Website And Its ?

[jbird]

Howdy all

I am wondering if a website helps boost sales?

what is your thoughts on it and does it help?

thanks Josh

[tuffcase]

As long as you don't spend a bunch of money having a web presence can only help your business.

An easy way to get online very easily and inexpensively is to list some items on etsy.com and make sure on every product page you list other items you make.

[Daggrim]

My experience is that I get an average of one sale per 3,000 hits. My leather helmets product has a much smaller niche than western gear, so yours might be a better average.

Overall, though, I'm very glad to have a website, as I can so easily just attach a link to it in an email, and they can look at everything I do at their convenience. It's much easier than trying to explain, or to send a couple of attached pictures. I've spent many hours making the website just the way I want it, so I set it up "once", and I can use it thousands of times without any further effort. Well, not exactly "without any further effort", but I just do incremental improvements and updates now.

I chose a website provider which allows me to go in there myself and make changes. Making that choice, as opposed to having someone else do it, depends upon your budget, and your capacity to endure pain.

The website saves a thousand words, and I can't tell you how many times I've included a link to it in messages to event coordinators and potential customers. So, it doesn't just sit there and wait for people to find it...I proactively send it out. It's like getting a chainsaw after using a handsaw. Zoom...done.

By the way, you might want to go there and see a funny video I just added, of me and a buddy leading over 300 kids out onto a frozen lake for a cross country ski race. http://leatherhelms.com .

Daggrim

[UKRay]

Great video, Doug - and a good way to attract a few more visitors. I bet the parents of most of the kids in that vid have already been to see what you make.

Josh,

I purchased my website from a company that was going bust. Although it has a comprehensive management system' that allows me to make any changes myself, it cost me very little money as essentially, all I did was put a new picture on the front, clear out their words and pictures and fill it up with my stuff. It took a while to do all the work but as I write my own words and take my own picturers (and doesn't it show sometimes! LOL) I didn't have to spend much money.

I can promise you that it was the best move I have ever made. I now get almost 90% of my retail business from the website plus it is a constant source of leads. I get enquiries daily from people who want custom items and even attract a few orders from shops and other businesses. Sure, they don't all turn into hard cash but I'm very pleased with the results.

The real thing that makes any website work is constant promotion. You have to take the time to be active on forums where your customers go. You need to set up lots of links to your site from other websites so people can find you. You need to make sure you tell everyone you meet about your website and ask them to promote it too. It is a lot of hard work but IMHO, it will produce its rewards if you work hard enough.

Have a word with your local web development company. They may have an existing e-commerce customer who's business is about to fail (maybe they were selling the wrong stuff?). As long as the site does everything you want it to (or everything you need) you could make an offer to buy it. Then offer to leave the site with them for hosting if they are prepared to help you 'move in'. It will almost certainly be a whole lot cheaper than buying a whole new custom website.

The 'second hand' approach doesn't win many friends amongst web developers, but if you don't have the money for a 'full on' brand new website this can be a great way to get started.

Have a chat with Johanna, she might have some ideas too.

Ray

[cdthayer]

Josh,

You may want to first decide what type of website that your business needs. An eCommerce site or an advertising site? It will depend on what you need your website to do for you. I consider an eCommerce site as a secure site with payment handled when ordering, and an advertising site as simply a billboard with no shopping cart.

If you have inventory that you buy and sell that is easy to restock, then a secure site with a shopping cart that can take payment when taking orders may be best, but it's going to cost more. Otherwise, a billboard type of a website to advertise your business may be plenty. There are all kinds of "hybrid" sites that combine the two using off-site payment buttons.

We started out with a hobby site for my utility pole climber collection activities, then it became an advertising website for custom craft items, and it certainly increased our craft sales when we put them on-line. I do all of the website design and maintenance myself and pay to have it hosted in Chicago (it was in New Jersey when we started in 1998). I just went shopping for a hosting plan and found them. Our site is still an advertising website, but now for our brick and mortar shop too. We looked at getting a shopping cart, but decided against it. The main problem was going to be inventory management. In order to sell on-line and on-site both, we would have to have two separate inventories. You can't sell the same item twice. If an online customer and a walk-in customer both bought the same thing at the same time, one of them won't get it. This is especially true if it's an item that is no longer in production. I know some businesses do it, but it seems like sooner or later they will make an unhappy customer.

It's similar to those (auction site) sellers that list items for auction, and then simply order them from the supplier when they get a bid. When the supplier backorders the item, then the seller can't complete the sale. It's not a matter of if they're going to get backordered, but when. With today's "just in time" production systems of limited runs, backorders are common. I just don't care for the "virtual inventory" method of business anyway. I want more control of the inventory. I want to have it on-hand before I offer it for sale.

We have a few items for sale on our website, but no payment buttons for instant sale, and most of the on-line inventory is off-site and not available to the walk-in customers. It includes close-out items that we take off of the shelf to make room for other products. We are basically using the website to show the items and the price, and then complete any sales inquiries using email. Even if the item is on the sales floor, we can remove it before responding to the inquiry so that it can't be sold to a walk-in customer after we've made a commitment to the on-line customer. We don't have enough on-line inventory to justify a secure site and shopping cart, especially with close-out prices.

Custom-made items are difficult to sell with shopping carts due to the variables involved, unless it's an item that has a set of defined "features" that can be included with the basic design, and no other options. If it's truly "custom", at least in my opinion, it's not like any other. More often, it's one of a kind. Putting that item into a shopping cart with features that you haven't seen or heard of before would be tough to price.

As an example: we sell custom doo-rags, and my wife builds them to the customer's requirements. We show photos of ones that she's made for previous customers as examples. She has a set of basic design templates and features, but she also gets special requests that she can respond to when they ask (ie. "can you put a black band on the one shown in the photo that has a green band?" or "can you embroider the name on the left side instead of in the front?"). Even with items like those two samples that don't require any change in pricing, putting all of the variables that people need in a custom item onto a drop-down menu would be impossible (IMO). Getting the details of the order, including the text embroidery choices, has been working fine for us with an email form-handler on our site.

CD in Oklahoma

thayerrags.com

[tireytv]

Howdy all

I am wondering if a website helps boost sales?

what is your thoughts on it and does it help?

thanks Josh

Websites are essential. I'm not a fan of etsy however. I see you have an etsy site in your profile link so I mean no disrespect, but for me, etsy is too 'crafty' and it commoditizes your skills and product and its all too easy for the shopper to compare you with others on the site. Custom products should never sell on price. I'm not even saying it can't work for you or others here. But for me, what you make is original and customers want to buy it for that very reason. I would build a site to sell yourself, your integrity, and your products in that order. If you put up lots of content, get links, and work hard you should get prospects coming into the site. I agree too with the advice that shopping carts are not a priority. Converting traffic to phone calls and simple paypal checkouts is where to start.

Here's a couple links I found doing quick searches, I don't know who any of these vendors are. But my point is this:

This is a story I can believe in, recommend, repeat buy, and do business with:

http://www.leathersm...ds-supplier.htm

this is not because the product is marketed as just that - a product. If I want a product, I'll go to Sears. That leatheworker is probably here on the board so I'm not trying to bash anyone. My point is not about quality but about marketing and how I think custom products should be presented.

http://www.etsy.com/...cat1_gallery_10

One thing I do like about etsy is using it to leverage their traffic and shift it elsehwere, like this smart marketer here:

http://www.etsy.com/...esCustomLeather

See the facebook and twitter links. That's smart move where you can leverage a community.

- my 2 cents. Jeff

Jeff

Edited February 25, 2010 by tireytv

[whinewine]

Websites are essential. I'm not a fan of etsy however. I see you have an etsy site in your profile link so I mean no disrespect, but for me, etsy is too 'crafty' and it commoditizes your skills and product and its all too easy for the shopper to compare you with others on the site. Custom products should never sell on price. I'm not even saying it can't work for you or others here. But for me, what you make is original and customers want to buy it for that very reason. I would build a site to sell yourself, your integrity, and your products in that order. If you put up lots of content, get links, and work hard you should get prospects coming into the site. I agree too with the advice that shopping carts are not a priority. Converting traffic to phone calls and simple paypal checkouts is where to start.

Jeff

Jeff:

I hate to disagree with you about etsy. While most of my time is spent building stock for our shows, we do sell on etsy, and it is a welcome bit of change between shows during the winter (we are not nomads & don't follow the shows south & then go north in the spring...). Etsy gets our name out there, which is more important than the $ amount that we sell there, and people can go from there to our website for other info about us & the shows we do. Everything we make is essentially custom, and since I get bored very easily, I detest having to do the same item/design over & over & over, so whatever I create for stock (& etsy) tends to be different. While we do take custom orders, really I prefer not to- I'd rather make whatever is in my head at the time. I always love to experiment, & etsy is a good venue in which to 'test the waters', if you will. If it's liked on etsy, it'll probably sell at the shows.

The biggest thing I've found is to find your niche for your area. I know from experience that Western style & horsey stuff & Sheridan style simply don't sell in my area, so while we feature some of this stuff on both etsy & our website, I know it won't sell. But it still shows what we can do.

As far as others making comparisons, I really don't care. We name our prices & we sell at those prices.

I'm not too sure about what you mean by 'too crafty'... While there are many individuals on this site who I consider true artists, I would believe that very, very few of them go around considering themselves 'artists'. I would think that the majority believe that they are accomplished craftspeople, perhaps 'artisans', or simply 'craftsmen', but for sure they all do it for the love of it, (and of course, for some money, too).

If, by being 'too crafty', you mean 'arts & crap', yeah, there is that element there too, but there is also fine stuff being exhibited & shown on etsy, including other members of LWnet.

russ

[tireytv]

Jeff:

I hate to disagree with you about etsy.

Hi Whinewine, it's very nice to meet you and I'm glad to see that it works for you. Again, it's my two cents and we all different takes on things. No, i don't mean 'crap' either. What I do mean is that there are tons of products that are sub-standard and I see that as a distraction. You're also using Etsy in a very good way which I mentioned in my post, which is to use it as a spring board into your own sites where you can explain more about yourself.

All the best,

Jeff

Edited February 25, 2010 by tireytv

[jbird]

I really am gratefull to all of you for giving such great advise.

I how ever am not a fan of etsy I can't sell anything there. Every one there seem to be looking for a low cost product.

I am working on a website as we speak.

Hay Ray great site buddy.

Josh

[JohnBarton]

Howdy all

I am wondering if a website helps boost sales?

what is your thoughts on it and does it help?

thanks Josh

Done right it definitely helps. Done wrong it drives people away.

One thing about a website is that you have to decide whether it's going to be a poster, a catalog, or a store.

If it's a poster then you are simply going to put up a pretty sparse page with some examples of your work and invite people to contact you.

If it's a catalog then you will need to have good presentation of your items with some good pictures, different views, and good descriptions.

If it's a store then you will need to do all that you do with a catalog plus keep it up to date with what items are available, how to purchase, etc....

In other words it can be as simple or as complicated as you want to make it.

BUT it's work to put it up and it does reflect on you and your work. To me a poor website brings down quality work. I have seen so many sites which are hard to read, terrible to navigate and have photos of the work that are tiny, poor quality and horrible.

EVERYONE says that they do quality work. Everyone says that they are meticulous. Everyone says they will make your dreams comes true.

The only thing that convinces people of that though is if they can see it and in my opinion it's all about the images on the web. Lots of good quality images and videos will do more to sell for you than all the copy in the world. People will read your copy and want to get in your head if you show them something that makes them want to stay.

I have people who email me all the time and say that they just spent a couple hours browsing through all my cases and now they are ready to order. I have people who tell me they just like to go to my site once every couple weeks to see the new cases. WHICH brings me to the important point of maintaining your site with new stuff to keep bringing people back.

I am WAY behind on this and currently have around 20-30 cases to put up on our website. It's tedious boring work which is why I avoid it. But it pays huge dividends because you have a ready portfolio of your work.

I can't tell you the amount of times I use my website to reference something. When on the phone with a customer I will direct them to my site to show them various things, when answering emails I will insert pictures pulled from my website or post links to the relevant products, when posting to message boards I will use the pictures on my website.

Check all my posts here and you will find that almost all of my pictures are coming from my website. When I post a case I don't upload my pictures to the LeatherWorker.net server I insert the image using a link from my own site. This way I have control over that image and if I decide to change it later then it changes EVERYWHERE that I have ever put in an instant. I don't have to worry that there are other versions out there.

So yes, a website is a powerful powerful tool when done right. But you should teach yourself the basics and not depend on others to build it for you.

This site is 100% built by my friend and he is arguably the most successful dealer of high end cues in the world www.indyq.com

This site is almost entirely built by me - www.jbcases.com - I allow some people to work on it under my supervision.

Good luck!

[JLSleather]

for me, etsy is too 'crafty' and it commoditizes your skills and product and its all too easy for the shopper to compare you with others on the site.

Jeff

This is an issue with me. Had a guy here about a week ago, looked through some of my stuff. Holding a new bilfold wallet, he looked at me with pleasant surprise and said "And it looks FINISHED. It don't even look like crafts".

Too many "crafters" seem to think if you bash it a bit with a stamp (and maybe add some lace and/or beads) then it's "crafted" and somehow worth about 15 times what it cost in materials. End result, much of the "outside" thinks it's SUPPOSED to look like you dragged it behind your truck.

I would have thought that comparing my work next to some others' would be my best advertising. Yeah, I know that's arrogant, but if I didn't think I was doing it right, I'd do it different. I'm not kidding ... some of this stuff makes me wonder -- WHAT DID THAT COW EVER DO TO YOU? I'm always trying to improve ... it's not that I think I'm doing it all flawlessly , just that some of what I see is THAT bad.

But, truth is, quality means little alot of the time. I've seen (LOTS) times where a very nice, attractive, functional leather item has been passed over to get at a rough-looking, clearly inferior product. In fact, there's the point ... they appeared to want the "crafty" one. Lace with frayed edges, plated tin buckles, heavy applications of acrylic dyes, etc ...

Now, long as I'm on that line, I want to just say that because the items are selling - does NOT equal quality. I could go on (and on) but here's a couple of short examples to make that point ...

The guy who "invented" the "pet rock" ... $millions

The guy who came up with "Got milk?" .... $millions

SpongeBob SquarePants ... yeah, we all know that one ...

[whinewine]

"And it looks FINISHED. It don't even look like crafts".

Too many "crafters" seem to think if you bash it a bit with a stamp (and maybe add some lace and/or beads) then it's "crafted" and somehow worth about 15 times what it cost in materials. End result, much of the "outside" thinks it's SUPPOSED to look like you dragged it behind your truck.

I'm always trying to improve ... it's not that I think I'm doing it all flawlessly , just that some of what I see is THAT bad.

But, truth is, quality means little alot of the time. I've seen (LOTS) times where a very nice, attractive, functional leather item has been passed over to get at a rough-looking, clearly inferior product. In fact, there's the point ... they appeared to want the "crafty" one. Lace with frayed edges, plated tin buckles, heavy applications of acrylic dyes, etc ...

My point exactly- there is a tremendous amount of 'arts & crap" out there, both in etsy and on ebay, too. A lot of people truly think that their poop is worth more than gold- and their selling prices do reflect that philosophy- but said items usually remain unsold. The other side of the coin is that some finely crafted items look so perfect that, on a website, some have trouble distinguishing between that quality & the low quality found at wallyworld, because of the inability to do a side by side comparison. This is what I mean by 'finding one's niche'- make your product so it stands out in the marketplace- make some distinguishing feature that sets your stuff apart, so it doesn't look like it's machine made.

russ

[particle]

Monica Kuehn Leather has an excellent (and free) website. She simply took the free Blogspot site and built her own right there. Blogs are easy to update, quick to stylize, and you're only out your time to build it.

http://monicakuehnleather.blogspot.com/

I have one too (so you can see another skin of the same Blogspot layout), but I haven't bothered updating it in ages.

http://particlerealities.blogspot.com/

[JLSleather]

Wow, open that site (Monica) and there's a single holster in yer face (NICE). Good even tone, good color, nice stitching.... sue-weett.

I DO know what you mean, WW ... I have a few craftaids, but I try to make each one a little different. I wonder if some folks realize just how many patterns they really have. Oh, well, that's another topic, and you've covered this one well. THANKS!

[jbird]

wow!

thank you all very good stuff!

me one last question is this if you do a blog site does it ever get viewed?

Josh

[UKRay]

wow!

thank you all very good stuff!

me one last question is this if you do a blog site does it ever get viewed?

Josh

Here are the stats from a few of my 'signpost' blogs for the past month, Josh:

www.barefootleather.blogspot.com 272

www.1940sleather.blogspot.com 92

www.lurchercollar.blogspot.com 82

www.bikeleather.blogspot.com 75

www.whippetcollar.blogspot.com 43

Yes, people do view them and they are a powerful free marketing tool. They don't work on their own though; you need to promote them as often as possible in every way you can. They also need to have a clearly defined objective and this doesn't have to be sales. After a lot of trial and error research I do not believe people will buy as much from a blog site as they will from a well designed online shop.

My blog sites only have one objective: that they should direct people to my main e-commerce website and I believe they do this well. Google Analytics stats show all these blogs as being in the top twenty referring sites to www.barefootleather.co.uk

www.barefootleather.blogspot.com is a clear leader with 85 direct referrals which is a huge percentage of overall visitors.

Ray