Waste Of Time?

[Tim Schroeder]

I heard somebody on facebook was saying all these aftermarket plates and feed dogs and presser feet are a waste of time.  I wouldn't know who because I deleted my facebook a long time ago. Probably back in the 1900's. 

The first 2 pictures are why I got rid of my Cobra 4 in the first place. I wasn't smart enough then to make my own outside presser foot out of the blanket foot in the premium package. I did have the slotted plate and the feed dog out of the blanket set from the premium package in my hand headed to the machinist to make my own narrow plate and feed dog way before the narrow plates came out. Didn't think it would work because of the size of the hole in the feed dog.  But instead traded the Class 4 for a Class 26. Still kicking myself in the ass for that one. 

First 2 pictures are stock Cobra and Cowboy style presser feet and the stock plate and feed dog that come on these machines. That's some 5/6 oz. veg tan.  2nd picture is a picture of the stock set up on the Cobra and Cowboy machines and the results I was getting when I had a Class 4. 

The third picture. The left side is presser feet like the ones that come stock on Cobra and Cowboy machines but with @Patrick1's #25 needle plate and feed dog. The right side is the stock set up. 

The fourth picture is @Patrick1's #25 plate and feed dog with my presser foot made from the blanket foot that came stock on my machine just like the blanket feet in the Cobra premium package. I did take it to my machinist and had him mill out the mounting slot to move it over closer to the narrow center foot I had to buy.

 I can't believe somebody would say these plates and feed dogs and presser feet are a waste of time. Maybe they just haven't used them. 

[Tim Schroeder]

No edit button. Looks to me like the narrow plates and feed dogs and a big left foot as well as the other specialized presser feet would make the 441 clones as close to one machine does it all as you are gonna get. 

[Tim Schroeder]

Here's a little better proof of what the narrow plates do for these machines. The first 2" in the very bottom row is some 138 in 1 layer of no more than some 3/4 oz. chrome tan 1/8" from the edge. Maybe somebody will post a picture of that with a stock set up on facebook.

I wouldn't get to see it though. 

[TomE]

I think it was my post in that group that triggered the Admin's missive about the accessories for 441 clones.  I did a similar post of the same video on this forum. 

 It was rather confusing because the Admin said there is no need for these alternative feet, feed dogs, etc. yet he said he has made modified presser feet himself to solve problems.  He said one machine cannot do everything  (no one disputes this) and that using a 441 for finer work was like using a dump truck when you needed a wheelbarrow.  Pretty sure he's never used the accessories in question.  Pretty sure I don't have the space or budget for a second sewing machine.  I would have enjoyed learning about alternative approaches that the Admin has used but his post didn't include anything specific or instructive. 

I am delighted with the 441 accessories I have purchased from @RockyAussie, @CowboyBob, and @Patrick1.  They are game changers that extend the range of projects I can sew on a 441 clone.  I also like the stock feet, plates, etc. that came with my machine.  Each item has its strengths and limitations and together they create an awesome toolbox for sewing.  I'd like to thank the many experienced members of this forum for providing me with accurate information and advice, and for keeping an open mind to different approaches to leathercrafting.  This forum has been a wonderful resource to help me restart my leathercrafting after a ~45 year break.  I'm having a lot of fun as a result.

[Patrick1]

A closed mind is like a clenched fist, it can't receive anything. 

[Wizcrafts]

I have the narrow feed dog and throat plate sets from both @RockyAussie and @Patrick1 for my Cowboy CB4500. I usually leave the Aussie set on for everyday use. I install Patrick's narrow set once in a while when I need to sew with thin thread and needles on a project that simply can't be done on any of my other 9 machines. There are times when this is the case. No one machine does it all as well as multiple machines geared for various jobs and thread/needle combinations. But, if I could only have one walking foot machine, period, it would be my Cowboy 4500, with the narrow feeder sets.

I am amazed by the precision of Patrick's narrow set.

[Patrick1]

I posted this to the admin on Cobra tips and tricks

The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.

This is my rebuttal to aftermarket parts. Having spent 48 years as a Toolmaker/Machinist/CNC Programmer designing, building, and manufacturing parts from aerospace to power generation I think I am a little qualified to rebut some of the negative comments the folks in admin have about aftermarket parts.

In those years I learned it’s best to have another set of eyes to look at production processes, tooling, and fixturing required to make the product. in other words, is what we are doing the most efficient and safest way at accomplishing that task.

I purchased a Cobra 4 about 3 years ago for the purpose of building 2 saddles for when my wife and I relocate to Montana. There are other things we wanted to do with the machine so that’s when I found shortcomings to the machine. I wasn’t going to purchase the deluxe package because I figured I could make the slotted plates that they sold with the package.

Doing research, I came across a post RockyAussie did on the narrow feed dog and plate on leatherworker.net. RockyAussie was kind enough to give the dimensions he used so I made my own. (I have my own CNC milling shop). I also made the slotted plates they sell. RockyAussie’s idea was ground breaking to say the least and people are fortunate to be able to purchase it from Rocky or Cowboy.

My wife wanted a flat plate because she is used sewing on a flat surface so I made a flat plate for RockyAussie’s feed dog that I made and found out that I preferred the flat plate to the round plate too. Other people wanted the flat plate too, so I made a bunch of them up.

I wanted to get closer to the edge than I could with Rocky’s design so I made one that is 1/16 slimmer than Rocky’s. In the end I wanted to push the limits of my so-called TANK that admin calls it and came up with 2 smaller feed dog and flat plates.

So this brings us back to the slotted plates that Cobra and Cowboy sell as a stopgap. My designs keep the original intent of the machine because they have a feed dog. Customers that I have talked to have had problems using the slotted plates and especially the holster plate.

Doing a cost, benefit analysis, the Cobra 4 with the proper so-called aftermarket parts I don’t require a second machine for the leather products I am sewing. I am 100% certain that the wonderful people that have purchased the said product’s feel the same way.

I can only guess why admin wants to slam my products, (maybe they won’t sell you that second machine) but they are doing a great disservice to the folks that have purchased the Cobra 3 and 4. I’m not here to push my products but defend them against willful ignorance.

[Patrick1]

The above post I posted to Facebooks Cobra tips and tricks in regards to thier admins Waste of time post on aftermarket parts. As far as I know the Chinese and me are the only ones doing aftermarket parts for the 441 clones. Uwe closed his store. It in no way does that reflect reflect on Leatherworker.net admin or sight.

[TomE]

Will look forward to seeing those saddles. I’ve read a fair amount about English saddlery and dream of making a jumping saddle with an experienced saddler. For now, I am focusing on tack.  Florida to Montana sounds like an adventure.  

[Patrick1]

Used to live there in Bozeman, then I went to Portland for a spell where I met my wife and she wanted the beach so we ended up in Florida for the last 11 years. Montana is God's country and the riding you can do up there is incredible not to mention the mountains is the best place to train a horse. Just got to find a few acres in the Bitterroot valley and put up shop.