singer 153w Singer 153w Q's and motor stuff

[TheRuggedProject]

I bought a singer 153w for doing binding on heavy canvas and vinyl projects. I am going to set it up as a designated binder machine. I have some questions that I am hoping some of the members might be able to answer for me. 

 

First off, I am confused about why the button for changing stitch length on a 111w is on the 153w because it has a dial on the side? does this serve another purpose? 

I am going to make a custom bracket and use the KHF2 from kwokhing, does anyone know of a higher quality binder head?

This screw (below) adjusts some thing that makes circles, what is it and how do I adjust it properly? 

Does anyone have a motor recommendation for this machine?

I realize that I am bombarding with questions, but any help would be nice.

I am also wondering, does anyone with a 153w have this cloth stuff under the feed dog?

[CowboyBob]

Yes,the 153's have a stitch length dial on the side because there isn't room underneath the small arm for the 111w type.

For adjusting the bobbincase opener,which might not need adjusting look @ # 24 in this manual.http://www.consew.com/Files/112347/PartsBooks/227R-2.pdf

You need to have the plate on when adjusting it & it always needs alittle gap even when it's pulled all the way counterclockwise,I've seen people adjust way too tight & it'll bind the thread.

We have a nice easy to operate 3/4HP servo motor w/a dial speed control that will work real nice on this machine.

The cloth is probably there to hold oil in the bearing,it isn't needed & can be taken out,i've never seen anything like that & have worked on 100's of these over the yrs.

The hole to the right of the screw is for oil.

Edited November 19, 2017 by CowboyBob

[TheRuggedProject]

2 hours ago, CowboyBob said:

Yes,the 153's have a stitch length dial on the side because there isn't room underneath the small arm for the 111w type.

For adjusting the bobbincase opener,which might not need adjusting look @ # 24 in this manual.http://www.consew.com/Files/112347/PartsBooks/227R-2.pdf

You need to have the plate on when adjusting it & it always needs alittle gap even when it's pulled all the way counterclockwise,I've seen people adjust way too tight & it'll bind the thread.

We have a nice easy to operate 3/4HP servo motor w/a dial speed control that will work real nice on this machine.

The cloth is probably there to hold oil in the bearing,it isn't needed & can be taken out,i've never seen anything like that & have worked on 100's of these over the yrs.

The hole to the right of the screw is for oil.

I really appreciate the help! I have a 241-3 that I use, but the mechanisms on this machine are entirely different. I bet over the years of working on these, the components become second nature. What kind of motor do you sell? Is it Brushless?

[CowboyBob]

No,it has brushes,we used to sell them BUT they make alittle more noise when running,didn't have a smooth acceleration when pushing on the pedal,a pain to program & the main reason approx. 2 out of 10 would quit working do to the circuit board burning out.The motor we sell has brushes,is very quiet,has a knob for speed control & accelerates very smoothly as you push on the pedal.I haven't sold the brushless type in 3 yrs & they might have improved the circuit board & the speed control but these have been so truble-free for us that I don't want to change.

[TheRuggedProject]

3 hours ago, CowboyBob said:

No,it has brushes,we used to sell them BUT they make alittle more noise when running,didn't have a smooth acceleration when pushing on the pedal,a pain to program & the main reason approx. 2 out of 10 would quit working do to the circuit board burning out.The motor we sell has brushes,is very quiet,has a knob for speed control & accelerates very smoothly as you push on the pedal.I haven't sold the brushless type in 3 yrs & they might have improved the circuit board & the speed control but these have been so truble-free for us that I don't want to change.

I appreciate that, however, if I get a servo motor I wanted it to be brushless so that I did not have to worry about changing brushes. Thank you for the offer though. Although, the circuit board burning concerns me. I will look around and see what I can find.  Thanks for the help. 

[480volt]

Brushes in a well designed motor don’t wear out like the brakes on your car, they last a long time and typically are easy to replace. I would put a much higher premium on reliability than on a perceived need to do periodic maintenance.

[CowboyBob]

Yes,the brushes seem to last a long time,IDK of anyone who's had to change them yet & we have a lot of people using them.It comes w/a extra set of brushes & the brush covers are on the outside & might takes 1-minute each to change IF or when needed.But there is a lot of brushless motors out there to choose from.

[TheRuggedProject]

 

13 hours ago, CowboyBob said:

Yes,the brushes seem to last a long time,IDK of anyone who's had to change them yet & we have a lot of people using them.It comes w/a extra set of brushes & the brush covers are on the outside & might takes 1-minute each to change IF or when needed.But there is a lot of brushless motors out there to choose from.

That sounds very interesting to me. I am currently trying to decide between that, and the consew csm1000. They are both around the same price, but I have hear better things about the familysew. Does anybody have any opinion on this matter?

[Wizcrafts]

7 hours ago, TheRuggedProject said:

 

That sounds very interesting to me. I am currently trying to decide between that, and the consew csm1000. They are both around the same price, but I have hear better things about the familysew. Does anybody have any opinion on this matter?

I have had both types of servo motor on various sewing machines. When I first got my CB4500, it had a push button, brushless servo motor installed. That motor quit without warning after one week of owning it. I received a free replacement, which was a slightly newer version of the same design. I had to create a custom varying density light filter to get smooth slow speed control. It lasted about 2 years, then it croaked.

I replaced that motor with a rotary switch controlled Family Sew F?-550s, with a very small pulley, in late 2014 or early 2015, and it has performed flawlessly ever since. The brushes still work fine. It came with an extra set of brushes and a spare cork brake for when they are eventually needed.

One of the foibles of the push button servo motors was the way you changed parameters by pushing so many times on the up and down arrows. You literally had to cycle past unwanted options to get to the startup and top speed controls. One of those push button options was to reverse the direction the motor spun, as I found out the hard way! No more push button servos for me!

[CowboyBob]

 

5 hours ago, Wizcrafts said:

I have had both types of servo motor on various sewing machines. When I first got my CB4500, it had a push button, brushless servo motor installed. That motor quit without warning after one week of owning it. I received a free replacement, which was a slightly newer version of the same design. I had to create a custom varying density light filter to get smooth slow speed control. It lasted about 2 years, then it croaked.

I replaced that motor with a rotary switch controlled Family Sew F?-550s, with a very small pulley, in late 2014 or early 2015, and it has performed flawlessly ever since. The brushes still work fine. It came with an extra set of brushes and a spare cork brake for when they are eventually needed.

One of the foibles of the push button servo motors was the way you changed parameters by pushing so many times on the up and down arrows. You literally had to cycle past unwanted options to get to the startup and top speed controls. One of those push button options was to reverse the direction the motor spun, as I found out the hard way! No more push button servos for me!

Wiz,do you notice a difference in the way the slow speed operates as you push on the pedal?Also did the brushless ones you have make a noise?

[Wizcrafts]

On 11/21/2017 at 5:34 AM, CowboyBob said:

 

Wiz,do you notice a difference in the way the slow speed operates as you push on the pedal?Also did the brushless ones you have make a noise?

I am guessing that the first part of your question is referring to the Family Sew motors. If so, yes, there is something about the way the control lever is fastened to the shaft that controls the speed that makes the motor begin to slow down as you push hard on the pedal to speed up. It might be twisting or deflecting the speed controller inside the case when the chain from the floor pedal is on an angle. I found that I had to rig a large C clamp to the pedestal base to make the chain line up below the control lever to negate this effect. For some reason, some of these motors favor a direct vertical axis pull to achieve the full range of control. Could be the case, or the bearing moving. I dunno.

It is only the top speed that is affected by the off-axis pull on the chain. Slow speeds are awesome and I can easily keep the CB4500 sewing at 1 stitch every 4 seconds, if I need to. In fact, when I set the speed dial all the way to the slowest setting, I can floor the pedal and it will sew at about 1 stitch per second. I set it there whenever I sew fishtails onto belts and straps.

Answer to part two.

Yes, the first brushless (push button) motor did make a slight rattling sound under certain loads and speeds. The last unit was pretty quiet though. I believe it was more powerful. But, it suffered from a sharp ramp up from off to slow. That's why I installed a gradient light beam filter that I got from Steve (as per a YouTube tutorial someone posted). The filter gave the motor really nice slow speed startup control. Unfortunately, there was a slight hiccup at a certain point that I never got rid of. I learned to feather past that dead spot. My current Family  Sew motors don't have this problem.

I hope this helps.

[TheRuggedProject]

How does one attach a control panel (like the cp-18) onto a machine? I assume it plugs directly into the motor. Would this even work on a vintage machine?

[Wizcrafts]

12 hours ago, TheRuggedProject said:

How does one attach a control panel (like the cp-18) onto a machine? I assume it plugs directly into the motor. Would this even work on a vintage machine?

What are you referring to when you say control panel? Are you referring to the internal electronics, or the external on/off switch box? Or, perchance, to a positioner?

[R8R]

18 hours ago, TheRuggedProject said:

How does one attach a control panel (like the cp-18) onto a machine? I assume it plugs directly into the motor. Would this even work on a vintage machine?

Like a Juki CP-18?

You would need a motor control to plug it into. Then a motor that works with the motor control. Then a sewing machine that is designed to accept all the do-dads and compressed air fittings to work with the motor and motor control (foot lift solenoids, etc).

So...no.

One thing that will work with older machines is a motor that has a built in needle positioner function. You add a synchronizer to the end of the handwheel, plug it into the motor and then you can use the treadle in heel up/down fashion to position the needle when you back off the throttle (needle buried at the end of a seam, etc). That's about as fancy as it gets with vintage machines unless you wan to reverse engineer something more elaborate.

[TheRuggedProject]

5 hours ago, R8R said:

Like a Juki CP-18?

You would need a motor control to plug it into. Then a motor that works with the motor control. Then a sewing machine that is designed to accept all the do-dads and compressed air fittings to work with the motor and motor control (foot lift solenoids, etc).

So...no.

One thing that will work with older machines is a motor that has a built in needle positioner function. You add a synchronizer to the end of the handwheel, plug it into the motor and then you can use the treadle in heel up/down fashion to position the needle when you back off the throttle (needle buried at the end of a seam, etc). That's about as fancy as it gets with vintage machines unless you wan to reverse engineer something more elaborate.

Oh, I see. Thank you, I was just curious if it was possible. Has anyone added a pneumatic foot lift to a vintage machine? Or does that also require a new machine.

Edited November 26, 2017 by TheRuggedProject