CB4500 thread guide mod

[MADMAX22]

The original thread guide didn't have enough material on the outside of the hole so I couldn't round it over to smooth it out. 

Ground the original down flush then silver soldered on a shaped piece of hard brass. Drilled original size hole and opened up the top some and smoothed it all out. 

Seems to be working pretty nice now with less thread wearing. 

[garypl]

Just curious - was the problem with the original part that it had a rough edge that was fraying the thread as it fed through?  Do you think this could have been a manufacturing defect or possibly wear over an extended period of time?  I'm looking at buying a machine in the near future and it is good to know about these types of issues.  Thanks!

[MADMAX22]

48 minutes ago, garypl said:

Just curious - was the problem with the original part that it had a rough edge that was fraying the thread as it fed through?  Do you think this could have been a manufacturing defect or possibly wear over an extended period of time?  I'm looking at buying a machine in the near future and it is good to know about these types of issues.  Thanks!

I think most are fine, I only have one machine. The problem was the hole that was drilled on mine was pretty close to the edge from the start so it had a pretty sharp edge around the top of the hole toward the edge that the thread guides over. The part doesn't wear thru per say very easily, on mine the portion that had the hole drilled in it wasn't hardened and there was no appreciable wear on it. The thread guide itself is hardened (probably case hardened) but the part that sticks out with the hole in it was easily cut with a file which tells  me it wasn't hardened or had a very poor hardening in that specific area. I think it would have been fine had it had some more meat on it so I could of rounded that edge over however on mine that was not the case.

The Brass (maybe bronze) that I used for this is pretty hard, I got it in a unmarked rod and it behaves like brass just a little harder then what your typical brass rod would be. Not saying it will last forever or anything but Ill keep an eye on it to see how long it holds up. If it starts to wear thru I may look at making one out of stainless next time.

Edited March 24, 2017 by MADMAX22

[brmax]

Interesting tip, thanks

my cobra has a flat ledge at bottom sticking out maybe? an 1/8" with a small thread hole. Versus the ring band as your photo which looks to have plenty room. Looks like a great mod. Good day

Floyd

[SolarLeatherMachines]

 

22 minutes ago, brmax said:

Interesting tip, thanks

my cobra has a flat ledge at bottom sticking out maybe? an 1/8" with a small thread hole. Versus the ring band as your photo which looks to have plenty room. Looks like a great mod. Good day

Floyd

Floss your hole with Mitchell's abrasive thread #51.  It will smooth out the edges and enlarge the hole slightly.  It a long time mechanic's Pro Tip.   All of the machines here at Solar are flossed like this to prevent burrs and chafing.  

https://www.amazon.com/Mitchell-Abrasives-Abrasive-Aluminum-Diameter/dp/B0034G67RW/ref=sr_1_1?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1490371016&sr=1-1&keywords=mitchell+abrasive+51 

[gottaknow]

Nylon thread cuts stainless, case hardened steel, anything it rubs against. In a home or hobby machine, you can replace it with about anything and it will last a long time. In a factory, I stock replacement eyelets for everything along the thread path. It's always amazes me what even poly/cotton thread will cut through. For years, Reece used porcelain eyelets on many of their automatic machines. It lasts a very long time and stays smooth throughout it's life.

Regards, Eric

[MADMAX22]

1 hour ago, gottaknow said:

Nylon thread cuts stainless, case hardened steel, anything it rubs against. In a home or hobby machine, you can replace it with about anything and it will last a long time. In a factory, I stock replacement eyelets for everything along the thread path. It's always amazes me what even poly/cotton thread will cut through. For years, Reece used porcelain eyelets on many of their automatic machines. It lasts a very long time and stays smooth throughout it's life.

Regards, Eric

Yep totally agree, all of my older machines the thread tension assemblies the stainless steel disk all have thread grooves cut in them.  Usually go thru and flip them around before buying more. My 441 I didn't feel like ordering a new thread guide attachment so will see how long this last, with my output lately probably quiet a while.

That porcelain sounds cool, gives me some ideas I am going to look into.

1 hour ago, SolarLeatherMachines said:

 

Floss your hole with Mitchell's abrasive thread #51.  It will smooth out the edges and enlarge the hole slightly.  It a long time mechanic's Pro Tip.   All of the machines here at Solar are flossed like this to prevent burrs and chafing.  

https://www.amazon.com/Mitchell-Abrasives-Abrasive-Aluminum-Diameter/dp/B0034G67RW/ref=sr_1_1?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1490371016&sr=1-1&keywords=mitchell+abrasive+51 

I tried that initially but on mine there wasn't enough material to form a rounded lip if you will, it basically just kept sharpening it in a way. My CB4500 is from around 2009 I think so Im sure (would hope) they have made several improvements over that time period.

[Chayse]

Just an idea, should the brass/bronze start to wear, you could probably modify an eye from a fishing pole to work...being a diehard Bass fisherman, I have some vintage rods from the 70's (my father's) that I still use today. They show no signs of wear and I strictly use PowerPro braided line. 

Just my .02

 

V/r,

 

Chayse

[MADMAX22]

24 minutes ago, Chayse said:

Just an idea, should the brass/bronze start to wear, you could probably modify an eye from a fishing pole to work...being a diehard Bass fisherman, I have some vintage rods from the 70's (my father's) that I still use today. They show no signs of wear and I strictly use PowerPro braided line. 

Just my .02

 

V/r,

 

Chayse

Yeah that's a great idea. Thanks

[garypl]

I appreciate all the knowledgeable comments - I want to know which questions to ask when looking at machines!

[dikman]

Chayse, you beat me to it re- fishing rod guides. The old ones were extremely tough when it came to wear, just a little bit brittle! The modern versions are also tough but not brittle. When I built my own rods many years ago I uses Fuji guides which, of course, come in all sorts of sizes. Could be worth keeping in mind for anyone looking for a thread guide of some sort.

[MADMAX22]

Actually looks like there are several suppliers of various ceramic guides of all sorts. I am gonna look into it some and find the right size for when this one wears out.

[Chayse]

Either way, hopefully it helps you or someone else solve an issue or potential issue, you might be surprised, even today, many rod eyelets are still porcelain or ceramic. 

 

V/r,

 

Chayse

[RockyAussie]

12 hours ago, MADMAX22 said:

The original thread guide didn't have enough material on the outside of the hole so I couldn't round it over to smooth it out. 

Ground the original down flush then silver soldered on a shaped piece of hard brass. Drilled original size hole and opened up the top some and smoothed it all out. 

Seems to be working pretty nice now with less thread wearing. 

Nice tidy looking mod MADMAX. I have been wondering whether to make a longer needle holder to cut down deflection but not sure yet if it is worth the bother.  I notice the middle foot is cut near level with the hole. Does that give any problems such as missing stitches or anything?

[MADMAX22]

Rock thanks, I would have made it less tall but really dont have the time for much of anything lately. 

The center toe foot I wanted to open up the front so I could see where the needle hits, unfortunately a common theme is off center holes which was the same with the toe. By the time I got the front cut off and everything smoothed out it was farther back then what I wanted.

It works fine though, just as good as before from what I can tell. Its a little harder to pull the thread back when starting a stitch without more of a fork sticking out front. I can see exactly where the needle is going to hit though which was the original goal.  

[RockyAussie]

Thanks for that MADMAX. I like to see better where I'm stitching as well but I would not want to be stitching soft stuff and have it play up. Don't laugh as I'm sure others will, but I thinking about making it a non walking foot when I want that way.No front foot and closed up back feet the only foot. For intricate position stitching purposes.Just don't like the way the dog foot disappears so deep down in when at the back of the stitch.I'm not sure if there is any way to adjust for that as yet.Regards Brian.

[Cascabel]

Interesting !!!    I had not noticed the needlebar thread guide on my 4500, and had not been using it.   Never seemed to cause a problem at all.   I will use it the next time I sew something on the machine and see if it makes any difference one way or the other.