me know.  Also there is a chance that either company may have a used one.

Perfect, I'll be on the look out for the tape.

As soon as I get info from both companies, I will let you know.  The German company, Sieck, has both a hand cranked and motorized model.   But again, I've been trying to close on a sale since June... http://www.sieck.de/en/machines/belt-manufacturing/

[RockyAussie]

Ok I've got you some pics but I would probably buy a manufactured machine if under $2000 but all the same it would want to be doing a lot of work to warrant that amount. The metal folding, roller and guillotine machine is quite cheap being about $350 au and is likely cheaper over there. The back roller would need to come out and that is easily done. The main trick here is making up the right size folder tool for the job wanted. In the case here a piece of round stock drilled through and funnelled at the front with either a lathe or a reshaped drill bit would work.A cut through at the top and a bit of hacksaw blade ground down soldered in to assist in keeping central and its mostly done. Hope that helps a bit. Regards Brian

[Anubis78]

Thank youtockyAussie.  I'm definitely leaning towards the Omac machine at this point.  The German machine that I referred to, Sieck, will cost me $900 in guides in addition to the price of the machine.  The Omac can simply be adjusted to get the different folds. 

I have the quote from one Omac dealer and waiting on the other.  

[RockyAussie]

I have several OMAC machines and  mostly found them good. A couple of glue machines and a couple of straight line folders although I have made some modifications to make more useful.I would recommend the adjustable guide model I think as even on some leathers as much as .1mm in thickness can make a piece difficult to slide through and just opening or closing a tweak would be a real advantage. If you get one please post some pics off.

Regards Brian

[Anubis78]

On 12/14/2016 at 0:05 AM, RockyAussie said:

I have several OMAC machines and  mostly found them good. A couple of glue machines and a couple of straight line folders although I have made some modifications to make more useful.I would recommend the adjustable guide model I think as even on some leathers as much as .1mm in thickness can make a piece difficult to slide through and just opening or closing a tweak would be a real advantage. If you get one please post some pics off.

Regards Brian

Brian,

Which glue machines do you have from them and what type of gluing do they do? What modifications did you make on the machines?  I will definitely share pics once I have one.    

[RockyAussie]

In the first pic below ,this glue machine has had a motor and gearbox change. I find it best to use an extraction vent close by to keep fumes down and a small fan to aid in motor cooling. This machine can run up to 3 full days per week. This type can adjust up and down for leather thickness and can have a varying spring pressure. The glue thickness can be varied as well.This type would be good for a light application on your folded strap work.

The second+third pic is a straight edge hand folder which I have modified to foot operation in order to use both hands on the held in piece and enable way faster operation. This machine is good for thick and thin work and putting down high pressure. Mostly good for folded edge wallet type work.

The last pic is a folder that I use when doing hundreds of credit card pocket top folds as it is heated and reactivated the glue which can be applied a day or so before. Also it puts in a crease line at top for better appearance.

Here in these links are some similar machines-https://www.campbell-randall.com/machines/leather-goods-machines/glue-cementing-machines/ict-60-series-solvent-cement-machines/

https://www.campbell-randall.com/machines/leather-goods-machines/folding-machines/model-450rc-600rc-linear-folding-machine/

https://www.campbell-randall.com/machines/leather-goods-machines/folding-machines/model-r350-r500/

In case its of interest they have a Camogo CN411 splitter 2nd hand at moment and if you are getting serious about setting up I would take a look at that if you don't have already.

Man I wish they were here in Australia.

Regards Brain

[Anubis78]

I finally decided to get the OMAC Star3000.   I should have purchased it last December as the price had gone up since my initial quote.  I held out a bit because the vendor didn't have it in stock and it would arrive well past the time I needed it to mass produce leather straps for my suspenders. Once I get it going, I'll report back on how it's working out for me.  

[RockyAussie]

3 hours ago, Anubis78 said:

I finally decided to get the OMAC Star3000.   I should have purchased it last December as the price had gone up since my initial quote.  I held out a bit because the vendor didn't have it in stock and it would arrive well past the time I needed it to mass produce leather straps for my suspenders. Once I get it going, I'll report back on how it's working out for me.  

I just checked out a video on it and i think that should be a very handy machine. Having the guides adjustable that way will make different thicknesses a lot easier to do . Hope it all goes well for you. Brian