Members focus Posted September 18, 2012 Members Report Posted September 18, 2012 hello, i'm new to the forum and i am hoping to pick your brain on a comparison of a few machines. i have read the other posts on sewing machines and am now wondering if there are any major differences or considerations between a cobra 4 and a cowboy 4500 (or any other compareable machines). we will be using the machine to make saddle bags and other accoutrement for motorcycles, using leather of various weight and 10-11 wont be uncommon in our product. i know steve is a member of this forum and i believe bob is (?). perhaps i should just give each of them a call and chat with them, but i thought i would ask folks that are using them for some input. just want to make sure there aren't any major differences other than shipping cost (haha) as we are on the west coast (eugene, or). thanks so much for any input. cheers, ~focus Quote
Moderator Art Posted September 18, 2012 Moderator Report Posted September 18, 2012 They are both (Steve Tayrien -- Cobra, and Bob Kovar -- Cowboy) are fine gentlemen and their machines are very good. You would have no problem buying from either. You might see if you can take delivery at a show such as Pendelton Oregon. You will save yourself a couple of hundred dollars that way and get a personal test drive from Steve. I would call them both and talk with them, but you sound like you know what you want. Art Quote For heaven's sakes pilgrim, make yourself a strop!
Techsew Ron Posted September 18, 2012 Report Posted September 18, 2012 call around, see who will give you the best deal and who actually has the machine in stock! Ron Quote Techsew Industrial Sewing Machines Call toll-free: 866-415-8223 Visit www.techsew.com
Cobra Steve Posted September 18, 2012 Report Posted September 18, 2012 Hi focus. I will be in Pendleton in November for the Leather Show. Feel free to come by our booth and see the COBRA Class 4. If you order ahead of time, we will be glad to bring one to you and you will save shipping. We have machines in stock if you choose to order now or in the near future. Thanks, Steve Quote Thank You Steve Tayrien Leather Machine Co., Inc. 2141 E. Philadelphia St. Unit "U" Ontario, California 91761 1-866-962-9880 http://www.leathermachineco.com cobra@leathermachineco.com
Moderator Wizcrafts Posted September 19, 2012 Moderator Report Posted September 19, 2012 I own a Cowboy CB4500 and am totally pleased with it. It sews just about anything I throw at it. I got mine with the full accessory pack and am glad I did. I was previously sewing for a friend, on his Cobra Class 4 and it is also a fine machine. These 441 clone machines are quite similar. The differences are in how the dealers set them up and adjust them and what you get with the machine. The Cowboy machines come with stainless steel feet and throat plates, allowing you to sew wet leather without discoloring it. Quote Posted IMHO, by Wiz My current crop of sewing machines: Cowboy CB4500, Singer 107w3, Singer 139w109, Singer 168G101, Singer 29k71, Singer 31-15, Singer 111w103, Singer 211G156, Adler 30-7 on power stand, Techsew 2700, Fortuna power skiver and a Pfaff 4 thread 2 needle serger.
Moderator Art Posted September 19, 2012 Moderator Report Posted September 19, 2012 As far as I can tell from my machines, the other brands than Cowboy have hard chromed feet. Chrome is the anti rust component of stainless steel (around 20%). The part of the chromed feet (not Cowboy) that is in contact with the leather is approx 99% chrome (maybe 100%). Given that, I have never had a problem with modern feet or plates staining the leather. It can happen with older machines that were used in the shoe and other leather trades years ago. I have never seen staining on any leather that I run through my Cobra machines. Art Quote For heaven's sakes pilgrim, make yourself a strop!
Members jimsaddler Posted September 20, 2012 Members Report Posted September 20, 2012 As far as I can tell from my machines, the other brands than Cowboy have hard chromed feet. Chrome is the anti rust component of stainless steel (around 20%). The part of the chromed feet (not Cowboy) that is in contact with the leather is approx 99% chrome (maybe 100%). Given that, I have never had a problem with modern feet or plates staining the leather. It can happen with older machines that were used in the shoe and other leather trades years ago. I have never seen staining on any leather that I run through my Cobra machines. Art Hi Art As the one who sugested that Cowboy create the Stainless Steel Feet, Needle Plates. As a user for some 50 odd years of Sewing Machines on Leather, I have found that there is Leakage from all Chromed or Nickel Plated Feet! Good Leather contains Tannic Acid and or other Acids which react with these Platings to cause Ferric Stains on Damp Leather, especiallywhen there is slight damage from wear and tear. My Father who was a non-ferris and Feric Moulder, advised me many years ago that Stainless Steel was the only way to go to find Feet or Needle Plates that would not leave the Grey to Black stains on Damp Leather when sewing. Also the resulting items could be altered and Buffed up without affecting the stainless capability they posess. Cowboy took my advice on board and after a bit of trial came up with the Feet and Plates that are supplied at no estra cost to the Buyer. Result! Say you want to alter the Harness Foot set to sew very close up on Buckles or Rings. Just grind more off the Heel and Toe the Buff it up to shine again, then use it! "No discolouration of the Leather". Just a wonderful practical and efficient Tool that save time and effort without cost. Plated Steel Feet etc are now superceded, thank goodness and Cowboy have followed the Tradespeoples advice all the while and produced what we require. Hence the reliable products of to-day. Kindest Regards. Jim Saddler. Quote
Moderator Art Posted September 20, 2012 Moderator Report Posted September 20, 2012 Hi Jim, I can agree with the part on altering the foot. I have never experienced problems with marking as you describe. I have modified feet for particular operations and have not had trouble with them even though I took the chrome off. When I approched this with Steve (Cobra) he started manufacturing those feet and including them in his accessory package. They produced what I required. Art Quote For heaven's sakes pilgrim, make yourself a strop!
Moderator Wizcrafts Posted September 20, 2012 Moderator Report Posted September 20, 2012 Jim, thanks for that explanation about altering stainless feet. I did a little sanding on my right toe foot and have ground down and polished a couple of my throat plates. It's good to know that this doesn't change the stainless properties. I intend to have some custom feet made to sew particular jobs and they will be cut from stainless steel also. I like the looks of chrome, but hate it when it starts to chip off. I was using the roller edge guide on my friend's Class 4 and the guide hit the right toe on an upstroke and chrome began flaking off of the roller. A stainless roller wouldn't have been damaged, or, could have just been buffed smooth. Quote Posted IMHO, by Wiz My current crop of sewing machines: Cowboy CB4500, Singer 107w3, Singer 139w109, Singer 168G101, Singer 29k71, Singer 31-15, Singer 111w103, Singer 211G156, Adler 30-7 on power stand, Techsew 2700, Fortuna power skiver and a Pfaff 4 thread 2 needle serger.
Members Greystone Posted September 20, 2012 Members Report Posted September 20, 2012 a thought when doing any grinding or buffing SS, used only al oxide material/ wheel/paper, non ferrous or a SS brush DO NOT use any thing on SS that has brushed/ground/sanded, Steel as it will pu and carry the iron oxide to the SS and VIOLA rust on SS Quote www.facebook.com/pages/Greystone-Leather www.etsy.com/shop/GREYSTONELEATHER
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