Stitching Question

[Gridix]

Good Morning All,

 

I was just wondering if I could get a little advice. I currently have these Chisels (I am returning them for a set on Buckleguy), however Whenever I stitch, my needle gets stuck when it gets to the thread. Is this due to the chisels im using or could it be due to the size of the needle thread?

 

These are the needles / thread im using:

 

It seems when I watch others sew on youtube that their needle/thread goes right through no problem.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Josh

 

PS these are the chisels I have on order:

[chuck123wapati]

It's because you do not know this simple secret. Use your needles to stretch the hole. As the first needle gets about halfway through, stop and wiggle it up and down rather aggressively. This will stretch and enlarge the hole enough so your thread and needle will go through easily.  

[Gridix]

Wow really thats it ? I am going to try this on some scrap when I get home today. 

[Beehive]

I use a 1/0 needle with .08mm thread. I also use 002. The bigger needle makes a path for the thread, 'knots'. I've also used 004 needles with .08mm thread. But the smaller needle stabs the thread much more easy. 

As for the Buckle guy pricking irons. I have two sets. 3.85 and 3.38. 9 tine, 4, 2, and a single tine. The most used is the two tine and nine tine. I rarely use the four tine. 

Here's a tip. Lets say you're using the 3.85 and you get to an end or corner. The 3.38 will be needed to space the holes. In other words, I use both SPI on the same project. Same with using the 3.38. Sometimes the 3.85 will be needed to reach a corner. 

You'll need the single tine. Think of it as the correct sized Awl. 

 

 

[Gridix]

Thanks for the insite on the irons. Trying to pick things up in moderation. It gets quite pricey quick!

[Beehive]

The buckleguy ones are solid. Among my projects is a ranger belt. 8-10oz Wicket and Craig veg tanned. Lined with 4-5oz Horween cavalier in red. ~6mm thick. 

I use a 32oz maul to drive the 9 tine. 16oz maul to drive the 2 tine. 

 

So far, I'm happy with them. They've stayed sharp. I looked up the metal they're using. High impact resistant tool steel. Made to be pounded on. 

[Gridix]

So the other day I was using the amazon ones, and it was going through 3 layers of 4ish oz veg tanned leather, I could barely get the darn thing pulled out of the leather!

[Beehive]

Rub the points with wax. Either white wax or a beeswax and white wax mix.

 

They sell little pieces of flat metal with a slot in it. The trick, don't pull the iron out the leather. Instead, push the leather off the tines. Once you're through. Scoot it over on the pad. Push the leather down. 

Also, make sure you're not going too deep. All you need is about a half of mm of the teeth poking through. 

[billybopp]

In general, you WANT the stitch holes to be as tight as possible while still stitchable ( is that a word)?   Make sure the chisels are going all the way through, so that the back-side is up onto the tines - past the point so that it's fully open.  As mentioned by @chuck123wapati, you can wiggle the needle a bit to stretch the hole some, as it will have shrunk back some after it was punched.  When you thread the needle, double or even triple pierce the thread to help keep the "knot" an inch or so behind they eye of the needle.  If the knot creeps up to the eye, it'll be far more difficult to pull through.

Hope that helps!

- Bill

[Beehive]

With the French style pricking irons. By nature, one side will be a bigger hole because they're wedged shaped. But after you've stitched. Pounding or rolling the stitch line will compress the entry holes tight. 

It's also why you don't roll the holes until after you've stitched. Rolling the holes before you stitch makes for a difficult time passing the needle through. With you ending up having to  use the pliers you super glued leather on the jaws. 

 

[Gridix]

Do you guys use the dull tip or the sharp tip needles? I ordered a thinner thread recently and I was not able to get the dull needle through it.

[Beehive]

Blunt tipped*

 

They do two things. Helps prevent the needle from stabbing the cross thread, helps it glide through the hole and the biggy. Saves you from stabbing your fingers. For which will happen from time to time. 

 

[chuck123wapati]

1 hour ago, Gridix said:

Do you guys use the dull tip or the sharp tip needles? I ordered a thinner thread recently and I was not able to get the dull needle through it.

You would be better suited to buy harness needles specifically for hand stitching as well as the correct thread.  I use John James No. 2 needles and Ritza tiger thread however I sew heavy lethers, holsters, sheaths, belts, etc. Others will chime in I'm sure of their favorites.

[Beehive]

Yes Sir, John James needles. I can remember back when I started leather craft. Pre internet days and getting leather and supplies. Was a two hour round trip to Tandy in Austin. 

Boy O' Boy, their large eye needles are junk. You had to buy in bulk because they'd snap at the eye. Clean break off. Making you wonder if it's you doing something wrong. When it's the junk needles being junky. 

[fredk]

3 hours ago, Gridix said:

So the other day I was using the amazon ones, and it was going through 3 layers of 4ish oz veg tanned leather, I could barely get the darn thing pulled out of the leather!

Use one of these;

as well as polishing the prongs and regularly waxing them whilst in use

[chuck123wapati]

4 hours ago, Gridix said:

So the other day I was using the amazon ones, and it was going through 3 layers of 4ish oz veg tanned leather, I could barely get the darn thing pulled out of the leather!

use some beeswax  just poke them in a piece every once in a while also get a small block of wood and use it right next to your chisels when pulling them out, it's much easier than using your fingers by themselves.

[Gridix]

Thanks guys!

[fredk]

4 hours ago, Gridix said:

Do you guys use the dull tip or the sharp tip needles? I ordered a thinner thread recently and I was not able to get the dull needle through it.

Twist the thread in the direction against its wind, this will open up the individual threads which make it up

[Gridix]

Ahh ok, thanks.

[Beehive]

Practice tying the needles on. It may not seem that big of deal but it is. You want the places where the thread Inter cross to lay as flat as possible. Nice and smooth. 

You can smooth them down using a piece of denim. (That's another thing in this hobby. Don't throw away those old blue jeans. Or any fabric that's 100% cotton. Cut the denim up for burnishing rags. The cotton as general purpose.)

 

 

 

[fredk]

Whatever way you attach the thread to the needle - wax it, and wax it every so often whilst you sew. Leather is very abrasive, especially to the weaker thread

I have a few of these;

I just pull the thread though it every so often. But you don't need one of them, just a block of bee's wax will do.

[dikman]

I suppose you could use the pricking irons to punch your holes and then use an awl in conjunction with your needles?

[bruce johnson]

6 hours ago, Beehive said:

Yes Sir, John James needles. I can remember back when I started leather craft. Pre internet days and getting leather and supplies. Was a two hour round trip to Tandy in Austin. 

Boy O' Boy, their large eye needles are junk. You had to buy in bulk because they'd snap at the eye. Clean break off. Making you wonder if it's you doing something wrong. When it's the junk needles being junky. 

The large eyes were always weak at the eye just by design.the thinner legs around that wider hole just made them the weak link. Once I got instructed on making a decent tapered end then the normal harness needles were fine and easier to get pulled through the awl stab too. The old joke was that you lost more needles than you broke. That’s one reason I sell John James needles and also carry needle cases. LOL.

[SUP]

I often punch my stitching holes on a slab of old wax. I just melt candles, odorless ones, in an old pan and and let it cool. This makes a good base and the chisel ends go into the wax and slip out smoothly. Whenever the wax gets too rough on the surface, just melt and cool again. This is usually on thicker leathers or multi layered ones.

[Beehive]

I wonder if the OP has discovered what it takes to saddle stitch? Forget the tools, needles and thread. It's the labor involved. 

When I stitched the main strap on my belt. 90" total stitch length. Broken up into two sessions of 45" each. 

When I started, I sat on the couch. Stitching pony in my lap and found a decent movie for background noise. Left to right, right to left, loop. 45" took three movies worth of time. I estimate I have ~12 hours labor in the main strap alone. And that's just the stitching. It doesn't include cutting, trimming, gluing, or poking the holes. 

In total, I bet I'll have ~20 hours total labor in my Ranger belt. Something they don't show in YouTube videos. 

As for good news. My order of thread shows up today. I'm gonna venture out in wild colored threads. Blue, green, and yellow. Of course, Ritza brand in .08mm. I used white 1mm on the belt. The colored thread is going on a wallet made from plum colored Horween cavalier. 

So if you can come to terms with how much labor a hand made leather item takes. You can build anything. Think of stitching as meditation. I do. 

 

Edited 10 hours ago by Beehive