Gluing Edges Instead Of Stitching

[seabee]

I'm sitting here thinking about making my first holster and was wondering why do I needed to stitch the leather edges. All I have is some 6/7 oz. and 2/3 oz.VTL, and was going to contact glue them together (flesh to flesh). If glue the is suppose to be stronger than the leather, why do the edges need to be stitched? I have read here that it is common to stitch after gluing. and let me say that the workmanship on this site is second to none, out standing work and willing to share their skills. Over the last year, you all have helped to stay on track.

Thank You All,

Howard

[terrymac]

It will eventually come apart.

Terry

[glockanator]

The glue is a temporary bond until you can stitch.

[Red Cent]

If glue the is suppose to be stronger than the leather, why do the edges need to be stitched

I guess it would depend on the glue. I use a contact cement that is strong but would never last. If you are making a pouch to drop the handgun into, might work. If you are going to form the holster to the gun, doubt it. The pressure put on a holster from all kind of things in nature would destroy the holster. And I don't know what you would say to a customer.

Who do you know that glues and does not stitch?

[cleanview]

If i Line a holster there are portions that are just glued. One time I ruined a holster while building it and then tried to pull it apart just to see, and the leather ripped before the cement. those portions have not been stitched since. I just build it as if it was one piece of leather.

[seabee]

Terrymac, Glockanator, Red Cent, and Cleanview, I thank you for your responds. I am going to stitch.

However, i'm not going to stitch my first holster. I want to see what happens when it subjected to water, sun, sand, and temperatures of 100 + degrees. Red Cent, I don't know who glues and not stitch. Everyone on this site glues and stitches. I also do not know anyone that makes holster or does leather working. I am learning leatherwork from all the great craftmem/craftwonen on this site. Maybe, some day I might have a customer or two, but don't see that in the near future. This is a hobby. The things I make, I give to people who need the item no $$$. Most are try to make ends meet. I get a warm feeling inside when say just enjoy the item and the look in their eyes is payment enough.

God bless you all and God bless America,

Howard

i

[Eaglestroker]

If i Line a holster there are portions that are just glued. One time I ruined a holster while building it and then tried to pull it apart just to see, and the leather ripped before the cement. those portions have not been stitched since. I just build it as if it was one piece of leather.

The problem you will run into with this, long term, is that after a lot of draws the liner will start to seperate and the gun will snag it when holstering. Every time it snags the seperation will continue, so your nice lined holster will be unserviceable. If their is a lining it needs to be stiched to prevent that from happening which is not an *if* but a when.

[seabee]

Eaglestroker, Thank you for pointing out how the liner problem will affect the weapon when holstering. That in its self is a reason for stitching. In my field I can't afford a bad or unsafe holster.

Thanks you again,

Howard

God be with you, and God bless America

[malabar]

There was a fellow posting on here some time back about the high-end alligator belts he was making (or was it croc?). For the prices he was charging, he didn't want to stitch because he thought it looked inelegant. So he took a lot of time to thoroughly bond the gator to the liner with leather cement. Said it worked just fine.

BUT...

a holster is exposed to a completely different set of pressures. Moving the gun in and out forces the layers apart. You don't have that kind of pressure with a belt.

tk

Edited July 27, 2015 by malabar

[Red Cent]

"I want to see what happens when it subjected to water, sun, sand, and temperatures of 100 + degrees."

That will not be your problem. It is the numerous ways the gun will work as a lever to pry the holster apart. I do a lot of western leather. In competition, a 200 pound individual runs hell bent for leather to certain weapons used in the stage. All carry two guns that weigh about 36 ounces empty.

When I do a western holster for competition and after the fold is made and glued, I sew one end forward, back, and forward to the other end and repeat on that end. Then I drop a tiny bit of liquid super glue on the middle stitches.

Any stitches that is cosmetic, I cut and add the tiny drop of glue. Stitch ends worry me.

[YinTx]

One other way to think about this:

1) Yes, the glue is stronger than the leather.

2) When you pull on a glued seam, what separates is the leather from the leather. That is to say, the leather will delaminate/peel and the glue bond will hold. As such the bond is only fractions of an inch thick into the leather, where the cement managed to fill into the voids of the leather. *It does not penetrate the entire thickness of the leather.* So you are testing the tensile strength of a very thin sheet of leather in this case. It will fail.

3) The stitch causes you to place the *entire* thickness of the leather into play. When you test the tensile strength now, you are testing the *entire* thickness of the leather and the thread as a single entity. This can be incredibly strong, particularly when you are using a thick, strong thread and a thick, high quality leather. You have to either break the thread, or tear the thread through the entire thickness of the leather.

I don't know anyone that can pull apart a newly sewn 12 oz veg leather with 1mm Tiger thread. I do know folks that can pull apart a glued only leather seam.

Just a different perspective, good or bad. I'll be stitchin.

YinTx

[cleanview]

Read these all this morning and thought about it through the day. Wanting to be bull headed, but reminding myself that 200 holsters in I still consider myself new. There is always so much to learn. My first thought was that my daily carry holster has unstitched lining at the barrel end of the the holster and looks fine. Then I began to think, well if it is able to come apart it will even on stitched linings. I made a cowboy SAS type belt that I wear daily in my job as a work belt. I sweat profusely, I mean ALOT. Today I examined it (hoping to prove myself right) and some of the most abused areas I could see some separation.

Well, I guess I will go back to stitching the lined areas as well.

On that note, some of you may wonder if the time and effort you put into articulating your point of view on matters such as this (and many others) fall on deaf ears or is worth the effort. I hope you know that your time and effort is not without appreciation.

[Paramedic04]

I honestly am not going to stick a loaded firearm that I paid hard earned money for in a holster that's not reinforced with stitching and take the chance on a negligent discharge and injuring myself, someone else, or damaging my very valuable self defense tool. THAT'S why I always stitch and sometimes double stitch in areas on my holsters.

[JasonL70]

i would be surprised if an unsewn holster would survive even the first insertion of the gun during molding, unless it was a very loosely fit holster to begin with. the cement may hold, but the leather it's bonded to would probably tear.

Don't be out off by hand stitching. it's easy, and will look very good if you use the proper tools to lay out the holes. I was thinking of just using cement before i made my first holster, but decided to just go down to my local tandy shop and have them teach me how to stitch. the guys at my local store were all gun enthusiasts as well as really into leather working (a rarity at tandy it seems), and the happily sat down and taught me various methods. it was much easier to get a professional looking end result than i had imagined.

Edited July 30, 2015 by JasonL70