Members seagiant Posted November 20, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 20, 2016 Hi, Thank Gentlemen! I started working with leather in the late 60's "Hippy Days"! Belts, Girls Purses, the wide watch bands, ect.ect. I then got into forging knives in the early 90's, making mostly hunting knives and actually pretty much paid for my small shop working part time at it. Of course everyone wanted a sheath for their knife so back to leather I went! I now needed a new belt and a few folding knife sheaths so decided to buy some new hand tools to upgrade my old set... And figure I might as well make a few belts, some for me and friends. I don't really know what the market is for a real hand made,hand stamped, border sewn, brass buckled belt? I guess you can put anything on E-Bay and see what happens or offer it on a Forum for a price??? I think handsewing looks better than a machine, but is laborious for belts! Quote
MADMAX22 Posted November 21, 2016 Report Posted November 21, 2016 Well the market for most everything leather is pretty flooded IMHO. That being said there are alot of people out there to buy the stuff so ..... May wanna keep your old tools since they are probably better quality then whats available now a days unless your throwing down some cash sort to speak. Echo what JLS said about contacting Bob (Toledo sewing) or Steve (cobra sewing machines) or Art and Wizcraft from this forum. All of those guys know alot and usually respond to inquiries in a short period of time. I think I have asked all of them more then a few questions since I started. Quote
Members seagiant Posted November 21, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 21, 2016 Hi, Thanks, I'm not retired yet and use leatherworking to relax. I got bit by the belt making bug I guess. I will probably just keep hand sewing for now. I really like this Tiger thread they have now. Never saw that before and it lays down pretty good on the belt. With my new tools I'm trying to stick to quality like Osborn as my old stuff was mostly Tandy! Quality leather tools ARE expensive it seems or I'm stuck in the 60"s!!! Quote
Members Big Sioux Saddlery Posted November 21, 2016 Members Report Posted November 21, 2016 2 hours ago, seagiant said: With my new tools I'm trying to stick to quality like Osborn as my old stuff was mostly Tandy! I wouldn't be surprised if your old Tandy tools are better quality than the new Osborne tools. They're mostly junk. Quote
Members seagiant Posted November 21, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 21, 2016 11 hours ago, Big Sioux Saddlery said: I wouldn't be surprised if your old Tandy tools are better quality than the new Osborne tools. They're mostly junk. Hi, Interesting! Where are you guys buying tools now? Quote
Contributing Member JLSleather Posted November 21, 2016 Contributing Member Report Posted November 21, 2016 12 hours ago, Big Sioux Saddlery said: the new Osborne tools. They're mostly junk. Yep - used to be that Osborne meant good toys. Not so much any more... As for where to get that "old" quality... I wouldn't know. Hit 'n' miss about anywhere really. And can't really take a recommend from around here too seriously either. I bought a set of the J Watt edgers that everyone was going on about. I found them to be "just okay".. they came ready to cut but do not hold an edge at all. And I have weaver slot punches that I'm considering giving away, soon as I find someone I don't particularly like Quote "Observation is 9/10 of the law." IF what you do is something that ANYBODY can do, then don't be surprised when ANYBODY does.
Members Big Sioux Saddlery Posted November 21, 2016 Members Report Posted November 21, 2016 (edited) 2 hours ago, JLSleather said: Yep - used to be that Osborne meant good toys. Not so much any more... As for where to get that "old" quality... I wouldn't know. Hit 'n' miss about anywhere really. And can't really take a recommend from around here too seriously either. I bought a set of the J Watt edgers that everyone was going on about. I found them to be "just okay".. they came ready to cut but do not hold an edge at all. And I have weaver slot punches that I'm considering giving away, soon as I find someone I don't particularly like Pretty much what he said! I scour flea markets and auctions and the internet for good, old tools that aren't crazy high. And I HAVE bought some crazy high just because I wanted them so bad and never seen that particular item before or since. The edgers JLS was talking about. . . yeah. . . don't give them to me! Lol. Even if this new stuff comes nasty sharp, like he said it doesn't hold an edge and they have "drag" Some of the "steel" guys will probably argue with me on this one, but this new steel has drag even when it's sharp that the steel in good quality old tools didn't have. Even if they're not super sharp, those old tools don't have that same drag. If you are lucky enough to ever have the chance to buy out a complete shop from some old guy that has an entire collection of old tools, I'd advise to beg, borrow or steal the money to get it. They just aren't makin' them anymore! I've been collecting for over 30 years, and I still don't have everything I'd like to have Edited November 21, 2016 by Big Sioux Saddlery Quote
Members seagiant Posted November 21, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 21, 2016 2 hours ago, JLSleather said: Yep - used to be that Osborne meant good toys. Not so much any more... As for where to get that "old" quality... I wouldn't know. Hit 'n' miss about anywhere really. And can't really take a recommend from around here too seriously either. I bought a set of the J Watt edgers that everyone was going on about. I found them to be "just okay".. they came ready to cut but do not hold an edge at all. And I have weaver slot punches that I'm considering giving away, soon as I find someone I don't particularly like Hi, Oh Boy! Does not sound good! Maybe buy old tools off our fav. auction site? I just bought a HO "back" (9/10) from Springfield for $170 shipped! They said they would hand pick it for longest and cleanest? That's probably as good as it gets in this lifetime. I can't buy 5 hides or whatever you have to buy from the tannery. This should give me about 18, 1.5" wide belt blanks with little wastage! I want to thank everyone for helping me out, has been an education! If I wanted to sale a couple of completed belts to pay for the leather, where is a good place to do that??? Quote
Contributing Member JLSleather Posted November 21, 2016 Contributing Member Report Posted November 21, 2016 Did you get a back or a bend? Cuz IF it's decent leather, then $170 for a back is a good price. Keep in mind "they" (not just springfield) always say they're gonna hand select the best..blahblahblah Everybody else got the same story. Still, I have got some decent leather from them time to time. 18 is optimistic, really, I think you'll have a bit in there you'll want to cut out. But a little thought before cutting can make a difference. Quote "Observation is 9/10 of the law." IF what you do is something that ANYBODY can do, then don't be surprised when ANYBODY does.
Members seagiant Posted November 21, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 21, 2016 (edited) Hi, I thought a Bend was a Back? I looked all over the Internet and this was the best I could find from a major player in HO! I think a LOT out there is import from where ever. This looked like it would give me the most blanks with the least waste! As I wanted 9/10 oz. I thought this important! Got to dive in sometime I guess? http://springfieldleather.com/Bend-Belt-HermannOak-Sngl-9-10 Edited November 21, 2016 by seagiant Quote
Contributing Member JLSleather Posted November 21, 2016 Contributing Member Report Posted November 21, 2016 That is a bend, which is a back MINUS the shoulder. Take a cow, cut it down the middle, this is a 'cowhide' or 'full hide' cut that in half down teh spine for two "sides" Cut off the belly section and call it a "back" (side minus belly) AND..the difference between a 'back' and a 'bend' is removing the shoulder, leaving the bend. This is THE best part of the hide for belts, being the most dense (strongest) part of the leather. Quote "Observation is 9/10 of the law." IF what you do is something that ANYBODY can do, then don't be surprised when ANYBODY does.
Members seagiant Posted November 21, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 21, 2016 Hi, Ok, thanks!!!! VERY good explanation!!! If it was a "Back" it would of included the shoulder and been more leather. I see now why you said if it was a "back" that $170 shipped was a good price! I THINK I'm still ok with the bend as it should be the best leather for belts you can buy. I think if I can get 15 blanks, I'm still getting them at half price if I just bought individual blanks! They also should be as I said, best quality! Any scrape can be used for carving practice also! Thanks again! Quote
Members Jess Jones Posted November 23, 2016 Members Report Posted November 23, 2016 On 11/21/2016 at 8:43 AM, JLSleather said: Yep - used to be that Osborne meant good toys. Not so much any more... As for where to get that "old" quality... I wouldn't know. Hit 'n' miss about anywhere really. And can't really take a recommend from around here too seriously either. I bought a set of the J Watt edgers that everyone was going on about. I found them to be "just okay".. they came ready to cut but do not hold an edge at all. And I have weaver slot punches that I'm considering giving away, soon as I find someone I don't particularly like Agreed about the HSBT Western Edgers. Starts off great and then poof, dulls out quick! I hate saying this because they are such great people with great and friendly service. Even my skiving knife from them. I never use it anymore because I have to sharpen it constantly. Quote "Intentionally box yourself into a corner on every project. Then find the courage within yourself to overcome it via the imagination and questions. Stay hungry. Stay curious. With time and heart, you WILL succeed." -Jess Jones
Members seagiant Posted November 25, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 25, 2016 (edited) Hi, Thought I would put up a pic of a belt and sheath I made. The belt blank cost me $20 on the bay and why I wanted to get a better price on blanks! This was hand sewn of course, with Tiger thread. Edited November 25, 2016 by seagiant Quote
Members seagiant Posted November 30, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 30, 2016 Hi, Well....I didn't think my work was that bad? I got my bend from Springfield and I'm pleased with it. It will make belt blanks from 60"-64" and is 28" wid so hope to get at least 16-17 belt blanks The leather has no marks creases or scares I can see and should all be usable! Any scrape I can use for practice so is good for me! Here are some pics, this is a better piece of leather than the one I asked about, s I'm going to assume someone picked it out??? Quote
Contributing Member JLSleather Posted November 30, 2016 Contributing Member Report Posted November 30, 2016 No marks? SUE WEEEET... you got the only one Does look like more than one color, though .... Quote "Observation is 9/10 of the law." IF what you do is something that ANYBODY can do, then don't be surprised when ANYBODY does.
Members ArtisanOCL Posted November 30, 2016 Members Report Posted November 30, 2016 http://doublekleather.com/ carries an extensive line of leathers and products for leather crafters, out of St. Charles, MO. Someone recently told me Kevin is called 'the king of veg'. Quote
Members TinkerTailor Posted November 30, 2016 Members Report Posted November 30, 2016 On 11/20/2016 at 7:41 PM, Big Sioux Saddlery said: I wouldn't be surprised if your old Tandy tools are better quality than the new Osborne tools. They're mostly junk. I looked at an osbourne head knife at a shop the other day and the handle was crooked by about 15 degrees. I have recent manufacture an osborne #145 awl that has the ferrule glued in on an angle so there is no way to put the awl blade in parallel to the handle. That one was a gift, so I kept it. It really is a joke. There is a market for quality tools and it is growing. We as a society are swinging away from mass produced, and more people are looking for quality hand made items, and classic items that last. Look at the money being spent on barber supplies like straight razors, or on quality axes these days(or crappy leather stuff on etsy). Those tools from China are made for pennies and sold for dollars. There is a huge profit margin there. Some of those companies have managed to sell penny products for hundreds. There is more than enough room for a manufacturing company in the USA to put out a quality product and not have it cost a fortune if the profit and greed is kept in check. If Osbourne leveraged their heritage as a brand (ie spend longer than 5 minutes a decade on the website) and actually put out a quality consistent product, they may not go the way of Dixon and the rest. Quote "If nobody shares what they know, we will eventually all know nothing." "There is no adventure in letting fear and common sense be your guide"
Members billybopp Posted November 30, 2016 Members Report Posted November 30, 2016 33 minutes ago, TinkerTailor said: I looked at an osbourne head knife at a shop the other day and the handle was crooked by about 15 degrees. I have recent manufacture an osborne #145 awl that has the ferrule glued in on an angle so there is no way to put the awl blade in parallel to the handle. That one was a gift, so I kept it. It really is a joke. There is a market for quality tools and it is growing. We as a society are swinging away from mass produced, and more people are looking for quality hand made items, and classic items that last. Look at the money being spent on barber supplies like straight razors, or on quality axes these days(or crappy leather stuff on etsy). Those tools from China are made for pennies and sold for dollars. There is a huge profit margin there. Some of those companies have managed to sell penny products for hundreds. There is more than enough room for a manufacturing company in the USA to put out a quality product and not have it cost a fortune if the profit and greed is kept in check. If Osbourne leveraged their heritage as a brand (ie spend longer than 5 minutes a decade on the website) and actually put out a quality consistent product, they may not go the way of Dixon and the rest. Aside from the "darn that's so cool" quality of using old tools, they really are better IMHO. If I were starting over again, I'd skip the new tools and only buy old .. I've got some real crap new tools. As I mused in another thread, I think the old timers who used these tools day in and day out were willing to pay a premium price for tools that would (and often did) outlast them. They depended on these tools for their daily bread and butter. Even the best modern tools are comparatively cheaper to buy, but good quality can be had at the right price. Unfortunately, for now "The Boss" has forbidden any leather tool purchases. Just when I've seen a few that I'm lusting after too! LOL. A friend of mine is a laid off machinist, and I've given some thought to seeing if we can come up with some startup cash for tooling to make some true quality tools. I think you're right, there IS a market for them. Maybe we should make it happen! Bill Quote
Members seagiant Posted November 30, 2016 Author Members Report Posted November 30, 2016 7 hours ago, JLSleather said: No marks? SUE WEEEET... you got the only one Does look like more than one color, though .... Hi, Well....as this is my first jump into buying something but a belt blank, so I'm happy! Of course I have no experience to go on, but have to start somewhere! Thanks again for the info!!!! Quote
Members seagiant Posted December 25, 2016 Author Members Report Posted December 25, 2016 (edited) Hi, I thought I would add to this thread as I bought one of the Hand Strap Cutters (The wooden Original Strap Cutter) I have to say it worked fantastic and I cut me 3 nice belt blanks with it. As Springfield cut me a straight edge on my leather already I was good to go and everything went VERY smoothly! Sure beat my old Tandy strap cutter that was made out of 2, 1/2" pieces of wood!!! Edited December 26, 2016 by seagiant Quote
Contributing Member JLSleather Posted December 31, 2016 Contributing Member Report Posted December 31, 2016 (edited) Back to where to get belt cow ... Alex (Boriqua) says he's been happy with the leather from http://aleatherd.com/ I haven't been there as yet, but it looks like Alex knows something about leather, and thus he's convinced me to test it out Phone call this morning gets a message that Bridgett is away from her desk, but since it's new years eve in parts of KY, that's no great surprise. Plus I have no idea who Bridgett is Edited December 31, 2016 by JLSleather Quote "Observation is 9/10 of the law." IF what you do is something that ANYBODY can do, then don't be surprised when ANYBODY does.
Members klaykrusher Posted December 31, 2016 Members Report Posted December 31, 2016 So what determines whether the flesh side is processed smooth like HO or a little rough or spongey? Is that the grade? So SLC has HO 'B' grade which has a really smooth flesh side for the few backs I've purchased from them. The couple of shoulders i got from ALD the flesh side was not so smooth, pretty rough. My mistake was not specifying a grade at the time, I believe. grain side is pretty nice for these though. Quote ~Dave
Contributing Member JLSleather Posted December 31, 2016 Contributing Member Report Posted December 31, 2016 I don't know where that fits in "grading", but I dont' use 'fuzzy'. If they can't split it cleanly, then I'm out! Seriously, splitting is done all the time, and I wonder if someone who can't take care of that should even be supplying leather. Quote "Observation is 9/10 of the law." IF what you do is something that ANYBODY can do, then don't be surprised when ANYBODY does.
Members klaykrusher Posted December 31, 2016 Members Report Posted December 31, 2016 okay, makes sense. I'm gonna give ALD another try and this time I'll be more specific with what I'm looking for and what I expect. Quote ~Dave
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