Wade Tree Help

[Rolandranch]

Hello, saddlemakers!

I need some advice on where to get a good wade tree. I've been looking into building a wade saddle for myself but since I've never built a saddle before I wanted to know where I can get a good quality wade tree for a decent price. Any recommendations are greatly appreciated! 

Thank you!

-Ryan

 

[JMcC]

Good luck with that project. Sounds like fun. I can't help, but I'm sure there are others who can.

[Big Sioux Saddlery]

What do you feel is a decent price?  You kind of get what you pay for with saddle trees.   Even halfway decent production trees are $300-$400 anymore.  The handmade trees seem to start around $600.  I think the next handmade tree I order, I'm going to give Dusty Smith of WYO Custom Saddles a shot.  He trained under Rod Nikkel, and I've liked what I've seen from him so far.  But there are many good makers out there.  Otherwise, I have bought several production trees from Timberline and been fairly pleased.  Their trees are a little "neater" and the rawhiding a little nicer than the other production companies.

[Ken Nelson]

Sonny Felkin at Quality MFG makes some nice wade trees.  Rawhide work is very nice.  He is an older guy that is a wealth of information. Not the cheapest for  sure.  But worth the price.

[Rolandranch]

3 hours ago, Big Sioux Saddlery said:

What do you feel is a decent price?  You kind of get what you pay for with saddle trees.   Even halfway decent production trees are $300-$400 anymore.  The handmade trees seem to start around $600.  I think the next handmade tree I order, I'm going to give Dusty Smith of WYO Custom Saddles a shot.  He trained under Rod Nikkel, and I've liked what I've seen from him so far.  But there are many good makers out there.  Otherwise, I have bought several production trees from Timberline and been fairly pleased.  Their trees are a little "neater" and the rawhiding a little nicer than the other production companies.

I was thinking $400-$500 but if a couple hundred bucks more make a difference I can do that, too. Might as well spend a little more and do it right the first time. I've been looking at Rod Nikkel trees but unsure about the pricing. I'll also look at Timberline and see what's there. I have a question about the rawhide. Do production trees have only cow rawhide? Do they also use bull rawhide? I've heard that bull rawhide is thicker and stronger than cow rawhide but I've only seen bull rawhide used in handmade trees.

Thank you for your help!

-Ryan

3 hours ago, Ken Nelson said:

Sonny Felkin at Quality MFG makes some nice wade trees.  Rawhide work is very nice.  He is an older guy that is a wealth of information. Not the cheapest for  sure.  But worth the price.

Thanks! About how much does he ask for his trees?

[Big Sioux Saddlery]

10 minutes ago, Rolandranch said:

I was thinking $400-$500 but if a couple hundred bucks more make a difference I can do that, too. Might as well spend a little more and do it right the first time. I've been looking at Rod Nikkel trees but unsure about the pricing. I'll also look at Timberline and see what's there. I have a question about the rawhide. Do production trees have only cow rawhide? Do they also use bull rawhide? I've heard that bull rawhide is thicker and stronger than cow rawhide but I've only seen bull rawhide used in handmade trees.

Thank you for your help!

-Ryan

If you are willing to spend 400-500 on a tree, by all means go with a handmade tree.  Rod Nikkel quit making trees at least a year ago, and sold all of his equipment, I think.  

I may be mistaken, but I don't think that the hand made tree guys exclusively use bull hide.  And I might be mistaken about this as well, but it isn't so much about thickness (to a point) as it is a nice, tight job of rawhiding.  The thicker the hide, the harder it will be to get it to suck down tight into every place that it needs to be.   I'd like a tree maker to verify this for me, but with just the amount of rawhiding I've done personally,  I think using the right parts of a decent cowhide would be thick enough for most trees.  The other end of the spectrum would be the cheap Mexican trees covered with multiple pieces of goat rawhide just nailed and tacked to the tree. It's thin enough to tear by hand.

[Josh Ashman]

I read in a saddlery book (I think the Harry Adams one, but that's off the top of my head) that the difference between "cowhide" rawhide and "bullhide" rawhide was that one had been split while the other had not. I wasn't sure that I bought this when I read it, as I doubt that they run raw hides through a splitter. I've never worked in a tannery, so I don't actually know. I do know that when I worked in a butcher shop we never sorted the hides out, although if we had they would almost exclusively be in a "steerhide" pile. Just random thoughts that this conversation brought to mind. 

Ryan, you might look into Bowden trees. They are not as nice as Timberline or Quality Mfg's but the ones I've got from them have been fine. Cost is about $300 last I checked. 

All the best, Josh

[cowboycolonel]

I have made several saddles on Wade trees by Bowden.  They have all been perfect in every way.  All are symmetrical and well-made.  You can't beat it for the price.  I have used other makers as well, but found that I was just paying more for no discernible inccrease in quality.

 

[Ken Nelson]

Bull hide is heavy rawhides that have not been leveled or split and they do split rawhide.  There is no comparison between a Bowden Tree and a Quality tree.  Quality is a much better made tree and it shows too.   I have been using Lewis Trees out of Hereford TX for the past 7 or 8 years.  The man I build all these saddles for  specifies them.  I have built a lot  of saddles on them over the last 8 years and have yet to have one come back for any reason.  These guys that are riding my saddles are COWBOYS Deluxe and they use them hard.  That said they are somewhat harder to nail to and drive screws in than a rawhide tree.  They are good guys to do business with. 

I used Sonny's trees for a long time and if I was not building for a man that specifies Lewis Trees I would still use his trees on at least part of the saddles I build.   I cannot say anything bad about Timberline these days but at one time, a long time ago,  I felt they had some quality control issues but a friend of mine and as good a saddle maker as I know swears by them the last 10 years.   I used 2 Bowden trees about 10 years ago and was sorely disappointed with both and the last ones I saw, I was not impressed with, but that is just me.  I know some guys that like them and maybe I am missing something with them but I doubt it. 

This is all my opinion, with the exception of the rawhide thing and that was told to me by Harry Adams in person.  Harry had owned a tree company at one time and KNEW Rawhide.   HTH

[Ken Nelson]

According to what Harry told me, and if I remember correctly,  Bullhide isn't necessarily off of a bull.  It is just full thickness off of a mature heavy hided bovine.  The Australian Ringers that worked for me were amazing rawhide braiders.  All of them that braided rawhide, swore  that the best rawhide you could get was off of an old, thin (very thin) hereford cow.   More glue in the rawhide.   BTW it is called green hide down there.