How Do You Store Big Pieces Of Cased Leather?

[Bob Blea]

Hello,

I am starting on a large notebook. It will hold a legal size writing pad, the front cover will have a floral carving and the back with have a basket stamp covering it. Also, it will all be one single piece of leather, measuring roughly 16 x 21 inches. It's not huge but it will take a while to tool and stamp. I work a day job so evenings are the only times I get to work on projects, and normally I store smaller projects in the fridge when not tooling. However, this one is too big to fit. There's all that unecessary food in the way but the wife and kids won't let me get rid of it. And even if I did the door would still hit it.

So my question to everyone out there is this: When faced with a piece of cased leather that is too big for cold storage, do you have any tricks for how you handle it? I'm just planning on a couple of late nights and hopefully a lot of time on Saturday to get this done quickly before any mold gets a chance to grow. I added a little alcohol to the casing solution this time in an attempt to give some mold resistance. But does anyone have a storage solution for large parts to keep them cool until you can get back to working on them?

Thanks in advance for any advice,

Bob

[mikesmith648]

One trick I have used is to get a large cooler that I have and put ice in the bottom........I put a couple of tupperware cake covers upside dowm in ther and put leather on top.....keeps it cool without exposing it to the wet ice as it melts.....drain the water off daily and add more ice as long as you need it. Also Listerene added to the casing solution helps prevent any chance of mold growing.

[Bob Blea]

Thanks Mike, great idea! I'm not sure I have a cooler big enough to fit this but I might. I had thought about using it somehow but hadn't thought of using tupperware as a spacer like that. I will see if I can make the leather fit the big styrofoam cooler I have. I don't need long term storage, just something to keep it cool during the day.

If I come up with a neat solution I'll post it here. You've got me thinking of a rig that might make this work and guarantee no contact with the ice. If anyone else has solutions let me know.

Bob

[benlilly1]

I use a plastic zippered bag left over from purchasing a king sized bed cover. It works perfect for my project sizes. I just submerge my leather in warm water till it stops bubbling dry it off with a towel and insert it into the bag. I've never had a problem with mold and mine have stayed in the bag for days.

Edited May 30, 2013 by benlilly1

[Cyberthrasher]

I've had some issues with mold in the past and that's the only reason I started using the fridge. BUT, that was only after the piece sat wrapped in plastic for a couple of weeks. The ONLY purpose for keeping it cold in my eyes is to keep the mold from growing. If you're going to be working on it that quick, just slap it in that Styrofoam cooler after you wrap it up in plastic. I find the plastic helps to even out all the moisture, and then while I'm working I can simply unwrap the portion I'm working on without causing the rest of it to need re-cased. I actually plan my plastic wrap out for that. Say I have 3 sections with design work, I'll wrap each section with its own piece of plastic wrap and just make sure they overlap. That way I'm never unwrapping the entire piece at once. The only time I need to remoisten things is when I'm doing really detailed stuff that takes a while in small areas.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Cyberthrasher

[Bob Blea]

Thanks Benlilly and Cyberthrasher. If I can work so quickly that I can finish in the next few days I wouldn't worry to much about mold either. But, life has a tendency to get in the way. Having the leather on ice would buy me extra time. I normally leave stuff in the fridge for a couple of weeks sometimes without any problems, but just this week I had a problem with a piece of leather that had only been casing a few days. It looked a little like mold but it only showed up where my hand had been resting on the leather while using a brand new basket stamp. It may have been residual steel filings that caused the discoloration, but I'm treating it like it was mold. It's got me a little gun shy now. Thanks for the input!

Bob

[Jimbob]

dont worry about mold....your leather has enough tanning acid in it to withstand it for weeks....just keep it under plastic or like one said in a large zipper or taped plastic bag and u can keep it for days just as wet as you like....your discoloration is mostlikly oxidation from steel or metal....I have keppt my damp leather for days just under an old shoping bag and all is well !!!

Jimbob

[treybecca]

I second wrapping in Saran Wrap. And only exposing what typos are working on. I've done elaborate book covers that took two weeks (pesky real life schedule) with no issues. I do case mine with listerine solution also however

[Harag]

After reading this thread I have a couple of questions if I may.

1. Listerine - This is the mouth wash stuff right? as it's a brand name, would normal supermarket mouthwash be just as good or does it "have" to be listerine - does this have something in it the shop washes don't?

2. Benlilly1 - You say you soak your leather in warm water until it stops bubbling - isn't this too long for tooling - from my understanding this amount of time is for when you do wet forming and not carving. I've been doing something similar, but rather than wait for it to stop bubbling I quickly run it through the water bowl - takes about 2-3 seconds. I then let mine dry out for about 30 minutes before putting it in a bag overnight. I then tool the following day.

Thanks

[Bob Blea]

Thanks again all. Based on all the experienced advice here I'm just going to keep it bagged and just try to work it through quickly. I don't use the Saran Wrap method but I do keep the parts I'm not working on inside the bag and also use a piece of plastic to cover parts I'm not working on, and it works pretty well. When working things that I keep in the fridge I've gone for several weeks before finishing, so hopefully if I'm quick now I can get it done without any problems.

[Bob Blea]

dont worry about mold....your leather has enough tanning acid in it to withstand it for weeks....just keep it under plastic or like one said in a large zipper or taped plastic bag and u can keep it for days just as wet as you like....your discoloration is mostlikly oxidation from steel or metal....I have keppt my damp leather for days just under an old shoping bag and all is well !!!

Jimbob

Thanks Jimbob, I'm thinking like you that it was discoloration too. Just didn't seem right that mold would pop up like that after only a few days except that I let that piece sit out at room temperature more than I usually do. It was a brand new stamp that may have had something on it, or maybe I got something on my hands. I'm hoping that's all it was.

I had never heard that the acids still in the leather resisted mold formation but that does kind of make sense. I clean up that piece and put it back in the fridge in a new bag, and so far no more mold.

[benlilly1]

After reading this thread I have a couple of questions if I may.

1. Listerine - This is the mouth wash stuff right? as it's a brand name, would normal supermarket mouthwash be just as good or does it "have" to be listerine - does this have something in it the shop washes don't?

2. Benlilly1 - You say you soak your leather in warm water until it stops bubbling - isn't this too long for tooling - from my understanding this amount of time is for when you do wet forming and not carving. I've been doing something similar, but rather than wait for it to stop bubbling I quickly run it through the water bowl - takes about 2-3 seconds. I then let mine dry out for about 30 minutes before putting it in a bag overnight. I then tool the following day.

Thanks

I get the best results waiting for the bubbles to stop. It only takes a few seconds. I usually put it in the bag overnight. When I know I'm going to be ready to carve I get it out and let it sit in the open air until it's just right. I usually put the grain side down and check it often until I think the time is right.

[Bob Blea]

After reading this thread I have a couple of questions if I may.

1. Listerine - This is the mouth wash stuff right? as it's a brand name, would normal supermarket mouthwash be just as good or does it "have" to be listerine - does this have something in it the shop washes don't?

2. Benlilly1 - You say you soak your leather in warm water until it stops bubbling - isn't this too long for tooling - from my understanding this amount of time is for when you do wet forming and not carving. I've been doing something similar, but rather than wait for it to stop bubbling I quickly run it through the water bowl - takes about 2-3 seconds. I then let mine dry out for about 30 minutes before putting it in a bag overnight. I then tool the following day.

Thanks

Hi Harag,

Yes, it is the Listerine you find in the stores. Many people here swear by it. However, I've also been told by some pretty good authorities (Bob Park) that it's just the alcohol that is helping. That's why I just put alcohol in my casing solution. Also, I didn't want my leather smelling like listerine....

I case pretty much like you do, but I used to do it like Benlilly does. I do make sure my leather is very wet before setting it out to case. In my mind, letting it soak till all the bubbles stop coming out just makes it take longer to dry out but I may be wrong about that. I've heard on many saddle makers who do great work that case that way.

Thanks,

Bob

[Bob Blea]

I get the best results waiting for the bubbles to stop. It only takes a few seconds. I usually put it in the bag overnight. When I know I'm going to be ready to carve I get it out and let it sit in the open air until it's just right. I usually put the grain side down and check it often until I think the time is right.

You do great work so maybe there is something to soaking it that long. And the whole time you are working on it you don't refrigerate the piece?

Thanks again,

Bob

[Cyberthrasher]

I case pretty much like you do, but I used to do it like Benlilly does. I do make sure my leather is very wet before setting it out to case. In my mind, letting it soak till all the bubbles stop coming out just makes it take longer to dry out but I may be wrong about that. I've heard on many saddle makers who do great work that case that way.

Thanks,

Bob

Consider what the bubbles are - air that's trapped in the leather being forced out by the water. The point of casing is to get an evenly distributed level of moisture throughout the leather and especially in the core. Once all the bubbles are out, you know the core has moisture. If you're only letting it sit for 30 minutes before wrapping it up for the night, you're not getting the best casing you can. I usually give mine an 1 1/2 - 2 hours before wrapping it up. So yes, it does take longer to "dry" to a point where you can let the moisture distribute, but you'll be getting moisture in the core instead of just the outside layers. This will make your tooling that much better and stop it from drying out as quickly once you start the work.

[Harag]

Thanks for the input Cyber, appreciated as always. When casing I do it overnight as instructed in the casing pinned topic, but I was under the impression that wetting it for that long is great for wet forming an item, so i've just been running the leather through the bowl to get even water on it. I'll try leaving it for a longer though as you say about 2 hrs to see what difference it makes to my poor tooling, I'm still learning the stamps so the tooling dosn't look much better at the moment.

[Cyberthrasher]

As the casing document states - pull it through slowly until there are almost no bubbles left.

[Bob Blea]

Consider what the bubbles are - air that's trapped in the leather being forced out by the water. The point of casing is to get an evenly distributed level of moisture throughout the leather and especially in the core. Once all the bubbles are out, you know the core has moisture. If you're only letting it sit for 30 minutes before wrapping it up for the night, you're not getting the best casing you can. I usually give mine an 1 1/2 - 2 hours before wrapping it up. So yes, it does take longer to "dry" to a point where you can let the moisture distribute, but you'll be getting moisture in the core instead of just the outside layers. This will make your tooling that much better and stop it from drying out as quickly once you start the work.

I don't know that I buy the argument that you need to soak it in water until all the bubbles stop. The idea is to get the fibers of the leather rehydrated which takes time, hence why you case leather. The bubbles just represent air trapped between the fibers in the leather, but they don't mean that there isn't already enough water in the leather to fully rehydrate the fibers. To my thinking if the leather has already reached the wet noodle stage and is dripping water, it has enough to fully rehydrate everything as it sits overnight and the water fully soaks in. I get bubbles coming out of the leather even once it is out of the casing bath, which suggests to me that the air bubbles are a result of the fibers swelling as they take on water not just water pressure forcing air out. The fact that we have to wait many hours for the leather to return to normal color tells me that there is more than enough moisture to fully hydrate the leather. At least that's my theory. Like I said before, there are many great leather workers out there that do dip them till the bubbles stop, and they do great work.

Bob

[Cyberthrasher]

At least that's my theory.

Bob

That's the most important part.

Buy my theory, don't buy it - no problems

If you're happy with the results, keep at it. I only offer my theory on it for those who may see something lacking and feel they need a change.

I did realize here that it may have seemed like I was saying YOU were doing it wrong. Rest assured that I wasn't, only simply referencing your comments.

[Bob Blea]

No problem, I didn't think you were saying I was doing anything wrong. If there is difference in how we go about casing, I think it's slight and we probably both end up at the same destination. Maybe my way is a little quicker, but it might not be. But we both end up with a well cased piece of leather in the end. I'm no expert, that's why I hang around here, so I can learn. Thanks again.

Bob

[Cyberthrasher]

I'm no expert, that's why I hang around here, so I can learn. Thanks again.

Me too

[Harag]

It seems there is no right or wrong way, every leather is different and so the results will be. As long as we're happy with the result.

[Cyberthrasher]

It seems there is no right or wrong way, every leather is different and so the results will be. As long as we're happy with the result.

It's all experimentation and finding what's best for YOU. We have lots of guidelines to get you started in discovering your process, but in the end it's all trial and error and destroying all those test and scrap pieces!!

[benlilly1]

I will say this...if the leather isn't consistent in wetness there will be areas that are dryer and the effect of the tooling isn't consistent. That's why I wait for the bubbles to stop. Just my experience.

[Harag]

I will say this...if the leather isn't consistent in wetness there will be areas that are dryer and the effect of the tooling isn't consistent. That's why I wait for the bubbles to stop. Just my experience.

Agree. I've tried casing and simply wetting, and found the casing is way better, I've just been wetting when messing around with tools. e.g. I bought a rope tool and took quite a few goes before I worked out how to do a line of them. Now I just need to perfect the casing, hence the questions about wetting them. more practice is still needed.