Just curious about western holsters in the old days

[Dwight]

1 hour ago, chuck123wapati said:

I'm reading a great book right now, The Great Plains by Walter Prescott Webb. It breaks down the use of weaponry during the years of westward migration. With the invention of the revolver being one of the primary reasons we could begin to establish ourselves on the great plains, and why the the Spanish gave up. Before 1840s, roughly,  all weapons' were single shot and most folks were advised on their weapons of choice by the people who put the wagon trains together. The Texas Rangers proved the worth of the revolver as a mounted weapon of choice that put them at even or a bit better than those they were fighting. Before that the Indians, and i mean no disrespect, had the upper hand and simply waited till the single shot was fired then rode in a filled their enemy with arrows. Its a great read for those wanting to understand the real reasons the west was won. 

Not sure which one . . . but if my cousin was here . . . she could probably look in one of her books and tell  ua how Walter Prescott Webb is related to us. . . . and which cousin he is . . . lol.

One of the great things in my "Webb" family is the two threads that seem to run rampant thru the family . . . wanting to know how something WAS done . . . or wanting to know how to DO something for the first time.  This one was a past tense chaser.

But, thanks . . . I'll have to check that book out . . . I'll probably like it even if it didn't have the Webb moniker on it.

May God bless,

Dwight

[chuck123wapati]

1 hour ago, Dwight said:

Not sure which one . . . but if my cousin was here . . . she could probably look in one of her books and tell  ua how Walter Prescott Webb is related to us. . . . and which cousin he is . . . lol.

One of the great things in my "Webb" family is the two threads that seem to run rampant thru the family . . . wanting to know how something WAS done . . . or wanting to know how to DO something for the first time.  This one was a past tense chaser.

But, thanks . . . I'll have to check that book out . . . I'll probably like it even if it didn't have the Webb moniker on it.

May God bless,

Dwight

Wow that's neat info indeed. Its a great book so and discusses real facts about the history of the GP from Spanish exploration to government policies of the time. I too am a genealogy nut to the point of having my dna on ancestry, a person would be surprised where the old blood line has been lol. 

[Dwight]

10 hours ago, chuck123wapati said:

Wow that's neat info indeed. Its a great book so and discusses real facts about the history of the GP from Spanish exploration to government policies of the time. I too am a genealogy nut to the point of having my dna on ancestry, a person would be surprised where the old blood line has been lol. 

Me too even . . . on the DNA from Ancestry.com . . . my wife's was basically England with a tad from Irelend tossed into the mix.

Mine hit the Heinz 57 . . . but the funny part was  I was always told German, Dutch, English, Irish, and Native American.  Ancestry  nixed the German and Dutch . . . added East Med (Israeli or close by) . . . French . . . Scottish . . . Nordic and way over in Eastern Europe . . . 

I'm planning on getting some good stories once i'm walking the streets of gold . . . find them all and get the fact line on what went down . . . 

But thanks again . . . on the book . . . Ebay had a paperback for 6 bucks delivered . . . it'll be one of my "lavatory library" tomes . . . 

May God bless,

Dwight

[chuck123wapati]

8 hours ago, Dwight said:

Me too even . . . on the DNA from Ancestry.com . . . my wife's was basically England with a tad from Irelend tossed into the mix.

Mine hit the Heinz 57 . . . but the funny part was  I was always told German, Dutch, English, Irish, and Native American.  Ancestry  nixed the German and Dutch . . . added East Med (Israeli or close by) . . . French . . . Scottish . . . Nordic and way over in Eastern Europe . . . 

I'm planning on getting some good stories once i'm walking the streets of gold . . . find them all and get the fact line on what went down . . . 

But thanks again . . . on the book . . . Ebay had a paperback for 6 bucks delivered . . . it'll be one of my "lavatory library" tomes . . . 

May God bless,

Dwight

58% England , Wales , northwestern Europe    31% Ireland and Scotland   7% Scandinavian  plus a few others  but Ancestry has changed the percentages a few times as they get more info.  When I first added it I was much more Scandinavian lol. Its an amazing thing that the good lord could give us the knowledge and ability to understand our roots, I think the world would be a better place if everyone knew where they came from and who they really were.

[Dwight]

1 hour ago, chuck123wapati said:

58% England , Wales , northwestern Europe    31% Ireland and Scotland   7% Scandinavian  plus a few others  but Ancestry has changed the percentages a few times as they get more info.  When I first added it I was much more Scandinavian lol. Its an amazing thing that the good lord could give us the knowledge and ability to understand our roots, I think the world would be a better place if everyone knew where they came from and who they really were.

In truth . . . we do live in a very small world . . . Europeans have lots of relatives here . . . we have lots of relatives there . . . most of which do not know one another . . . 

I read one time that if you knew all of the friends of all your friends . . . to go out 26 generations of friends knowing friends . . . you would know everyone in the world.  Sobering thought . . . 

But like you . . . I think it would do a lot of good if we all could see better the roots that make us who we are . . . physically, mentally, and emotionally.  Racism and bigotry would take a serious nose dive if a lot of people actually knew ALL of their ancestry.

The perfect example is one of the most racist bigots ever . . . Oprah . . . who claims she is super glad that two DNA tests proved there is no white people in her ancestry . . . but I've got news for her . . . she did not get that lighter skin tone by not going out in the sun. 

There's a white boy or two back there somewhere in her makeup . . . 

May God bless,

Dwight

 

[SickMick]

On 5/28/2020 at 2:22 PM, Professor said:

I've seen an 1880's type partly canvas ammunition belt, possibly an army issue item, for the 45-70 cartridge that had a drop loop added to it for a holster. The holster was missing. No telling when the loop was added on.

The canvas belt with leather bullet loops was military issue in the 1870's. Custer's men had them (unfortunately) at Little Big Horn. They were also using copper cartridges. The leather caused severe verdigris on the cartridges causing the heads to tear off the cartridges when they were extracted rendering their '73 Trapdoor rifles useless in many cases. Thus, the move away from copper.....

 

...and just a couple other comments......

The "Slim Jim" started out (most likely) when the flaps were simply cut off military flap holsters. In the western deserts, the need for rain protection was minimal so the flap wasn't as necessary. Eventually they were just made without the flap.

Holsters changed again when the cartridge guns came along mostly because of the size of the belt loop on the back of the holster, which simply wasn't large enough for a belt filled with cartridges to slip through. The military came out with several evolutions with larger belt loops, but soldiers during the later years of the Apache Wars (lasting from 1861 to the 1880's) would usually toss the military issued holsters and opt for a "Mexican Loop" style holster which gave them the needed room and eliminated the need to wear 2 belts, one for the holster and one for cartridges. It's hot here, so you can't blame them.

This is a great thread! Thanks for all the info. The history of gun leather is quite fascinating. I've been studying them for years. I'm lucky enough to get to do period holsters for many of the reinactors in Tombstone. It seems there is always something new to learn.