Juki 1508NH : Problems with corner stitches - bobbin thread coming up

[mikesc]

off topic somewhat..but to reply to your specific question..
From the various places ( including here in past threads ) all over the internet ( including Chinese sewing machine manufacturers, who I came across a few years ago, who say that they make parts for Juki ( and others ) and sometimes large assemblies ) and also some of the French Juki distributors ( and some others in Europe )..When I found my Juki DLU 490-4 a few years ago, I searched all over the web ( it is how I found "here" ), phoned a lot of suppliers and distributors, and manufacturers in China, looking for information on the machine, and parts availability, and in particular a set of feet ( what you would call "gauges" ) , many times I got told, "old machine" , "some parts available" "none in Japan" "but maybe in China as they are making a lot of Juki parts and assemblies now"..None of the people had what I wanted ( I only ever saw the "gauge set" I was looking for on a photo of a machine in a used machine sale in the USA..But two Juki distributors told me that a lot of Juki parts were being made in China for the more recent machines..China gets , IMO, and IME, a bad rep for quality, you want to pay the Chinese a good price for top quality work , or machines, or parts, that is what you'll get, "top quality"..want to pay them barely over their cost, you'll get rough quality.Both kinds of quality frequently get "rebadged" and "re-origined" as westerners tend not to have much confidence in goods labelled "made in China".

Like leatherwear..most of the brands names of leatherwear ( particularly "biker wear" ) in the USA are actually made in Pakistan ( I know because I know some of the Pakistanis who are making "Made in USA" and Made in France"..for the big brand names...someone here the other day wanted a pattern for a CCW vest..they linked out to a company whose vests I know the maker of..I know how much they are paying, I know the MOQs for OEM, the website that they linked to does not say our leatherwear is "Made' in Pakistan"..but at least it doesn't say "Made in USA"..some sites do claim that..

I've designed for people in many countries over a long time , and seen where a lot of things are actually made, as opposed to where the brands would like their customers to think that they are made.

I just took delivery of some items direct from Japan..open the delivery, inside, half of them came in packaging saying China ( PRC ) ..two others said Taiwan.

A lot of stuff is not entirely from where we are told, or not entirely assembled where we are led to believe..as long as the quality is good, and everyone involved ( including the people on the production line ) are getting paid a fair rate, and no kids are making it when they should be playing or in school, I don't mind. But I'd prefer honest labelling..strange thing is, some "end customers" wouldn't.

Edited December 6, 2017 by mikesc

[brmax]

52.3mm/2.059 is pretty spot on needle bar dimension when using the 190system needle im using.  

I made a habit to write adjustment date and figures in my manual. Its helped in my experiences.  With that I wanted to mention a setting for what they term Alternate momentum pg. 24-25 I have set at A: wf .135” &  B: pf .144” this may not mean much but wanted to list it. 

1. As for your question, on mine my feed dog seems? to be flush with top surface when needle is touching a piece of paper put between them, yet when I lower “carefully” presser foot I seem to have .010” free space under outer presser foot and walker obviously is compressed .010” from feed dog Rising. This is on 0 stitch

2. On mine yes the set screws look to be as manual recommends 9 & 6, on the clock so to say,  also I found it handy and noted it the clutch reset button can be freely depressed at this point. There is a hair bit of BDC slack movement but anyhow its a note. 

3. Speaking from the last adjustment positions ( yes my feed dog is stationary ) but them adjustments require stitch be on 0.

If using the push button at BDC i can hit both the points, down and up while depressing the reset button, and i tried setting most of these with a dial indicator. This was in my attempt to learn something  about these. As my experience goes toward heavy equipment and diesel. I sure couldnt move ahead on these machines without the help on Leather Worker, and imho i should leave more to the pros that do this daily and have for most of there lives. With that im going back to the porch, I’ve barked enough.

 

good day

Floyd

 

ps: the 1541 manual is interesting but mine totally needs and has its separate binder.

 

[mikesc]

I meant also to say thank you to showtime, that is an awful lot of highly detailed information, and laid out extremely clearly, about the particular machine which we would not be able to get normally unless we spoke Japanese..thanks also to your wife :)

I came close to buying ( missed it ) a Juki 1508NH last year..if another comes along at a good price ( and I can sneak in yet another piece of equipment without my wife noticing ) I'd like one, and this thread ( with all of the posters inputs ) and that detail about what the settings should be are invaluable.

Edited December 6, 2017 by mikesc

[showtime]

4 hours ago, brmax said:

52.3mm/2.059 is pretty spot on needle bar dimension when using the 190system needle im using.  

I made a habit to write adjustment date and figures in my manual. Its helped in my experiences.  With that I wanted to mention a setting for what they term Alternate momentum pg. 24-25 I have set at A: wf .135” &  B: pf .144” this may not mean much but wanted to list it. 

1. As for your question, on mine my feed dog seems? to be flush with top surface when needle is touching a piece of paper put between them, yet when I lower “carefully” presser foot I seem to have .010” free space under outer presser foot and walker obviously is compressed .010” from feed dog Rising. This is on 0 stitch

2. On mine yes the set screws look to be as manual recommends 9 & 6, on the clock so to say,  also I found it handy and noted it the clutch reset button can be freely depressed at this point. There is a hair bit of BDC slack movement but anyhow its a note. 

3. Speaking from the last adjustment positions ( yes my feed dog is stationary ) but them adjustments require stitch be on 0.

If using the push button at BDC i can hit both the points, down and up while depressing the reset button, and i tried setting most of these with a dial indicator. This was in my attempt to learn something  about these. As my experience goes toward heavy equipment and diesel. I sure couldnt move ahead on these machines without the help on Leather Worker, and imho i should leave more to the pros that do this daily and have for most of there lives. With that im going back to the porch, I’ve barked enough.

 

good day

Floyd

 

ps: the 1541 manual is interesting but mine totally needs and has its separate binder.

 

Thanks for your response Floyd,

i truly wish I would had evaluated my machine and recorded measurements for all of the adjustments in the engineer's manual when it was new and before use.  Unfortunately, I didn't really know enough about the nuts and bolts of these nor did I have the experience to know that I should do such a thing.  

I will definitely be recording the adjustments made, just wish I had a good baseline from when the machine was new. Hopefully any new machine owner onlookers will take the advice to learn about their machine and take some measurements early on (but don't loosen screws or make changes until you know what you are doing).

1.)  When you say " lower “carefully” presser foot" is this by rotating the hand wheel?  So it sounds like the needle, feed dog, and throat plate all align but the inner foot is raised .010"?    If that's the case your machine seems to mostly match the manual, aside from the inner foot being off .010" (which can easily be adjusted with the eccentric specified in 10.2.)  However, I suspect that variance is not a big deal and I wouldn't mess with it if it is sewing good.  Still not even sure if the manual is the gold standard or just a good baseline.

2.) Interesting observation about the clutch reset button when the bottom shaft pulley has set screws at 9 & 6 o'clock.  When my bottom shaft is oriented that way I experience the same thing, however I do not experience that when my needle is at bottom dead center (obviously since my bottom shaft doesn't seem to be synced to my needle perfectly and isn't in the 9 & 6 o'clock position). This is useful though, it at least tells me that my bottom pulley is in the right position on the lower shaft (again not even sure it is possible for it not to be, since I haven't taken that apart yet.)

3.) Your feed dog is stationary when the needle is at dead bottom and you move the reverse lever?   I think this adjustment has to be checked with a stitch length more than 0 (10.1 specifies max stitch length) otherwise you wont have any reverse movement on the lever.

 

I also agree that the 1541 is a different machine and should be treated as such.  My inquiring brain is just curious to the reasoning in the engineering, I have to be careful because sometimes curiosity kills the cat!

 

Thanks Floyd, truly appreciate you taking the time to respond and share some of you notes.  

Edited December 6, 2017 by showtime

[showtime]

2 hours ago, mikesc said:

I meant also to say thank you to showtime, that is an awful lot of highly detailed information, and laid out extremely clearly, about the particular machine which we would not be able to get normally unless we spoke Japanese..thanks also to your wife

I came close to buying ( missed it ) a Juki 1508NH last year..if another comes along at a good price ( and I can sneak in yet another piece of equipment without my wife noticing ) I'd like one, and this thread ( with all of the posters inputs ) and that detail about what the settings should be are invaluable.

No problem, unfortunately though I have only really stated possible problems and no real answers.  However, I will continue to provide updates along this journey and we will hopefully get this resolved soon.  Once it's all said and done, I feel like I will have a good understanding of how to get these LU-1500 series machines set up to factory specifications.

It has been helpful communicating with Juki - Tokyo, they have gone above and beyond what I would have expected any manufacturer to do in assisting us.  At this point, our Juki contact is meeting with a specialist and will be getting back to us before the end of this week.

[brmax]

Good afternoon

re checking #3 question. In doing this without a dial indicator its splitting hairs. 

So another observation in checking bdc of needle and better i suppose is looking in the end door at the linkage connector at the needle bar. This seems to me another viewable way to gauge BDC. With this i have to retract my saying having the ability to press the reset button at bdc by the measurement of splitting a hair. But any way thats my settings for now. With this machine at bdc and a maximum stitch setting I have no movement in the feed dog. Though again taking a sip of coffee and rotating the pulley top toward me maybe 1/8” I can push totally down on the reset splitting that hair it bottoms the button and just enough this results in a slight movement of the feed dog fore and aft when applying the reverse lever. 

For some reason related to this adjustment I noted in the manual on 10.1B as this is an NH.   I noted in the side bar

@ needle bar bdc   This is  apita

 

And thats noteworthy

Floyd

[richA25]

Reviving an old thread!
 

Was this issue ever solved? I purchased a Juki 1541s new and am experiencing the same problem. It worked perfectly fine sewing through thick leather assemblies, and through layers of cordura/nylon until recently. When turning my work, the thread would pull upwards and look like a 45 degree stitch as opposed to a neat 90 degree stitch. Changing needles, thread, or tension, doesn’t alleviate anything. I attached an image below and highlighted the issue. This was just scrap leather that i was experimenting on tension trying to fix the issue so excuse all the tension issues.

[richA25]

And to clarify- I’ve changed fabrics (down to two layers of cotton poplin for (PPE masks), needles, thread. Same issue. 

my maintenance guy is out of shop during the pandemic so That’s currently not an option. It just started recently (after a year of no issues), and don’t recall any specific event that may have disrupted timing. 
 

Has there been any reported fixes to this over the years?