How to keep a lining wrinkle free?

[CaptQuirk]

When I'm using a heavier leather outside, and a lighter liner, it isn't much of an issue. But I recently did a holster with 5/6oz inside and out. After gluing the layers and bending it over, the inside wrinkled worse than an old woman after a long bath really bad. Is there a way to prevent this, or is it even an issue?

[YinTx]

Just curious, what kind/brand of leather did you use?  Also, which section of the side did you use?

YinTx

[CaptQuirk]

It was a Tandy side, Craftsman Oak I think. And the leather would have been from the bend area. The first thing I did when I got the side, was trim it down to a manageable size, leaving the bend for holsters.

[JLSleather]

If there are no wrinkles in the hide when flat, but there are wrinkles from shaping, then either your inner layer is too long, or your outer layer is too short.  Or both.

 

[CaptQuirk]

Both layers were flat when I glued them together. I tried something different. Normally I use a thinner leather liner, and glue it to the outer after it has been formed.

[JLSleather]

That's what I said.  The outer layer isn't long enough to "come around" the curve, and the inner layer is too long to fit without buckling.

 

[JerseyFirefighter]

Im interested in the remedy to this. Particularly for dog collars since I have some suede and calf skin sitting around not being used. Would the appropriate method be to over cut the liner around the outer piece, and cement them together around something like say a coffee can or pvc pipe so it molds correctly? Or is there a trick to glueing prior to stitching that compensates for the bend in the final product?

[JLSleather]

Yeah, not sure there is a "trick" for getting the right amount of curve.  Educated guess, maybe more like it.  Obviously, a dog collar is more "curved" than a belt for me....

Guy needs to get it close to the size you want.. for teh curve.  And your mention of a can or pipe brings up exactly the issue - each layer you put on top of the last layer needs to be LONGER than any layers before (under) it. Somewhere around here I did some math about that..... but it will depend on the thickness of the leather (thicker leather gets longer between layers than thin stuff).

As to teh wrinkles, once layers are glued together, they are working against each other in terms of stretch/compress.  So if you glue two layers "flat", then when you curve it the outside will stretch and the inside will compress.  Which lead a lot o the boys makin' belts curved.  Including me.   But I don't particularly like that, really.

 If you glue it flat, the inside gets compressed.  But if you glue it on a curve, then when you straighten it, the OUTside gets compressed, which you would have to say is WORSE - particularly if you spent the time to tool it.

In the end, I try to 'guess' the belt curve, and make it with 'not quite enough' curve, so the guy has to pull it on around just a bit.  The deformation is minimal, if any, and teh finish isn't damaged when it's straightened.  And it WILL get straight, even if that's only when a guy pulls it out of the belt loops...

 

[Josh Ashman]

In my experience better quality veg tan leather doesn't want to wrinkle as much as lesser quality and some areas of the hide are more prone to wrinkle than others. for instance, the neck seems to do it worse than the butt. both would have been on the bend you used. Tandy leather, even their "better" stuff is more prone to it than Hermann Oak. 

JLS is absolutely correct to say that on a lined piece the inner one must compress and the outer must stretch. However I personally don't think this makes a bit of difference. You used 2 pieces of 5/6 leather, if you used 1 piece of 10/11 leather the total thickness would be the same and the leather would be compressed on the inside and stretched on the outside the same amount. It's leather, one of the things that makes it great is that it compresses and stretches so well. 

I suggest to get it wet before you fold it. Make the fold slowly if it starts to wrinkle, get it more wet. If it still wants to wrinkle use a slicker and work the wrinkles out. 

All the best, Josh

[JLSleather]

11 minutes ago, Josh Ashman said:

However I personally don't think this makes a bit of difference. You used 2 pieces of 5/6 leather, if you used 1 piece of 10/11 leather the total thickness would be the same and the leather would be compressed on the inside and stretched on the outside the same amount.

TRUE... and it's only less 'visible' due to teh sueded side 'hiding' a bit of the 'smoosh'... so only matters to the extent that once it's shaped, the inside still has to be big enough to put whatever goes in there

 

[RockyAussie]

8 hours ago, JerseyFirefighter said:

Im interested in the remedy to this. Particularly for dog collars since I have some suede and calf skin sitting around not being used. Would the appropriate method be to over cut the liner around the outer piece, and cement them together around something like say a coffee can or pvc pipe so it molds correctly? Or is there a trick to glueing prior to stitching that compensates for the bend in the final product?

In this case if you are using the suede as a liner it would not be much of an issue. Cut your suede length about a 1/4" shorter and stretch it evenly over the length to reach when you glue attach it. Presto.

[RockyAussie]

On 29/12/2016 at 5:37 AM, CaptQuirk said:

When I'm using a heavier leather outside, and a lighter liner, it isn't much of an issue. But I recently did a holster with 5/6oz inside and out. After gluing the layers and bending it over, the inside wrinkled worse than an old woman after a long bath really bad. Is there a way to prevent this, or is it even an issue?

Whatever the leather thickness is and I want to be sure, I cut 2 strips normally about 3/4 to 1" wide and wrap one over whatever and cut or mark its length. With the other i now put it over the first and mark its corresponding length. Whatever the difference is should work well enough. 

[JLSleather]

EXACTLY!  Best way to know.  I think where folks get into "issues", they make a pattern (often from paper) and then use that pattern to mark the OUTside instead of the INside.

 

[CaptQuirk]

Somewhere along the way, I read somebody say to glue the 2 pieces together and treat it as a single piece. I tried it, and that didn't work out. I will go back to forming the outside, then gluing the inside to it. Never had a problem like this before.

[RockyAussie]

3 hours ago, CaptQuirk said:

Somewhere along the way, I read somebody say to glue the 2 pieces together and treat it as a single piece. I tried it, and that didn't work out. I will go back to forming the outside, then gluing the inside to it. Never had a problem like this before.

If you are using the inside lining thickness the same as the outside thickness then I would do the inside forming first then overlay the outside to it and trim. Least ways that's the way I do a formed knife pouch when I cover in croc.

[CaptQuirk]

@RockyAussie- I usually also form the outside, just to get a little more detail, then lay it over the inside to form them together. It just gets a little tricky to glue them together, punch the holes for stitching, etc. Gluing the two layers first sounded plausible, but just didn't work out as well.