Johanna Report post Posted August 17, 2009 Artisan has been hard at work! Check out their latest machine! The Artisan Toro 3200 is complete with a twelve and a half inch throat and will sew 7/8 oz leather! Johanna Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
greggw Report post Posted August 18, 2009 Hello everyone I have been reading leatherworker.net for over 2 years this is my first post. I felt compelled to post this in defense of Steve. I bought an Artisan Toro 3000 In 2007 from Steve while I lived in Los Angeles, CA. The only reason I bought the machine from Artisan was because of Steve, as many of you have done. We all know about the situation between Artisan & Steve. Artisan's agenda has been to hurt Steve, and 90 percent of the members know this. He has been there to help us many times. Even though He does not work for Artisan anymore, I will still call him for help on my machine. Many of you feel the same way, including you Johanna, My question to you is why would you endorse Artisan when you know that there creditability has been questioned many times since Steve has left. Artisan has not participated, or helped anybody on this forum for the past six months. Steve is a class act and good guy. His creditability has never been questioned. Most of us members see right through Artisan tactics. Johanna, please don't under estimate our intelligence by endorsing someone who has not been there for our members this would be an insult. I was going to PM you, but I thought to myself why not post just as you did publicly. I'm sure there will be some backlash from the 10 percent of you but that's ok I'm a straight shooter and I speak the truth. So the let the chips fall where they may. Thank you for all for this opportunity, Gregg Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jman Report post Posted August 18, 2009 I also do not like the games these guys play. All of a sudden there is a machine with more troat clearance and will sew thicker material, for a lot less money than the ones they sold just a month ago. I am putting my chi- comm artisan up for sale, guess I will have to take a big loss, since the dealers do not give a hoot about the secondary market- done with irregular and a poor quality stitch. I just ordered an american made needle and awl machine that sews well and are untuchable by sales man politics Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
neelsaddlery Report post Posted August 18, 2009 greggw: There are a couple of interesting facts that I would like to point out about your post: 1. You have been reading the leatherworker.net forums for over two years now and never have registered? That sounds a bit strange to me. Most people that read the forums on the leatherworker.net website are active members and also post regularly. 2. Interesting also that you chose to join the leatherworker.net website officially at 11:36 p.m. on the same day that Johanna put this post up about Artisan sewing machines. There have been some controversial posts about Artisan sewing machines in the past two years. Why not chime in then? 3. Also interesting that you mention you are from the Los Angeles area in California. This would be a convenient truth if anybody were ever to source the IP address of the computer that made this post. Could it come from the same region of the country as well? Folks, I have said it before and I will say it again. I think the leatherworker.net forum is too good of a website to trash up with a lot of propaganda about who is the better or more righteous person or company. Steve (Cobra) has his own merits, Artisan has their own merits, Cowboy has their own merits, and so do all of the other contributing dealers such as Campbell-Randall and any others whom I may have forgotten. And, I am sure if you look long enough and hard enough, you'll see folks who dislike us all!!!!! We all have advantages and disadvantages to each product we sell. It is up to the customer to decide which dealer is offering a product that is right for them. I grow tired of the leatherworker.net forums being used as a place where folks perform character assassination and attempt to undermine the credibility of each other. PLEASE NOTE: I don't want anybody to think that I am in support of any party here. That is not the case. I just think we should all try to get along without trashing up the website while we sort out our differences and alignments. Let's play nice people!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Windom Leather Report post Posted August 18, 2009 I'd have to say I'm with neel on his one! I haven't been on this forum for very long but I have learned enormous amounts of info to help me better myself and the things I make and I believe that is the intent of this forum. Its for the folks that don't know something to ask the question and have it answered to the best ability of the people that do know and to let everyone know all the different tool, product and machinery choices out there. Yes everyone and everything has there merits and drawbacks and that's why I believe we are all here and that's to get better at what we do. I don't know the back story behind Steve and artisan. Maybe Steve got the short stick from them. I don't know. From the short time I've been here it sounds like steves a really great guy and what I've read, a lot of people like the artisan machines. I personally don't know anything about them. I haven't seen there machines yet. I guess what I'm tryin to say is we are here to get the best info we can to make an educated decision on the tools, products, machinery and the things we make. So let's stop the fat mouthin and just discuss the high points and low points of the questions that need answerin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UKRay Report post Posted August 18, 2009 I belong to this forum to find out about leatherworking innovation, learn new techniques and enjoy the banter. I don't need to hear about the vendor's power struggle or be subjected to any spurious, underhand and offensive propaganda from their supporters but I do want to know about new machines as they come available as this is valuable knowledge to someone in the leather business. I am delighted that Johanna saw fit to tell me that there is a new machine on the market - I won't buy it, but it pleases me to know as much as I can about new kit as it become available. Sometime in the future I may need a machine that does exactly what the new Artisan machine can do and then I will know where to start looking. I have spent money with both Ryan and Steve - both gave me good honest service. I have no doubt that the other vendors would deal honourably with me too - mainly because I make it clear what I want from them and insist the people I deal with tell me exactly what they are going to do for me before any money changes hands. Try it, it works. There is no point in wimping because the price of sewing machines is dropping - that is simply down to commercial pressure and you can be sure the price will rise again soon enough. Prices are only low as long as there is a struggle for supremacy. As soon as there is a clear leader (and I couldn't give a monkey's **** which vendor comes out on top as I will simply do business with the one who gives me the best deal) things will return to normal and profit margins will be adjusted accordingly - hey we all need to make money. If you are in the position to buy a machine now then go ahead and do it - bear in mind, however, that pretty soon there will be a newer model with more capability, deeper throat or a longer widget. The computer industry has been doing this to us for years - buy a new computer and see how long it remains current... and just watch your new computer fall in value as soon as you get it home. It works the same with sewing machines, but to a lesser extent. Get used to it! Unless you are planning on buying and selling sewing machines you probably purchased the thing to do a job. If you had any sense you researched the price before you started and made sure you could afford it. So now get on and use the thing as you intended and stop all the complaining. It doesn't help anyone and IMHO just irritates most folk. Rant over... Ray Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tonyc1 Report post Posted August 18, 2009 I belong to this forum to find out about leatherworking innovation, learn new techniques and enjoy the banter. I don't need to hear about the vendor's power struggle or be subjected to any spurious, underhand and offensive propaganda from their supporters but I do want to know about new machines as they come available as this is valuable knowledge to someone in the leather business.I am delighted that Johanna saw fit to tell me that there is a new machine on the market - I won't buy it, but it pleases me to know as much as I can about new kit as it become available. Sometime in the future I may need a machine that does exactly what the new Artisan machine can do and then I will know where to start looking. I have spent money with both Ryan and Steve - both gave me good honest service. I have no doubt that the other vendors would deal honourably with me too - mainly because I make it clear what I want from them and insist the people I deal with tell me exactly what they are going to do for me before any money changes hands. Try it, it works. There is no point in wimping because the price of sewing machines is dropping - that is simply down to commercial pressure and you can be sure the price will rise again soon enough. Prices are only low as long as there is a struggle for supremacy. As soon as there is a clear leader (and I couldn't give a monkey's **** which vendor comes out on top as I will simply do business with the one who gives me the best deal) things will return to normal and profit margins will be adjusted accordingly - hey we all need to make money. If you are in the position to buy a machine now then go ahead and do it - bear in mind, however, that pretty soon there will be a newer model with more capability, deeper throat or a longer widget. The computer industry has been doing this to us for years - buy a new computer and see how long it remains current... and just watch your new computer fall in value as soon as you get it home. It works the same with sewing machines, but to a lesser extent. Get used to it! Unless you are planning on buying and selling sewing machines you probably purchased the thing to do a job. If you had any sense you researched the price before you started and made sure you could afford it. So now get on and use the thing as you intended and stop all the complaining. It doesn't help anyone and IMHO just irritates most folk. Rant over... Ray I wish that I'd have come with a longer Widget, Ray! Tony. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UKRay Report post Posted August 18, 2009 I wish that I'd have come with a longer Widget, Ray!Tony. And you want me to dignify that with a reply? - You just keep your undersized widget off this board, young man! LOL Ray Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra Steve Report post Posted August 18, 2009 Hi Gregg, nice to hear from you again,(sort of). The last thing I want to do is go down this path again, however I do appreciate the feelings that you have for me. I know why you feel the way you do and if the situation ever happened again, I would do the same thing for you, regardless of ramifications from my boss. I'm not saying that you're points are valid or not. With that said, I think that you should have sent Johanna a PM regarding your opinion. How is it living in Washington now? Are you still a Raiders fan or are you a Seattle Seahawk fan. Call me if you ever need me, 1-866-962-9880, thanks, your friend(no matter what), Steve Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grunt Report post Posted August 18, 2009 Johanna, Thank you for posting info about this new machine from Artisan. I appreciate hearing about new machines, as this will help me in my future purchasing when I decide to buy another machine to go with my Cobra. As far as posting about this vendor versus the other, I am pretty sure that both Artisan and Cobra advertise here on this board, which pays the bills and keeps the lights on. That's just common sense and good business. As far as which vendor is better or worse than another each vendors track record speaks for itself. Sell a quality product and provide good honest support for it and people will buy from you. Reort to hinky business practices and provide less than the best support and you will lose business. Just my two cents your mileage may vary. :soapbox: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jbird Report post Posted August 18, 2009 (edited) Howdy Gang I am a loyal LW member, and still am but I am little set back by the strange way all this has been handled, why is it that artisian get a free plug I mean that's great but I didn't see one when steve opened his doors or since then? Steve is my friend as well as all of you I respect you all and have found some great friends here, but I fear a turn for the worse has come by leting politics mess up are happy home. Were is artisian to help or answer in question here at LW? Plus they have steped all over in there own cow pies let's stop bashing Steve and start playing fair. If the vendors can help great if not Shut up. This Is my thought something is a little off here and it's making no sence. I respect you all and hope you think about this. Josh dusty Chap Leather Edited August 18, 2009 by jbird Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rdb Report post Posted August 18, 2009 (edited) Everybody, cool your jets. 1. The only person I support in all this is Johanna. She's created this place, which has become essential to all of us. Whatever money, presents, freebies she can get, I say, You go girl!. n'uf said. 2. This is one of the only forums on the intertubes to allow vendors to participate. Guess what, That's GREAT. We get to see, hear, and talk with them. I say let them promote, feud, contribute. The more we see, the more we know. The more we know, the easier the decisions. Somebody mean mouths somebody else....use it to make your decisions....Vote with your pocketbook. 3. Cobra, Neels, Artisan, all produce something we need...good equipment at reasonable prices. Pick the one you like, or need. That's about as American as you can get. Who contributes to this forum, gets higher marks in my brain, but you have to add all the other factors in too. Sometimes you have to let go of the personal, and make business decisions. Disclaimer: I have a Toro 3000. My next one maybe from CobraSteve, or neelsaddlery. Spread the wealth, we have limited resources. Keep them all in mind. As leatherworkers, you should realize we may be heading for a new golden age. Stick together, we're all we have. Edited August 18, 2009 by rdb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Johanna Report post Posted August 18, 2009 This thread is about the new machine from Artisan. If anyone wants to comment on the new machine, wonderful. If you want to spread rumors and take sides- please do it by PM. Thank you! Johanna Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tkleather1 Report post Posted August 18, 2009 This thread is about the new machine from Artisan. If anyone wants to comment on the new machine, wonderful. If you want to spread rumors and take sides- please do it by PM. Thank you!Johanna Well put Jo, Well Put Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luke Hatley Report post Posted August 18, 2009 Johanna.................. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Regis Report post Posted August 18, 2009 Johanna I hope everyone that gets word of a new product will post with some specifics. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra Steve Report post Posted August 18, 2009 I know you all will all get a kick out of this: Hey Jerry from Artisan, HAPPY BIRTHDAY you old fart! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
neelsaddlery Report post Posted August 19, 2009 I know you all will all get a kick out of this:Hey Jerry from Artisan, HAPPY BIRTHDAY you old fart! Boy, there's a lot of love on this thread!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
