1.5ton manual clicker press

[DieselTech]

Guys & gals I'm looking at a 1.5ton manual clicker press. My question: Will a 1.5ton manual clicker press cut out a 10" x 4" wallet back? Or is this wishful thinking? 

Thanks. Any & all help will be appreciated. 

[kgg]

 

1 hour ago, DieselTech said:

I'm looking at a 1.5ton manual clicker press. My question: Will a 1.5ton manual clicker press cut out a 10" x 4" wallet back? Or is this wishful thinking? 

To help you decide I used the following formula when calculating my tonnage needs for a clicker press.

F (pressing force needed) = S (shear strength of leather / 2) x L cutting (running) length of die X T (thickness) of leather in inches X Sf safety factor

Example for 10 oz leather with a 3 inch square die.

S (shear strength of 10 oz leather) = 2900 psi

L cutting (running) length of die = 12 inches

T (thickness) of 10 oz leather in inches = 0.156 inches

Sf safety factor = 2

F = 1450 x 12 x 0.156 x 2 => 5428.8 pounds (pressing force)

So the question is the manual clicker press rated in Imperial tons or US tons? Also what is the price of the manual clicker press.

5428.8 pounds = 2.42 tons Imperial tons, 2.71 US tons

So the question is the manual clicker press rated in Imperial tons or US tons? The reason being 1.5 US tons equals 3000 pounds while a 1.5 Imperial ton is 3360 pounds.

Whether or not the manual clicker press will work is going to depend on both the bed size of the manual clicker press and the thickness of the leather.

I decided not go the manual clicker press route even though a 5 ton probably would have done for the main reason, Money. A 5 ton would have cost north of $3000 Canadian and would have been a one trick pony. That cost versus converting a 20 ton hydraulic shop for about $700 Canadian total including cost of the shop press when I'm finished. Hum. I'm at about the 75 percent completion mark.

kgg

Edited February 1 by kgg

[fredk]

2 hours ago, DieselTech said:

Guys & gals I'm looking at a 1.5ton manual clicker press. My question: Will a 1.5ton manual clicker press cut out a 10" x 4" wallet back? Or is this wishful thinking? 

Thanks. Any & all help will be appreciated. 

Simple answer is Yes. My 1.25T  Tandy press  will cut that, but I'm restricted on the area size and I have to move the leather/die around to do it in stages

[DieselTech]

49 minutes ago, kgg said:

 

To help you decide I used the following formula when calculating my tonnage needs for a clicker press.

F (pressing force needed) = S (shear strength of leather / 2) x L cutting (running) length of die X T (thickness) of leather in inches X Sf safety factor

Example for 10 oz leather with a 3 inch square die.

S (shear strength of 10 oz leather) = 2900 psi

L cutting (running) length of die = 12 inches

T (thickness) of 10 oz leather in inches = 0.156 inches

Sf safety factor = 2

F = 1450 x 12 x 0.156 x 2 => 5428.8 pounds (pressing force)

So the question is the manual clicker press rated in Imperial tons or US tons? Also what is the price of the manual clicker press.

5428.8 pounds = 2.42 tons Imperial tons, 2.71 US tons

So the question is the manual clicker press rated in Imperial tons or US tons? The reason being 1.5 US tons equals 3000 pounds while a 1.5 Imperial ton is 3360 pounds.

Whether or not the manual clicker press will work is going to depend on both the bed size of the manual clicker press and the thickness of the leather.

I decided not go the manual clicker press route even though a 5 ton probably would have done for the main reason, Money. A 5 ton would have cost north of $3000 Canadian and would have been a one trick pony. That cost versus converting a 20 ton hydraulic shop for about $700 Canadian total including cost of the shop press when I'm finished. Hum. I'm at about the 75 percent completion mark.

kgg

Dang kgg I'm going to need to go back to school. I thank you for the detailed formula. 

But the press is stated as 1.5imperial tons. & has a 14" x 10" cutting platform. 

Thanks I appreciate it. 

36 minutes ago, fredk said:

Simple answer is Yes. My 1.25T  Tandy press  will cut that, but I'm restricted on the area size and I have to move the leather/die around to do it in stages

Thanks fredk how do you like the tandy press? I was looking at a vevor press, due to limit funds at this point. 

[fredk]

I have the more expensive press, the model before this one but basically the same;

https://www.tandyleather.world/collections/machines/products/tandypro-r-hand-press

1. I got it in a Tandy sale several years ago, and 2. I had some money come in otherwise I'd not have bought it but I'm glad I did.  I like it a lot. I use it all the time.  dunno what I'd do without it. I use it for 3D/letter stamping and as a clicker press. Next is to sort it for sewing hole punching 

One thing about it though; there is a 'pad' between the arm and the ram and this wears down. They don't tell you about it and you cant buy replacements. I bought a bar of delrin and cut enough discs to last me a few years 

Edited February 1 by fredk

[DieselTech]

44 minutes ago, fredk said:

I have the more expensive press, the model before this one but basically the same;

https://www.tandyleather.world/collections/machines/products/tandypro-r-hand-press

1. I got it in a Tandy sale several years ago, and 2. I had some money come in otherwise I'd not have bought it but I'm glad I did.  I like it a lot. I use it all the time.  dunno what I'd do without it. I use it for 3D/letter stamping and as a clicker press. Next is to sort it for sewing hole punching 

One thing about it though; there is a 'pad' between the arm and the ram and this wears down. They don't tell you about it and you cant buy replacements. I bought a bar of delrin and cut enough discs to last me a few years 

Thanks. I appreciate it. Well if I done my math right. It appears it would take 2900lbs to cut my wallet backs. Lol that's if my math was correct. 

[fredk]

I just cut a 5.25 x 5.25 inch valet tray out of 1.8mm chrome tan and it cut easily, it even went through the cardboard that I was using as a backing 

Edited February 1 by fredk

[DieselTech]

58 minutes ago, fredk said:

I just cut a 5.25 x 5.25 inch valet tray out of 1.8mm chrome tan and it cut easily, it even went through the cardboard that I was using as a backing 

Thanks. Do you think for wallet dies, I should get them with the stitching holes in the dies? 

Or should I get the dies without the stitching holes? 

I also imagine the press could be used for leather embossing as well. 

I appreciate all the input. Thanks.

[kgg]

1 hour ago, DieselTech said:

Well if I done my math right. It appears it would take 2900lbs to cut my wallet backs. Lol that's if my math was correct. 

 

30 minutes ago, DieselTech said:

Do you think for wallet dies, I should get them with the stitching holes in the dies? 

Do the math again including the total running length of the holes. Including the holes and depending on whether the holes are punched or perched that may put you very close or over the 1.5 ton rating.

Yes you should be able to emboss quite easily.

kgg

Edited February 1 by kgg

[JLSleather]

I would get a stronger press.  Harbor freight sells em cheap, and they're solid.  I got one round here is.. I think 6 ton (?)... small enuogh to put on a bench.  Big enough to cut your wallets.  Mine used mostly for small holsters, mag pouch parts, drink coasters....

I'd have to look up the "sae" formula for press tonnage, but it would involve the cut length... so a 4" x 4" drink coaster would have a 16" cut length.  You're talking about more than twice that.

30 minutes ago, DieselTech said:

Do you think for wallet dies, I should get them with the stitching holes... without the stitching holes? 

I also imagine the press could be used for leather embossing as well. 

I'd do it WITHOUT the stitching "holes", becuase I do not like stitching HOLES.  YEars ago, Tandy sold those little "kits" (which I HAVE used on occasion) with holes - and it sucked   Doesn't look right with thread OR lace, and weakens the project too much.

But yeah - you can emboss with a press as well.  I use it for my "maker stamp" and also for small dies pressed into drink coasters.

  

[DieselTech]

31 minutes ago, kgg said:

 

Do the math again including the total running length of the holes. Including the holes and depending on whether the holes are punched or perched that may put you very close or over the 1.5 ton rating.

Yes you should be able to emboss quite easily.

kgg

Ok thanks I appreciate it. I was not thinking about the total area to cut on a wallet back. Lmao my math is way off. Thanks.

[DieselTech]

24 minutes ago, JLSleather said:

I would get a stronger press.  Harbor freight sells em cheap, and they're solid.  I got one round here is.. I think 6 ton (?)... small enuogh to put on a bench.  Big enough to cut your wallets.  Mine used mostly for small holsters, mag pouch parts, drink coasters....

I'd have to look up the "sae" formula for press tonnage, but it would involve the cut length... so a 4" x 4" drink coaster would have a 16" cut length.  You're talking about more than twice that.

I'd do it WITHOUT the stitching "holes", becuase I do not like stitching HOLES.  YEars ago, Tandy sold those little "kits" (which I HAVE used on occasion) with holes - and it sucked   Doesn't look right with thread OR lace, and weakens the project too much.

But yeah - you can emboss with a press as well.  I use it for my "maker stamp" and also for small dies pressed into drink coasters.

  

Thanks. I think I'll get a harbor freight hydrualic press & convert it to a clicker press. Might even get a pump/motor setup & run it thru with foot controls. 

Thanks. 

[fredk]

1 hour ago, DieselTech said:

Thanks. Do you think for wallet dies, I should get them with the stitching holes in the dies? 

My dies, the valet tray and others, cuts stitching holes. They cut slots. They do not remove any leather. The holes JLS is talking about and remembers are great big holes, about 2mm and remove leather. I would get a die which punches the sewing hole as slot

[DieselTech]

I think this would be a great platform to build a hydrualic clicker press from. I can easily make & install a pressing pad/foot.

Plus I can easily add a electric over hydrualic power pack to it with foot controls. 

If I decide to go this route, would there be any interest in a build thread on it? 

 

[toxo]

10 hours ago, DieselTech said:

Guys & gals I'm looking at a 1.5ton manual clicker press. My question: Will a 1.5ton manual clicker press cut out a 10" x 4" wallet back? Or is this wishful thinking? 

Thanks. Any & all help will be appreciated. 

Before I got my 5 ton Lucris I cut all my clicker dies with a simple 1ton arbor press including handbag size panels. Just be ready to walk it around and don't expect to do it in on go..

[DieselTech]

27 minutes ago, toxo said:

Before I got my 5 ton Lucris I cut all my clicker dies with a simple 1ton arbor press including handbag size panels. Just be ready to walk it around and don't expect to do it in on go..

Thanks toxo. If you dont mind who/ where did you buy your clicker dies thru? Like you hand bag dies? Thanks.

[kgg]

9 hours ago, DieselTech said:

If I decide to go this route, would there be any interest in a build thread on it? 

It is always nice to see how members modify equipment to suit their needs. I did look at the desktop style hydraulic press but I choose to go with the more conventional bottle jack and floor style. What I did like about the one you are look at is the head can be moved from side to side.

kgg

[toxo]

10 hours ago, DieselTech said:

Thanks toxo. If you dont mind who/ where did you buy your clicker dies thru? Like you hand bag dies? Thanks.

I'll always look for a cheaper/better way to solve a problem. I realised years ago that clicker dies would make the process much quicker but they've always been expensive. I worked out a way to do it that works. Not as robust as the welded steel ones but I reasoned that they were never get a tremendous amount of use. Having said that, they have been used many times and are still good. I like thinking of how much I've saved over the years. This pic should be self explanatory. The lighter coloured ones are bought obviously. If you do a search you should find one of my posts (to a Chuck question I think) where I provide links to all the bits you need.

Don't forget that these were done in those days on a lowly arbor press which I also adapted to take stamps etc and even a hot foil block. (I won't be getting rid of my Lucris any time soon though)

These were made using that set.

 

[JLSleather]

Two more points here -

http://www.usacuttingdie.com/ folks make a decent die, always arrives sharp and ready to use (sadly, not everybody can say that).

Having said that, no matter where you have dies made, adding holes (or slots, or whatever) is going to increase the cost exponentially.

[DieselTech]

5 hours ago, toxo said:

I'll always look for a cheaper/better way to solve a problem. I realised years ago that clicker dies would make the process much quicker but they've always been expensive. I worked out a way to do it that works. Not as robust as the welded steel ones but I reasoned that they were never get a tremendous amount of use. Having said that, they have been used many times and are still good. I like thinking of how much I've saved over the years. This pic should be self explanatory. The lighter coloured ones are bought obviously. If you do a search you should find one of my posts (to a Chuck question I think) where I provide links to all the bits you need.

Don't forget that these were done in those days on a lowly arbor press which I also adapted to take stamps etc and even a hot foil block. (I won't be getting rid of my Lucris any time soon though)

These were made using that set.

 

Thanks toxo! Them are great looking bags. Them are like the pattern I found I like. 

Thanks for the pics. I got a good understanding how you made your dies.

5 hours ago, JLSleather said:

Two more points here -

http://www.usacuttingdie.com/ folks make a decent die, always arrives sharp and ready to use (sadly, not everybody can say that).

Having said that, no matter where you have dies made, adding holes (or slots, or whatever) is going to increase the cost exponentially.

Yeah if stitch holes are added to the die, I found it adds another $60-$80 per die to add the stitch prongs. 

[toxo]

31 minutes ago, DieselTech said:

Thanks toxo! Them are great looking bags. Them are like the pattern I found I like. 

Thanks for the pics. I got a good understanding how you made your dies.

Yeah if stitch holes are added to the die, I found it adds another $60-$80 per die to add the stitch prongs. 

Two important things to remember, rule steel comes in two different heights and also different thicknesses. This is measured in points. 2 point is what you want unless you have really good bending machinery. 3 point is much harder to bend.

[DieselTech]

16 minutes ago, toxo said:

Two important things to remember, rule steel comes in two different heights and also different thicknesses. This is measured in points. 2 point is what you want unless you have really good bending machinery. 3 point is much harder to bend.

Ok I look & do some more research. Thanks. 

[fredk]

1 hour ago, DieselTech said:

Yeah if stitch holes are added to the die, I found it adds another $60-$80 per die to add the stitch prongs. 

What price time and evenness (consistent spacing) ? on a few its not worth it but on a few dozen (even done over time) it is