Adler 267-373 Problem

[chiocciola]

Hi all, i'm a new member of the forum. my name is Alessandro and i write from Milan, Italy. actually i don't sew leather but i'm working with fabrics for military equipment so the machines are similar... i recently bought an used adler 267 373 and when i was playing with it for the first time i got some thread stukked in the bobbin area. i found this cool video

)

with the explanation for unmount this part, i did it but now the machine it is not working, is like if the down thread is not catched by anything. i saw there is a long hole near the bobbin area for some regulation but actually i don't know exactly how to use it... i came from an old singer 331k24 and the system is really different and i feel a bit lost. I hope to find some help from you expert guys, thanks in advance to all.

Edited June 24, 2014 by chiocciola

[Northmount]

In the first picture, there is a little tab on the bobbin basket that should be trapped in a slot under the needle plate. It the basket is not kept in the right position, it won't sew properly, sounds awful, and breaks the top thread. The tab is in the 7:30 position, should be in the 9:00 o'clock position. This is similar to my machine even though different make/style.

Tom

[chiocciola]

Thanks Tom for the quick reply. i did the change you mean, i didn't see at the start but i think now it is in the right way.

i tried again but it didn't sew, probably i have also to regulate the screw on the right but i don't know in which way i have to put it.

thanks

[Constabulary]

it´s probably - as most of the times - the needle / hook timing that is wrong.

Do you have a manual where the procedure is mentioned?

[chiocciola]

thanks for the reply.

actually i have the manual but the part about the timing is not explained... here there is the list of manuals avalaible for this machine https://www.duerkopp-adler.com/en/main/Support/downloads/index.html?action=search&prop0=%2Fcommons%2Fdownload%2Fpublic%2F267%2F&prop1=%C2'> do you have any good video tutorial of a similar machine for learn how to timing the hook-needle?

thanks

[Gregg From Keystone Sewing]

http://www.keysew.com/Webpages/DemoImages/Adler267ServiceBook.pdf

Check out this attached book, hope it helps.

[chiocciola]

thanks for the reply, unfortunatly i already had this book and it didn't helped me.

i did a video

i'm reading manuals about fixing timing but most of the photos are for vertical bobbins.

ps. i'm using 134-35R needles #21

thanks

Edited June 25, 2014 by chiocciola

[Wizcrafts]

The hook is retarded by at least 1/4 turn. You may need to find out how to advance the hook. But, first you should set the needlebar to the correct factory setting, to make sure it is not adjusted too high. This could happen if the needlebar screw got shaken loose by the pounding of sewing hard leather. It could have slid up a smidgin at a time until it went completely out of reach of the hook.

Ensure that you are using the specified needle system.

[chiocciola]

thanks for your reply. today i'm going to take a look to the needle bar. about the timing do you have a nice tutorial o explanation for understand which parts i have to regulate? i understand a bit how it should work but honestly i don't know which part i have to regulate for first.

thanks

[Constabulary]

I don´t have an Adler 267 but these triple feed machines have basically the same mechanism.

I took a shot out of a 267 manual so here is a picture (see below)

Remove the needle plate and turn the hand wheel until the tip of the hook meets the middle of the needle. Now you hou have to loosen the two screws at the clamps of the needle bar frame and you have to lower your needle bar just a little bit. Just as much until the tip of the hook meets the needle within the scarf just 1.6mm above the eye of the needles during the upward movement of the needle bar. Now fasten both screws tightly + evenly. Do some test stitches by turning the hand wheel and see if this works.

The hooks turns twice and it meets the needle scarf when it finishes the 2nd turn.

Maybe you have to "play a little bit" but this is how it works on the majority of triple feed mechanism of this class and I´m sure it will be the same at the Adler 267.

Sorry no Video.

[chiocciola]

thanks for your reply, yesterday i did some progress.

first of all i played a bit with the needle bar, after that i played a little under the machine. this was my POV

i unscrewed the allen (green arrow) and than with a tongs i took the tube and i manually moved the wheel of the machine, in this way the bobbin stayed motionless. i don't know if it is the right way or not.. but it worked.

it sews well if i go slow but if i increase the speed it miss some stitches, i think because the timing are not well regulated, is it possible?

Thanks

Edited June 27, 2014 by chiocciola

[Constabulary]

I´m not sure if this was a good idea. The screw is a set screw and normally sits in a certain position on a flattened point or in a notch of the shaft and it sits there for a reason. If I were you I would revise this and put the screw back to where it was otherwise it could damage your drive shaft sooner or later.

I´m sure don´t want to damage anything on an Adler machine - trust me my friend this shaft will probably cost and arm and a leg when it is messed up + someone has to install it and this will cost you serious $$$

[chiocciola]

your reply is scaring me. actually when i unscrewed the allen i looked inside the hole and i didn't see any flattened point but only the sign of the screw. anyway i did the change yesterday night and i was a bit tired, today i want make more experiments.

i have to admit that i didnt understand very well if for regulate i have only to play with the needle bar or also with the bobbin position... according to the post of Wizcrafts i have to do both of them, maybe i unscrewed the wrong part and there was a better way to do it?

Thanks

[Constabulary]

It indeed should scare you! I think there should be a flat spot, notch or indentation for the set screw for securing th pulley properly! I unfortunately cannot see the end of the shaft in the Adler parts list.

I have attached a picture of a shaft on which a hand wheel has not been secured properly and this has ruined the shaft. The grove that goes around the shaft (picture 2) is worn off from wrong positioned set screws - there shouldn´t be such grove!!!

If a machine is out of time you always (ALWAYS) should check the needle bar position first. If this does not solve the problem you can to go further but I think in more than 90% of the cases this solves the problem.

Edited June 27, 2014 by Constabulary

[Constabulary]

Okay so here is a small Video I just shot from my Singer 111 so you have an idea of how it looks when the tip of the hook meets the needle scarf. It looks a bit different at your machine but basically it is the same.

BTW - do you know all the "vocabulary" such as needle scarf, hook, needle plate and so on?

At first I would revise the settings you made at the belt pulley set screw you mentioned above. Make sure the screw sits at the correct spot.

I would not use the machine again without knowing the screw sits where it should. - I´m serious! This screw secures the pulley and there is a lot of force on that spot when you run the machine and what happens when it is not properly secured can bee seen in the 2 pictures above (different machine but same result).

Then remove the needle plate to have a better view on the parts and turn the hand wheel and see where the hook meets the needles. The tip of the hook should meet the needle scarf approx. 1.6mm above the needle eye when the needle bar is in the upwards movement. I think this can bee seen in the video quite clear.

Good luck!

Edited June 27, 2014 by Constabulary

[chiocciola]

wow, thanks a lot Constabulary! the first thing as i came home will be to put all in the original way.

thanks!

[chiocciola]

goodmorning,

yesterday evening i put the machine in the original way. thanks to Costabulary who warned me! in fact it was not wrong the way i did, it was the wrongest way.

The allen i unscrewed i thought was for blocking the shaft, in fact there was a thing a bit strange... when i unscrewed the allen the first time there was a sign of the screw on the shaft, after i regulated the shaft (in the wrong way, don't do it at home guys) the sign of the screw was in the same spot, a bit strange but it was after midnight and i was a bit tired... yesterday when i tried to put all in the original way i use the clamps again and i saw that the part who was moving was not the one i tought but was the part with the pulley for the belt! indeed if you put enought strong with the clamps and you turn the handwheel you can hear that something go out of place and then you can easily move all, when you complete the loop it go in the original way and you have again to put a bit of strong. i put all in the original way and i hope everything is fine.

after this i played only with the needle bar and i think i scored it because now it is sewing well, here a video of the timing.

thanks, thanks and thanks again.

[Constabulary]

So far the timing looks good. Glad you solved it!

I´m not exactly sure what you did on the pulley but I guess your machine has a safety clutch (but don´t know for sure). What you probably did is that you have released the safety clutch and set it back in again. This was probably what you have heard. The safety clutch prevents the hook from damage when you hit a hard spot (for example when the needles hits the needle plate) when you are sewing.

I hope your machine works well now.

You should read the manual before you "rupture" your machine with tools again - Try to find a manual in Italian language.

Also try to find information regarding the safety clutch and how you can set it back.

Good luck with your machine!

[Trox]

Hi Chiocciola,

I have the same machine (DA 267-373) and never had a problem with it. If I had seen this thread a bit before I could have told you to check the clutch first. Now you have learn it the hard way.......at least you know much more about your machine this way.

The safety clutch are there to prevent hook damages when its blocked up by threads or such. You can read about it in page number 13 in the service manual. How to free it and do the control; see fig. 21 (Abb 21; that is German for abbildung= figure in English) These manuals are made for trained sewing machine mechanics and are not always easy to understand for users. They are often badly translated to English too, so if you do not understand a word it might be written in German still (ask Google or Constabulary to translate)

The clutch might not be correctly engaged (like in your case) , like described in the manual page 13 section 2.5.

If this happen the the hook will turn again, but the timing will be wrong. Do the control like described in the manual and add some kerosene to free it up, if it do not work properly (Oil it up after wards). Check your timing again afterward. Remember to put in a new needle, size and system according to the manual first

Good luck

Tor

[chiocciola]

thanks for yours replies and sorry for the delay.

@Constabulary what you said make sense about the safety clutch, i'm very happy they put it otherwise my machine was broken. you are also right about read the manual before do anything on the machine.

@Trox Hi Trox, i already seen some your messages about the adler 267 273. actually i think everything is ok, the clutch should be in the right place and it sew really well! i also mounted a servo motor with needle synchronizer and it is another world versus my old and dear singer.

thanks again for all your support and time.

[Trox]

Hi, Yes it`s fine machines, If I find equivalent in cylinder bed (269-373); then my Pfaff 345 got to go. When you have timed the machine enough times (like I have) you understand the value of an safety clutch.

Good luck

Tor