Lacing - getting started

[UKRay]

I am sitting surrounded by a mass of open text books (Bruce Grant, etc etc) 'cos I've spent the afternoon wrestling with the lacing on a belt. Sadly, it doesn't matter how many times I refer to the books, start from a different point, lick my fingers, scratch my head or re-thread the lacing needle (I have done that a lot!) it still looks a horrible, horrible mess. I guess it serves me right for getting over-confident. "Of course I can learn this in an afternoon..." Yeah, right, if it was that easy everyone would be doing it...

Could someone please explain to me - preferably in big pictures and words of one syllable - how I get the holes in the right place;

how should I start the lacing so it looks neat and just as importantly - how the heck do I stop?

I would ideally like to end up with something similar to Freak's glorious basket weave lacing: http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?a...st&id=14139 but I accept that this may be a tad ambitious. Should I have started with something easier?

Could you please be generous and contribute your tricks, tips and suggestions before I make any more mess?

[Tina]

I am sitting surrounded by a mass of open text books (Bruce Grant, etc etc) 'cos I've spent the afternoon wrestling with the lacing on a belt. Sadly, it doesn't matter how many times I refer to the books, start from a different point, lick my fingers, scratch my head or re-thread the lacing needle (I have done that a lot!) it still looks a horrible, horrible mess. I guess it serves me right for getting over-confident. "Of course I can learn this in an afternoon..." Yeah, right, if it was that easy everyone would be doing it...

Could someone please explain to me - preferably in big pictures and words of one syllable - how I get the holes in the right place;

how should I start the lacing so it looks neat and just as importantly - how the heck do I stop?

I would ideally like to end up with something similar to Freak's glorious basket weave lacing: http://leatherworker.net/forum/index.php?a...st&id=14139 but I accept that this may be a tad ambitious. Should I have started with something easier?

Could you please be generous and contribute your tricks, tips and suggestions before I make any more mess?

Did send you a mail:-)

[electrathon]

Start with a double loop lacing first, then move on to the harder ones.

[8thsinner]

When your putting your lacing needle on:

Cut the taper longer, insert, screw, undo it and snip off just below where it stopped going in. This will put the toughest and thickest part of the lace where it needs to be.

If your doing the mexican braid put in a dozen or so stitches at a time, then add braiding grease, the one in grant's book has always worked well enough for me. Tighten up the stitches using the same pressure each time. If you do one stitch at a time you will tend to use differing amounts of pressure, so use the same pressure 12 times in a row then start more stitching.

If you have a scratch awl, or long needle etc. As the lace is leaving the hole, use the needle to apply reverse pressure keeping it flat just out of the hole. This applies on every pass, whether it's coming out or going in.

The best book to use with regards to stopping and joining the braided lace in Al stohlmans decorative lacing, theres a picture for every step. Theres also a link recently posted here with the details, I can't find it right now. But it would help a lot.

Another thing, If things get tricky or you start to lose concentration just stop and do something else for a while, give your eyes and your brain a chance to slow down and relax, It's just another muscle.

Hope that helps you out for the moment.

Forgot to add, your holes might be too small, you punched them all first right, what size are they and what width is your lace?

Edited November 20, 2008 by 8thsinner

[UKRay]

Forgot to add, your holes might be too small, you punched them all first right, what size are they and what width is your lace?

Thanks muchly for the good advice guys - yes I punched all the holes (slots would be a better description) first. They are just about the same width as the lace which looks to be about 1/8" wide - standard Tandy purchased on a reel lace. I punched them with a three pronged lacing chisel. I wondered if I should have made round holes but the picture I found easiest to follow - yeah, right... had slots so I did it that way.

Which are best/easiest - slots or round holes? Does it matter? I noticed that the Tandy kits all have holes... there is probably a reason for this...

[8thsinner]

Holes are way easier than slots with those dimensions.

If you have a triangular marlin spike that will fit the width, I would suggest dampening the leather a tiny bit, and stretch the holes with the triangle, The point of which faces the edge of the belt, Push the spike against the outside edge of the belt as you do this, unless one of your holes seems wonky in which case adjust to fit.

Obviously you can't push it too much, just use common sense here. but tread carefully, damp leather as you know holds it's scars.

Or chop up a bit of wood scrape and sand it smooth and use it. If your making one make one edge blunter, this is the side that would face the edge of the belt, all you want to do is round the slot on two planes.

It will help your inner sides but still keep a fairly neat even flat appearance on the inner edge of the belt, It will also make room for your lace to go through properly.

If you get stuck with a certain hole pull the first strand against the appropriate side which it will pull against, stick the scratch awl through wiggle it a bit on the inside and then try.

If your stuck with a hole on the first entry, you need to stretch the hole more.

Seems I always forget something right now.

Generally speaking holes are much much tougher. Not that lacing done right should lead to the leather stretching and ripping but there you go.

The round holes spread the tension all around itself, it will deform but rarely split.

The bag I am using at the moment most of the holes are ovals, It needs replaced big time.

Edited November 21, 2008 by 8thsinner

[Rawhide]

I haven't heard anyone's use of a lacing fid. I prefer to use slits instead of holes, because it looks 100 times better. It looks very amaturish to use holes. Second, use the two prong lacing needle. (hint: polish the needle and the fid). When using the prong lacing needle, pre-punch the holes in the lace with a scratch awl. you'll be amazed at how much stronger the lace is and how long it lasts without breaking. Wax your lace with beeswax. Use the fid to open the slits a bit to get the needle through. Leather tends to close naturally when you spread it apart. If you punch holes, they won't close because the material is no longer there to close. Same thing when saddle stitching, using the stitching awl, the holes almost disappear when you stitch, and same goes for using slits for lace.

Best explination I found to lace was in the book from tandy shown below. And it's only 3 bucks (US) if you're a wholesale member.

[UKRay]

Thanks again for the help guys, although it seems like I'm getting some conflicting advice here - but unless I'm mistaken, holes versus slits may be something of a personal decision.

Marlon, I think I agree with the whole look thing but does anyone think it might be easier to learn to lace using holes - I can maybe progress to slits later?

I have two sorts of lacing needle - one sort is the hook and eye lacing needle from Tandy and the other is a Perma-Lok tubular brass needle which is what I think 8thsinner is suggesting I use . I have been using the hook and eye sort with my slits. This would appear to be wrong and I have to say, I struggle to keep the thong in the needle for long - does two hooks (prongs) improve the situation appreciably?

One more question has occured to me whilst I'm writing this - how far from the edge of the leather should I be putting my slits/holes and how far apart should they be. My lacing currently looks very 'sparse' almost as though I have used lace that is too thin - I have simply used standard width Tandy lace and the spacing that the slit cutter gives me. Has anyone got any words of wisdom here? Is there some kind of magic formulae for this?

Fid - No fid? Metal - wood? Anyone else got any suggestions?

[pete]

in a nutshell- if you are using 1/8th lacing, poke your slits/holes 1/8th apart, 1/8th away from the edge. This will give you a professional look.

pete

[Rawhide]

Marlon, I think I agree with the whole look thing but does anyone think it might be easier to learn to lace using holes - I can maybe progress to slits later?

I agree with this. It may be easier to learn this way.

I have two sorts of lacing needle - one sort is the hook and eye lacing needle from Tandy and the other is a Perma-Lok tubular brass needle which is what I think 8thsinner is suggesting I use . I have been using the hook and eye sort with my slits. This would appear to be wrong and I have to say, I struggle to keep the thong in the needle for long - does two hooks (prongs) improve the situation appreciably?

The needles I am speaking of have two plies with one ply having two small prongs on it. It is similar to the hook and eye needle

One more question has occured to me whilst I'm writing this - how far from the edge of the leather should I be putting my slits/holes and how far apart should they be. My lacing currently looks very 'sparse' almost as though I have used lace that is too thin - I have simply used standard width Tandy lace and the spacing that the slit cutter gives me. Has anyone got any words of wisdom here? Is there some kind of magic formulae for this?

General rule of thumb is thickness of stackup of material = distance from edge for slits/holes. As far as lace spacing goes, I prefer no spaces between laces. This is accomplished only by punching each slit with nippers on a 7 stitch per inch spacing for 1/8" lace, or 8 stitch per inch for 3/32" lace. the photo below shows the 8 spi with 3/32" lace.

Fid - No fid? Metal - wood? Anyone else got any suggestions?

Fid-yes, metal/wood, doesn't matter I don't think, but you can probably make one from a screwdriver.

Marlon