Darth vaders codpiece?

[TheGoodSamaritan]

I'm trying to make a replica of Darth Vaders original codpiece from the 1980 movie Star Wars Empire strikes back. A codpiece is the part that covers the crotch. It's made from foam rubber covered with leather. I realise that the rubber foam underneath might be giving the lumpy structure and not the leather it self. It is made in the seventies.

Can anyone see what type of leather it is from these reference photos? Cow, lamb, deer etc? What type of finishing etc? I don't know much about leather so any help you can provide about what type of leather this could be is very appreciated.

http://s6.photobucket.com/user/starwarscollector/media/PropReplicaForum/ESBPromotieposter.jpg.html

 

[CaptQuirk]

I just gotta ask... why?

[TheGoodSamaritan]

I'm making a Movie prop replica costume for display on a mannequin.

[CaptQuirk]

Ok... it isn't for taking "Casual Fridays" to a new level then? I just had to ask... You can never be too sure these days

As for the "leather", it is likely upholstery grade Naugahyde, which is a very rare and hard to find material, since the number of wild Naugas has diminished greatly. If you insist on leather, I would go with 2 oz milled.

[Mattsbagger]

The lumpy look is probably texture on Chome tan leather. A lot of chrome tan has a texture in it to hide imperfections in the leather. I don't see any burnished edges they appear all rolled/turned to me. As to making it. I got nowt. Good luck.

[Red Bear Haraldsson]

Casual Fridays! That would be awesome!

[TheGoodSamaritan]

3 hours ago, Mattsbagger said:

The lumpy look is probably texture on Chome tan leather. A lot of chrome tan has a texture in it to hide imperfections in the leather. I don't see any burnished edges they appear all rolled/turned to me. As to making it. I got nowt. Good luck.

Making them is not a problem. I've made a few that turned out pretty good. Sold those. I overlayed a reference photo in photoshop and they line up perfectly to the original. 

The only thing I have to nail down is the texture of the leather.

I live in a small town in sweden so my only option is to order online. The only leather I've found thin enough is lamb leather. It needs to be thin, about 2 oz for it to look good. Also not too stiff.

However I don't know what to look for. I don't know the correct terms for the type of finish. 

It doesn't have to be the same leather but similar.

So chrome tan and someone mentioned milled leather?

Edited February 21, 2017 by TheGoodSamaritan

[Mattsbagger]

https://www.tandyleather.com/en/product/milled-single-shoulders.         I don't know if this is to heavy or not.And I'm sure many other distributors carry the same style.

Edited February 21, 2017 by Mattsbagger

[kiwican]

I remember as a kid seeing herds of Naugahydes roaming around. Don't see that much anymore. Pretty soon it will be just in zoo's 

[Mattsbagger]

22 minutes ago, kiwican said:

I remember as a kid seeing herds of Naugahydes roaming around. Don't see that much anymore. Pretty soon it will be just in zoo's 

7 yrs ago I delivered Genuine Naugahyde to a plant in southern Wisconsin weekly. They made HD seats. There must still be some around somewhere. 

[kiwican]

I think the Gates foundation has started a small breeding program with the hopes of introducing them back into the wild

[CaptQuirk]

Here is the thing about costumers and sfx people, to add to my "upholstery grade Naugahyde" statement. Even on a big budget film, there are lots of places the money needs to go, and effects people are left short funded. So, it is not unusual, that the original was made from scavenged pleather from a sofa or la z boy recliner. They used a tape recorder for the mech stuff on his chest. That cod piece certainly was not leather though.

[TheGoodSamaritan]

 

10 hours ago, CaptQuirk said:

Here is the thing about costumers and sfx people, to add to my "upholstery grade Naugahyde" statement. Even on a big budget film, there are lots of places the money needs to go, and effects people are left short funded. So, it is not unusual, that the original was made from scavenged pleather from a sofa or la z boy recliner. They used a tape recorder for the mech stuff on his chest. That cod piece certainly was not leather though.

The budget for the first film was very small. 8000 dollars for vaders complete suit. That is nothing. The second movie (which is the costume I'm trying to make) had a lot more since the first movie was such a success.

So are you saying that the cod piece is not leather? Really? Then what the hell is it? Is naugahyde not real leather?

Did you see this picture: http://s6.photobucket.com/user/starwarscollector/media/PropReplicaForum/ESBPromotieposter.jpg.html

 

 

Edited February 22, 2017 by TheGoodSamaritan

[TheGoodSamaritan]

Googled naugahyde. It's pleather. I thought it was some kind of animal haha :D

[TheGoodSamaritan]

Here is a Picture of the backside:

Are you sure this is naugahyde?

[CaptQuirk]

It's hard to tell from these pics, but I'd be willing to bet it isn't leather. But, since they were kind enough to stick a label in it, track them down and ask.

6 hours ago, TheGoodSamaritan said:

Googled naugahyde. It's pleather. I thought it was some kind of animal haha :D

Sorry, I'm like that though... always leave them scratching their heads

[fredk]

I would use 1 to 1.5 mm upholstery leather for this.

Sewing; place two shaped parts grain to grain, sew edges with a saddle stich, turn inside out, pad out with wadding. Fold over and glue the strap lengths

Can't see signs of stiching around that bit on the front. For that I'd cut out the shape on the main piece and glue the insert in place on the inside, pad it out a bit with wadding, then glue a thin lining leather, eg pigskin, over that wadding and the insert part. Assemble as above.

If the original was leather and the insert on the front was sewn; I suppose it was done by cutting out the area, leaving an edge to fold inwards, the insert and welt were sewn to that edge [grain to grain], folding the sewn part against the inside of the front panel. That would keep the stiching hidden

[Mattsbagger]

6 hours ago, TheGoodSamaritan said:

Googled naugahyde. It's pleather. I thought it was some kind of animal haha :D

Vegan leather.hehe

[fredk]

Maybe the original is Wookiee hide?

[billybopp]

The "herd of naugas" joke is an oldie but very much still a goodie!    Marketing departments started actually advertising naugahyde as a "feature" in the 70's - before that it was just vinyl.   I suspect the change came about to set newer more durable vinyl products apart from earlier products that became brittle after a few years.  

Vinyl is pretty useful even for leatherworkers.  It's a great cheap material that behaves much like leather, and can be used to make mockups for stuff.  

I'm pretty sure the original is at least partly vinyl.  If you look at the piping around the center piece you can see a bit of very light color peeking through.  Since garment leather is usually mostly struck through, we wouldn't see that.  The inner liner does look like it might be leather, however, since that does look right for chrome tan (a bluish color).  

I'd also guess that there's some sort of bag stiffener behind the main front piece to help keep that curve.  There's also some sort of stuffing material there to give it thickness, particularly around the bottom edge and behind the center piece to give it fullness.  The piping around the center piece has either no cord or very thin cord.  Outer piece, piping and center piece are probably glued and sewn from the back side.  Front and straps appear to be a single piece of leather, so could take some creative design to get the straps folded over as in the picture.  (forgive the comments about a codpiece with stiffener and stuffing please - I know it's hard to believe that a bad-ass like Vader might need stuffing and stiffening - but then again he had a lot of medical problems - I guess the force can't do everything).  

Even if the original is pleather, there's no reason why you can't make yours from real leather!  Goat is pretty nice to work with in garment weights, but others are fine too.  The surface finishes on garment leathers can vary greatly, so your best bet would be to look at some in person to find the texture that you want.  I have some that is so smooth and shiny that it looks like vinyl, and other with various surface textures and amounts of gloss.   

Oh.  And just to make y'all jealous - I got meet James Earl Jones a couple of years ago when he did a play on Broadway.  His voice is even more amazing in person, and presence on stage is phenomenal.

Bill 

 

[bikermutt07]

I got a nine legged naugine heffer for sale. Answers to the name "Pleather".

Her only got nine legs, she lost one in a fight with the arm of my lazy boy.

[kiwican]

I lead what some people would consider a pretty interesting life. But I have to say that, for me, I never in a million years thought I'd be part of a conversation on Darth Vaders cod piece. This is one for the books 

[kbcubed]

The surface of the cod piece looks like buffalo. The straps likely are lamb.

[TheGoodSamaritan]

14 hours ago, billybopp said:

The "herd of naugas" joke is an oldie but very much still a goodie!    Marketing departments started actually advertising naugahyde as a "feature" in the 70's - before that it was just vinyl.   I suspect the change came about to set newer more durable vinyl products apart from earlier products that became brittle after a few years.  

Vinyl is pretty useful even for leatherworkers.  It's a great cheap material that behaves much like leather, and can be used to make mockups for stuff.  

I'm pretty sure the original is at least partly vinyl.  If you look at the piping around the center piece you can see a bit of very light color peeking through.  Since garment leather is usually mostly struck through, we wouldn't see that.  The inner liner does look like it might be leather, however, since that does look right for chrome tan (a bluish color).  

I'd also guess that there's some sort of bag stiffener behind the main front piece to help keep that curve.  There's also some sort of stuffing material there to give it thickness, particularly around the bottom edge and behind the center piece to give it fullness.  The piping around the center piece has either no cord or very thin cord.  Outer piece, piping and center piece are probably glued and sewn from the back side.  Front and straps appear to be a single piece of leather, so could take some creative design to get the straps folded over as in the picture.  (forgive the comments about a codpiece with stiffener and stuffing please - I know it's hard to believe that a bad-ass like Vader might need stuffing and stiffening - but then again he had a lot of medical problems - I guess the force can't do everything).  

Even if the original is pleather, there's no reason why you can't make yours from real leather!  Goat is pretty nice to work with in garment weights, but others are fine too.  The surface finishes on garment leathers can vary greatly, so your best bet would be to look at some in person to find the texture that you want.  I have some that is so smooth and shiny that it looks like vinyl, and other with various surface textures and amounts of gloss.   

Oh.  And just to make y'all jealous - I got meet James Earl Jones a couple of years ago when he did a play on Broadway.  His voice is even more amazing in person, and presence on stage is phenomenal.

Bill 

 

The construction is a shape cut out in rubber foam covered with leather glued on top.

What you see peeking through is actually yellow rubber foam. The center cut out is a hole in the foam where leather wraps over the ege but it goes only a millimeter or so over the edge. I do this as well. The reason is you get a sharper edge that way.

The picture is taken 30 years later and it has fallen apart a bit so you can see inside a bit.

It's made from real leather, this is confirmed by people who've actually handled the real codpiece in person.

I've made a few in cowhide and also in goat hide. I finally got a shipment yesterday of some really nice lambhide that I think will do the trick. It's really smooth and shiny with a fine grain and has some nice wrinkles in it.

[TheGoodSamaritan]

Is there a way to make the "piping" without actually folding leather all the way through? I want to fold the leather to make piping but is there a way to remove the bulk so the folded leather is as thin as only one piece of leather?