Lci Clear Lac Question

[jynelle]

Hi friends,

I've just started working with LCI Clear-Lac (brushing it on full-strength) and would like to thin it a bit. Does anyone have a source for LCI thinner? And/or does the DYO thinner sold at Panhandle Leather work with the LCI Clear-lac?

Thanks,

Jynelle

[Cyberthrasher]

Springfield carries it all too. It is lacquer though, so you could use lacquer thinner.

http://springfieldleather.com/23272/Thinner%2CClear-Lac%2C32oz/

[jynelle]

Thanks! I'll go ahead and order from them--much appreciate your response!

[ToddB 68]

Hi Everyone !

I would like to use "Clear Lac" as an edge finish for my first leather project, a digging tool sheath, and will be using a felt-tipped pen I made as an applicator. Not knowing what my needs are going to be for bulk supplies in the future, I'm trying to keep initial costs down until I see how far I go with this new-to-me leatherwork hobby.

After browsing their website for the products I want and checking shipping charges, I've decided to buy the following items from Springfield Leather and registered on their website.

- Fiebing's Leathercraft CEMENT, 4oz. .............. $5.00

- Fiebing's Yellow Paste Saddle Soap, 3.5oz.........3.99

- Fiebing's Glycerine Saddle Soap #34-222102.....5.99

As mentioned in the first paragraph, I would like to use Clear Lac as an edge finish, however, the smallest container offered at Springfield is the 32oz. Quart @ $18.99 and it would weigh at least 2 lbs., so UPS standard shipping is going to make this single item real expensive for me and at this early stage in my Leatherworking career, who knows if I will ever use the bulk of it.

So, unless I can find a smaller container of Clear Lac at a lower price and weight (to reduce S&H cost), I will have to locate a different supplier for this product that sells a similar edge finish at a lower price and weight.

Does anyone know #1..If LCi makes a smaller container of Clear Lac and who sells it ? I made several attempts to find the LCi website and product list, but no luck. I've already looked at WYO Quik Slik and it comes In a 4oz. container for $4.50, but UPS Std. Shipping (Lowest cost method listed) is $22.49 ! And #2..What other similar product option(s) do I have with lower product price & weight ?

Thanks in advance for any help you can offer for my dilemma with the edge finish.

ToddB68

Edited February 4, 2014 by ToddB68

[terrymac]

I believe Panhandle offers it at $15.00 for the same size, and I don't believe you will find a small container. I bought some Quik Slick some time ago. and even with the high shipping cost, was one of the best buys I ever made. It is a great product and lasts a long time, and you would not need the saddle soap nor glycerine. I would not be without it.

Terry

[ToddB 68]

Hi terrymac

Thanks for the information !

I'm following the "Finishing Edges" process by Bob Park (hidepounder) and he uses the Fiebing's glycerine and yellow saddle soaps to rub and burnish edges prior to dyeing and finishing edges with Neat Lac (Now made by LCi as Clear Lac), so that's why I was planning on using those two products, as you probably guessed. These help to produce the smooth shape and final appearance on the edges that Bobby is known for and I am trying to duplicate.

You say that when using the Quik Slik I would not need the two soaps mentioned above. So what do you use to burnish leather edges with and do you get the appearance Bobby does ? (See How Do I Do That ? forum and Finishing Edges , by Bob Park and the picture lower down on his tutorial of the edges with this process.)

BTW, I checked Panhandle's website and yes, they offer a quart of Clear Lac for $15.00 and according to their Check Out, no taxes or Shipping charges, which is a plus for them. However, for me that's still too stiff on the cost of a single item when added to what I've already spent on my first leather project, plus what I plan to spend as listed in my above post #4.

I know you love Quik Slik , but with the high Shipping I must pass on that one and at this point, I'm still hoping someone can suggest an alternate product that works as good as Clear Lac, but in a smaller oz. container and less total cost for a beginning Leathercrafter . Maybe that's a "pipe dream" ! STILL LOOKING FOR HELP ON THIS !

Cheers !

ToddB68

Edited February 5, 2014 by ToddB68

[NVLeatherWorx]

The age old method of making beautiful edges requires a sponge, a little bit of water, and a slicking device (I use the same old wooden edger that I have had for a few years now). The first step is to use an edger (number 2 is the best unless you need a thicker skive) on both sides of the leather, moisten the edge and let it start to dry until damp, then just rub the edge fast enough to generate the heat needed to give the burnished appearance. The use of "quickies" like soaps, oils, spirits, etc. is just a shortcut and it doesn't allow the leather to actually be burnished (which is what you are really doing). You can only get a true sealed and set edge by doing a real burnish job on it. Besides, the use of saddle soaps is not a good idea on veg-tan leather as it will actually draw the natural oils out of the leather and dry it out.

[ToddB 68]

NVLeatherWorx ,

Wow ! Your post #7 kinda blows my mind ! That could hurt retail sales for certain products.

Do you still dye your edges, or do you just use the number 2, or whatever edge cutting tool, moisten with water, let dry until damp and burnish, doing nothing further ?

I was planning to use the saddle soaps on the edges only, following Bob Park's Finishing Edges tutorial, and then using 100% pure Neatsfoot Oil on all other surfaces to darken, soften and preserve my 12oz.leather sheath and give me that "oiled leather" look that I want.

But now that you have indicated saddle soap will actually draw the natural oils out of veg-tan leather and dry it out, I am caught between your advice and Bob Park's. Oh the joy of being caught between diametrically opposite advice from two different experts. I do appreciate your trying to help me reduce cost on supplies though.

In the beginning, I thought with all the leather working knowledge we have in our member base, I could gain the advantage of their experience and avoid trail and error, money misspent, etc. on my first project.

My objective was to find a reliable, economical, step-by-step process for doing edges that would give results like we see in the Bob Park's tutorial. However, it's looking like I might have to do some trial and error experimenting after all, to decide if I'm satisfied with the looks of your suggested process using no soaps. I do want dark-black edges though, not brown. I'll experiment on some scraps and see.

ToddB68

Edited February 5, 2014 by ToddB68

[terrymac]

Todd,

I, also, follow Bob Park's system except for using The Quick Slik rather that saddle soap and glycerine. NV is right about the old traditional manner of burnishing edges, I just get tired of rubbing and use something to speed up the process. Right now I am just using a piece of canvas to rub with, but am waiting for a new wood burnisher from the Ed the Bearman. I think the secret to any burnishing system is surface preparation.

Terry

[Randy Cornelius]

Any water or lacqor basised wood finish you find at the home center will work for a edge dressing after you slick your edges. You can get several small containers 1/2 pint and try several to see which ones work the best. That way you dont' have to order 32 oz of laquer and pay shipping.

[ToddB 68]

Terry and Randy.........Thanks for your inputs !

I've decided to consult with hidepounder (Bob Park) before doing anything further. I sent him a PM, requesting that he read this thread to get an understanding of my dilemma and then advise how, in his opinion, I should proceed with edge finishing.

Happy Trails !

ToddB68

[Red Cent]

With a motorized burnisher and plain water, a smooth sanded/rounded edge is a beautiful thing to behold. Glass slick and looks to be an inch deep. But it won't hold. I tried Hide Pounder's way and it works. I have tried other ways but recently I tried something that I don't know if it will hold but looks good now. I firmly believe proper sanding renders the proper edge. I sand a smooth rounded edge wth 220 with a foam block. I hand sand with 400 till all the "hair" is removed. This hair will haunt you later.

I use a dauber to apply water and Fiebling's saddle soap to the finished edge. To get the good edge it takes a number of runs until it is the right moisture. Then it shines. I airbrush dye and then I burnish with the motorized dowel rod. After everything is dry (next day) I apply an acrylic from Zack White. I do not know the name. The bottle has the #300 on it. It gets the darndest flexible edge I can find. Tim says it is a home brew.

[hidepounder]

Todd,

There are lot of ways to skin this cat! Mine is just one of them. That said, I believe it is one of the oldest and most common, tried and true methods. Personally, I challenge the notion that adding saddle soap to the edge of a piece of leather is detrimental. Especially if the edge is sealed after burnishing. Quik Slick an be substituted for saddle soap as a burnishing agent. It's a good product! It can also be dyed through. It is not, however, a sealer. If you want your edges sealed, you must apply a sealer just as you would when using saddle soap. I also agree, that sanding your edged with fine sandpaper increases the luster of the finished edge. I only sand that way on show pieces because the difference between my two edges is almost negligible when considering the additional time required. I use cocobolo burnishers to melt paraffin into the edge when I'm finished burnishing and that provides a beautiful luster. Other craftsmen get great results using other techniques. Mechanical burnishers speedup the process.

Hope this helps....

Bobby

[ToddB 68]

Bobby,

Thanks for the help in your post #13 !

I believe we are nearing the end of my quest.

With reference to your comment "Personally, I challenge the notion that adding saddle soap to the edge of a piece of leather is detrimental.", I'm going to bet my poker chips on you and order the following items (shown in my previous

post #4) from Springfield Leather.

- Fiebing's Leathercraft CEMENT, 4oz. .............. $5.00

- Fiebing's Yellow Paste Saddle Soap, 3.5oz...........3.99

- Fiebing's Glycerine Saddle Soap #34-222102.......5.99

I'm trying to get the right "handle" on the various products used in leatherwork. Some are obvious, like CEMENT listed above, others not so obvious as to what the product actually does in the leather edge finishing process.

With the above in mind, when we speak of LCi 's Neat Lac or Clear Lac, are these what you are referring to as a "final finish" at step #8 of your tutorial Finishing Edges and as a "sealer" in your last reply #13 ?

If your reply to the above question is "YES" then since no one has replied with an alternate final finish sealer equivalent to Clear Lac in a lower-cost container, then I will reluctantly spend more money and buy more product than I might ever use and order the 32oz. Clear Lac from Panhandle Leather @ $15.00.

I look forward to your reply.

Best regards,

ToddB68

Edited February 7, 2014 by ToddB68

[ToddB 68]

Hi terrymac ,

When we were talking about LCi Clear Lac, in your post #5 you said " I believe Panhandle offers it at $15.00 for the same size".

And in my post #6 to you, fourth paragraph, I said " BTW, I checked Panhandle's website and yes, they offer a quart of Clear Lac for $15.00 and according to their Check Out, no taxes or Shipping charges, which is a plus for them."

Well, yesterday I decided to go ahead and order the Clear Lac from Panhandle, since Bobby hadn't been around to answer the question in my post #14. I wanted to get moving along and figured I would have to "bite the $15.00 bullet" in order to do so.

Oh yeah, I was all "lathered-up" and ready to make the purchase, but had to register at Panhandle first of course. After that, I completed the ordering process, but this time their order program added $18.00 for standard shipping, for a total cost of $33.00 ! So I cancelled my order.

Once again, the shipping cost was "over the top" for me. I'll just have to be satisfied with an inferior product at lower total cost and performance. In the coming days I'll make a decision on some other product.

BTW, the (3) products I ordered from Springfield Leather Co., Inc.(Listed in my post #14 right above.) came to $21.83 Grand total, as the standard shipping was hiked up from $5.85 to $6.85 in just the last week !

Just thought you might like to know what happened. Sorry the news isn't very up-lifting.

ToddB68

[terrymac]

Todd,

Sorry about that. When you mentioned it, I thought that was unusual as suppliers normally cover their shipping costs. The problem with this stuff is it has to ship ground via UPS rather than normal channels. They won't allow anything flammable in the air. Same thing when ordering spirit dyes or antique paste. You might try what Randy suggested. I've never tried what he suggested. I just know, even, with the shipping it will last for a long time, and when it is all said and done, the cost is small when you figure all the projects you will use it on.

Terry

[ToddB 68]

Terry,

Thanks for your kind words of concern.

I just sent an e-mail to hidepounder (Bob Park) to get his comments and opinions on Randy's suggestion; second opinions never hurt.

My hope is to find an alternate product for leather edge finishing that is not only less cost (price + shipping) but also performs well.

Adiós Amigo

[NVLeatherWorx]

Even though I stick with the traditional methods of just using a wooden slicker on damp leather, I have found that adding a light coating of plain old wax (simple plain candle wax) and giving it another run with a wooden slicker (I have two of them, one for each step) that it gives that edge an extra sheen that I have yet to get using any other methods. And, although there are some who live by the saddle soap's and Glycerine based products that don't feel there is any detriment to the leather by doing so, all you have to do is research other Master's directly and they will tell you the same thing that I did. They are great when you have a major reconditioning and cleaning project where the leather is just short of dry rot but they leave residues behind that crystalize when they dry which damages the fiber structures of the leather and can cause it to dry out and become hard and possibly even brittle over time. Even the manufacturers are very clear on exactly how their product is to be used and that failure to adhere to their directions could cause permanent damage to an item if not followed.

However, we all do things differently and that is what makes our trade so diverse in the results achieved.

@ToddB68: The edges are finished to the desired specifications of the client. If they want them left natural then they get left natural; if they want them finished in a color then they get that color. If they are colored then they are dyed before the wax treatment. Although it has been pointed out that my method may require a lot of rubbing in order to achieve the results, it doesn't take much longer than using any other method. The trick is in the preparation (size of bevel, moisture content) and the tools being used. Wood works much faster because it heats up much faster than any of the plastic or other artificial materials that are being used and once you have used a wooden slicker a couple of times the wood itself starts to take on a burnished appearance and feel which makes it even easier the next time. It doesn't hurt to keep the wood conditioned either with a little bit of oil or candle wax. My method has not negatively impacted my sales at all over the past 40 plus years as this is the finished edge look that people equate to handmade leather goods. I figure, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it," and it has been working every since I first started this trade back in the 70's and this is also they way that we were all taught to do it back in those days so there must be a reason why that is the way we were taught then and it is the way that you will be taught today if you were to ever attend ANY leatherwork classes out there.

[ToddB 68]

Hi NVLeatherWorx !

Thanks for your reply #18.

I have a wood shop and have been thinking of making my own wooden slicker.

Do you know of any domestic hardwood that would give reasonable service ? Or should I stay with an

exotic like cocobolo, rose wood, etc. ?

Or should I opt for wool felt ?

ToddB68