Wanting to get a Toro

[RocknBLeather]

Okay, I read all of the post on the Toro 3000.

I went to the Artisan web sight and fell in love with the

Toro 4700, I like the longer arm and the fact that I can

do heavier leather if desired.

I am a Tippman user at the moment, I really like it but I am

ready to upgrade.

Is Commerce, CA the only place to buy a Toro? I live in CA and I was

trying to avoid state tax. Trying to save on the tax might bite me on the shipping.

Thanks,

Tina

[Art]

Hi Tina,

The 4700 is a flat bed machine, is that what you need? Also it is a drop feed walking foot machine which doesn't have needle feed. Could you tell us exactly what you will be stitching.

Look at the 4500 if you want a flat bed, but there is also the 4000 LA-25 or the 4000R for cylinder arm machines. These machines DO have needle feed and walking foot and feed dogs (which can be removed and a needle slot plate installed for leather work). Of course the 4000P is the big heavy duty run it all day every day machine that uses size 138 up thread.

You can talk with Artisan Dave here on leatherworker.net or call him or Steve at the Commerce facility and they can help you with selection.

Art

Okay, I read all of the post on the Toro 3000.

I went to the Artisan web sight and fell in love with the

Toro 4700, I like the longer arm and the fact that I can

do heavier leather if desired.

I am a Tippman user at the moment, I really like it but I am

ready to upgrade.

Is Commerce, CA the only place to buy a Toro? I live in CA and I was

trying to avoid state tax. Trying to save on the tax might bite me on the shipping.

Thanks,

Tina

[skipj]

Art, I don;t want to misdirect this subject but what are the different feeds you talk about. Can you suggest a site that might describe them. I'm planning on purchasing a sewing machine for western style holsters, lots of bullet loops, at Wickenburg and need to know what would be suitable. Also accessories needed. I've tried the Artisan 3000 and 4000. It's easier to sew the loops with the 4000 but also costs $1000 more. Since this is a hobby with me, I'm not sure the 4000 would be worth it. I guess I it didn't work out, I could get some of the difference back if I sold it.

Thanks in advance,

SkipJ

[BillB]

SkipJ,

The easiest way to think of it is:

Feed Dogs work from the bottom to move the material;

Walking Foot works from the top to move the material'

Needle Feed will move the material once it has penetrated all the way through.

Feed Dogs and Walking Feet can be either smooth or have teeth in them. If you are doing leather work and do not want to mare the surface you want the smooth surface. Teeth are used for moving fabrics, webbing, etc.

Needle Feed is used to move multiple layers and keep the layers aligned.

[Art]

Hi Skip,

To add to Bill's post, Feed Dogs are also called "Drop Feed" in the trade and Having Drop, Needle, and Walking feet is called "Unison Feed" these days. There is also a "Jump Foot" instead of walking foot in which the foot quickly lifts during the needle feed stroke; you rarely find the drop feed with this setup. The jump foot is an older technology. I think the Classic is the only new machine that still uses it. It does however work very well for harness work and most leatherwork in general. The Ferdinand 900 B was rigged this way and that is a really great machine.

Art

SkipJ,

The easiest way to think of it is:

Feed Dogs work from the bottom to move the material;

Walking Foot works from the top to move the material'

Needle Feed will move the material once it has penetrated all the way through.

Feed Dogs and Walking Feet can be either smooth or have teeth in them. If you are doing leather work and do not want to mare the surface you want the smooth surface. Teeth are used for moving fabrics, webbing, etc.

Needle Feed is used to move multiple layers and keep the layers aligned.

[bcurrier]

Try this link:

http://www.industrialsewmachine.com/webdoc3/feed.htm

I know I have a link somewhere to a site with moving diagrams, but can't find it right now.

Bill

[barra]

Here is a little animation I would use when teaching how a lock stitch is formed.

http://home.howstuffworks.com/sewing-machine1.htm

Barra

Edited January 29, 2008 by barra

[RocknBLeather]

Wow, this web sight is such a wealth of information!!

I talked to Steve with Artisan this morning and I bought the

4000.

I wanted the longer arm for getting saddle blankets through easier.

I did want the 4700, but all of the info on this post was right, it wasn't the

right machine for what I wanted to do.

Thanks Art. Bill, Skip and Barra, you were all right, the machine I wanted

didn't have the right feed mechanism for what I wanted to do.

I will be lurking on this sight for months to come to learn all I can.

Thanks again,

Tina

[skipj]

Thanks for the info on the feeds,

"Having Drop, Needle, and Walking feet is called "Unison Feed"" All three at the same time? What does the Artisan 3000 have?

SkipJ

[Art]

Hi Skip,

I have seen models with all three. I don't know what they are shipping now. The bigger machines generally don't have the drop feed (although it installs easily buy putting in the dogs and a new needle plate). I am sure they can deliver it any way you want.

Art

Thanks for the info on the feeds,

"Having Drop, Needle, and Walking feet is called "Unison Feed"" All three at the same time? What does the Artisan 3000 have?

SkipJ