Lurker turned member!

[leathertropes]

Hello all!

I’ve been lurking for a while, although not nearly long enough (always more reading to do), but I figured it was time to jump in and join the action!  Which is actually my first thought, how should I ‘jump in’?  

So far I have invested minimal money: some basic stamping tools, leather scraps, couple of dyes and “finishes”, gum trag, one edge beveler - that sort of stuff.  I also have 3 double shoulders from W&C that I picked up on a special that are begging to be turned into something.  

The list of things I don’t have is of course larger.  I actually started listing things and then realized I pretty much don’t have anything that wasn’t already listed above.  So I’d say I’m about 2% of the way there .  Perhaps most notably missing is nothing to attach leather to other bits of leather, e.g. pricking irons and awl, stitching chisels, sewing machine.  I also feel naked without a strap cutter but perhaps that’s a topic for another time.  
 

I’m stuck scratching my head wondering how to continue, or more specifically where to invest money to get my feet of the ground and get up and running.  I can already here some of the questions being typed so I’ll try to preemptively answer a few, knowing full well that I’ll forget something and then you guys, if willing, will let me know what I missed. 
 

Q: Business or hobby?

A: Hobby to start - making things for myself and friends and family, that sort of stuff.  But I would like to be successful enough to turn it into a business if possible.  Even if not a fully fledged business then hopefully make some money on the side, or at least enough to have it pay for the hobby side of it.  Business though would actually be the end goal.  (Is there room for any more leather businesses or am I coming into this at an ok time?  Or would I be wasting my time?)

 

Q: What do you want to make?

A: Everything !!!  All joking aside I’d probably start with some easy stuff like strap goods before moving to something a little more difficult like card holders then wallets.  Eventually I would like to make bigger things like purses and bags.  Not necessarily have a “speciality” per se, but be able to make anything reasonable with the right leather, tools, and knowledge at my disposal.  If a niche were to come naturally, I wouldn’t lean away from it though.

Q: Money situation?

A: I’m not made of money.  I’m currently taking care of some health issues and am not working so money is kind of tight.  I’d like to spend it as wisely as possible.  I do, however, have time on my hands. 
 

Now would also be a good time to state the obvious: I do not expect to become a master leather craftsman overnight and be set up with a shop tomorrow with a line around the building.  

My question to you all is the money, where should I invest my money?  It seems like a goal would be to obtain a sewing machine.  I have it in my mind that what would make the difference between a hobby and a hobby where I might make some money, is a sewing machine.  I know that thinking that way might actually be my first mistake; is it?

Intuition is telling me to start smaller.  Gosh darn that intuition!  I feel like the natural course would be to buy some stitching chisels, build a stitching pony, and start saddle stitching away.  Pay my dues as it were, and only after countless hours mastering the saddle stitch, then, and only then, can I even think about getting a sewing machine.  Maybe I’m looking in the wrong places but when I see a set of stitching chisels for $250, I am left wondering why I wouldn’t just save up and put that money towards a machine.  I mean that’s 10% of a new Cobra Class 26!  Am I getting ahead of myself?

Actually I know that answer to be a yes because I always overthink things and then nothing ever gets done because I never leave the planning stage for fear that my plan is wrong or misguided somehow.  So I guess that’s as good a place as any to leave it for now!  How would you guys and gals do it if you were in my shoes trying to get break into the biz, or if you could start over how would you do it?  Or not do it at all?

 

 

TLDR; I’m a noob wondering if trying to make it in this business these days is a fool’s errand?  If it’s not, how would you go about it?  Start as quickly and cheaply as possible or save up for some gear that would help in the long run?  

[PastorBob]

Welcome to the forum, from SW Missouri....you have definitely put some thought into this.  My suggestion would be buy the tools you need to do the job at hand.  If strap goods, then maybe get a strap cutter.  When you decide to get into stitching, get some chisels.  I started out the same way you did.  As I made products for family, friends, and neighbors, I charged according to my skill level.  Both parties were happy, and I had money to go buy more supplies.  As my skill increased, I charged a little more and was able to buy more tools, stuff to enhance my hobby.  There are many ways to go about it.  Look for inexpensive items as well.  Get you a granite slab for next to nothing from a counter top company nearby (a sink cutout).  Ask your friends if they have a cutting mat they're not using.

But when you buy tools, don't go cheap.  Find decent quality tools at reasonable (hard to do these days) prices.  Tandy would be the bottom for me.  Don't buy the cheap stuff from overseas on Amazon.  The quality is just not always there.  It's a crap shoot.  Weaver, Springfield Leather, and others have good tools.  You will pay a little more for them, but you won't be disappointed. 

Also, don't buy a tool for something you can do without, until you can afford to get it to save you some time.  An example is a corner punch.  You can get a nice corner punch for several dollars, but at the same time, you can trace around a round object then cut with an utility knife, then sand smooth.

I am sure there will be much more info coming your way, but you may also want to search through the forum.  This question gets asked from time to time.

[Tugadude]

Welcome!  

[chuck123wapati]

welcome!!! the search feature is you friend tons of answers to your questions already. I agree with the pastors recommendation, buy tools as you need them for projects then slowly expand as your abilities grow. 

"leather work" covers products from car seats to watch straps, wallets to armor. you need to decide what you are going to make, that will point you to the right tools and what your needs will be

1.i would suggest you start with hand sewing because you will at some point have to learn it plus it makes more of an impression for customers buying handmade stuff. Hand sewn (wow ) machine sewn (meh) no matter which is better one sounds better and more personal. PS machine sewing is an art also that needs training and experience and a learning curve easily as hard as hand sewing.

you need to connect any leather together some how so sewing stuff is a must have, hand sewing is cheapest to start you don't need a 250 dollar chisel set you need two chisels a multi tooth and a double tooth what ever stitch length fits your project. rivets and snaps are a need. a maul or hammer, and a stitching pony. a sewing machine is a very large investment that leaves you in the red for quite a while, think how many wallets will it take to pay off, and no one machine can sew all leather, takes up permanent space in your shop. 

2. stamping and tooling is optional you don't absolutely need them to make fine leather goods. So buy these as needed or when you decide to try tooling or stamping, which are kind of the same but different. I didn't tool or stamp at all for years after I  started, just worked on the basic processes to make nice looking plain stuff which a lot of people prefer. I still make mostly plain holsters and belts.

3. you need finishing stuff glue, dyes, and sealers, conditioners. and a way to apply them.

4. cutting, you can get by with any number of cutting tools you probably already have in you home, knives and cutting boards etc. sharpening tools. But a strap cutter is a must imo doesn't have to be expensive but it saves tons of time as almost any project takes a strap or two it seems. 

8. think outside the box when thinking about tools you can make many and probably have many good substitutes already laying around or you can pick them up at the local hardware store, flea market, yard sale, dollar store.

Good luck and welcome, post your stuff for us to see!! and ask questions.

[bruce johnson]

The big thing to jump from hobby to business is to figure out what is your target market and how will you reach them? Your town or local area will likely not support a business but might support a decent hobby income stream. That just depends on what you make or want to make.

The kind of things that sell off a good website or at a boutique or specialty shop wont sell at most craft fairs. Making custom or personalized items, stock items, or both?

Pricing? You have to know your costs, and all of your costs. The leather is generally the cheapest thing in a product. Bob Brenner sells a book on pricing leather goods.

You mentioned a sewing machine. Yes, yes and yes if you are looking to make money.. I started out handsewing and got pretty proficient and decently productive. Marked with a $5 Tandy overstitcher, two needles, awl, and most days - 6 SPI at an inch a minute. Pretty soon after they came out I bought a Tippmann Boss hand crank machine, later upgraded to an Adler 205 and eventually now we have two Ferdcos and a Singer cylinder arm.  If you are competing with most products and looking for income, then you need to either put them out faster or accept you are working for pennies against their dollars, been there. The new guy starting out generally will not have the reputation and be able to command the price that pays for the time of handsewing. The customers that will seek that out and pay for it are not the new guy's customers generally. 

I just finished writing a series of articles in ShopTalk magazine about upgrading tools from the basics - what type of tools to upgrade and where to get them, my order of importance, and how to get them paid for. It is way too lengthy to write here and I'm not sure I'd even have the rights to do it since they have published it. I've received a LOT of positive feedback on it.

Take classes and read. The internet is full of great information now along with a bit of real crap. There are two major magazines for leather crafting - Leather Crafters and Saddlers Journal and ShopTalk!. Both I think are a real plus to subscribe to. Both of these magazines also sponsor leather trade shows. There are leather classes at shows and some classes in private shops. I used to take a lot of classes at shows when that was about the only source of information besides print. The hands-on and visual aspects help a lot in person vs on a screen. My wife took men's wallet and women's wallet classes at the Sheridan WY show a few years ago  from Jerry Van Amburg. She walked out with two wallets and the skills to make them. She's made a bunch since then with exotic leathers or stamped patterns.  If they are not gifts, they are $150-200 word of mouth. Same with a tote bag class last year that Aron Heizer taught. she came home with a workable pattern and skills and a bunch of tote bags have gone out the door too. She's having fun! These classes flatten the learning curve and get you to making things that sell.  

 

[leathertropes]

Thank you all for the welcome!

 

@PastorBob Grabbed a granite slab from a local place for $5 when I was starting out.  I started with some stamping/tooling on thick leather, which is an art unto itself, and realized that might not be the way I want  to go as I don't think I am artistic enough for it.  Basket/geometric stamping might be more up my alley but I am certainly no Don Gonzalez!  So that means I have a mallet already.  Thanks for the reminder on the using round items for corners.  Are utility/xacto knives preferred?  I have one and extra blades.  One question I keep asking myself is should I buy "real" knives that need re-sharpening, or stick with disposable blades?  I like the idea of when a blade gets dull, just snap it off and wham bam thank you mam we're back in business.  But... then I see the Chartermade xacto style blade and I think that's got to be better in the long run, but it, plus the handle, is like $75 and I think that's not a necessary expenditure right now if i can get by with my cheap xacto (none of the other Chartermade blades speak to me, maybe they would if I had the dough).  Looks like it's onto stitching tools.

 

@chuck123wapati Good advice, thank you.  I'm not totally unfamiliar with noobs coming onto forums and asking the same questions that have been asked hundreds of times so I will definitely take the approach of "utfse".  Yeah the $250 (Crimson) stitching chisels are probably not where I need to start.  I can see starting cheaper.  I do think Pastor Bob is right though, on 'when necessary, buy quality'.  I think I read on this forum "Buy once, cry once." and that has always stuck with me.  The thought of constantly replacing cheap tools makes me cringe.  Regarding hand stitching, I can see it viable for smaller goods (watch straps, wallets, dog collars) but hand stitching an entire belt seems like it would take forever.  But like I said I do have time and I do understand the appeal of it to the customer.  

Then again not everything has to be stitched.  Dog collars, leashes, and some belts can all be a single piece of leather, if you pick the right leather.  That, and color bleed are some other areas I need to read up on more.  

Rivets and snaps are definitely in my near near future, along with a strap cutter.  I also need to read up on glues, more specifically water based vs what I can get down the road at Lowes.

I have Atom wax or balm I think it's called, from Fiebings; also Angelus acrylic finisher.  Maybe I need some tan-kote, again more reading needs to be done on my part.

I can be more resourceful with other things as well.  I have a lathe and some maple so I was going to turn my own burnisher.  If I get a sewing machine, yeah it would definitely take time to pay for itself.  I was also going to do canvas/leather bags, so having some extra linen/canvas laying around would be useful for edge finishing.

 

@bruce johnson I need to do more market research, absolutely.  Ideally in a perfect world, I would keep a stock of production goods - belts, wallets, stuff like that - ready to go while I made one-offs of custom bags or purses and stuff like that.  But that's in a "perfect world" haha.  Man, typing all this out makes me realize I haven't done nearly enough research.  Turning a pipe dream into reality...

I will look at that article as it sounds right up my alley, also the book regarding pricing.  I've heard of one "formula" on how to price goods, but figured that it will be different in the beginning vs later on.  I kind of thought, perhaps naively, that the pricing would kind of come natural, but as I type that out I can see where that might be a pitfall.

I really see no way around a sewing machine.  You mentioned a single stitching machine, would you recommend that as an intermediary to an actual machine, or just save up and get the real deal?  Again: buy once, cry once?  I've been looking at Cobra/Cowboy machines and their equivalents - or perhaps I should say their Juki counterparts???  Small to medium duty as I don't see anything too heavy duty in my future.  Although ironically I do live in a rural area that might be more open to heavier duty goods.  Again, a place I need to research more.

I'll look into both magazines mentioned and start reading more on here, sifting through the useful information and the stuff that might not be pertinent to me.  

 

Thank you all for your info and questions!  It's apparent I have a lot more reading to do and actually start making some things as I believe the old saying that there is no substitute for experience.  So thank you guys again for sharing some of your experience with me.  

 

[Mulesaw]

Welcome,

Good and sound advice from all above. 

I think that if you want to develop it into a business it is important to remember and be prepared to make stuff that people want to buy and not necessarily the stuff you would like to make yourself. 
Not that you should stray way out of your primary zone, but sometimes the things people like to buy and pay for are a bit different from what you like yourself. 

My business started out by buying an old patcher and I taught myself how to replace zippers in riding boots. That evolved into an extra patcher that I use for repairing horse blankets. Once in a while a decent leather project comes into the shop as well like repairing a headstall or some other leather gear. But the riding boots got it all started.

It could easily be different in the area where you live, but if there is an equestrian center near by, it couldn't hurt to ask them if they needed anything. If you look at @TomE 's profile, you can see some magnificent halters he has made. So that could be an item if you want to produce new stuff. Personally I would love to make new stuff, but people in my area are generally more into having stuff repaired, and that is also a steady source of income.

Good luck :-)

Brgds Jonas