Is there an attachement for CB4500 for finishing leather edges?

[dikman]

If you search here for "burnishing" you'll find information on what others are using for burnishing, some have fitted (or made) burnishing attachments onto bench grinders. They might be a little fast but they work ok. Yours looks to me like its burning the edge of the leather, I get the same thing when sanding on a belt grinder if I'm not careful. You've probably clogged the grinding wheel with leather so it's rubbing leather against leather at high speed and burning it. You could try using some beeswax on the leather when burnishing. The good thing about a proper burnishing attachment is the grooves will also round off the edges a bit.

[Wizcrafts]

46 minutes ago, RusticLeatherShop said:

That "burnish" Experiment with the bench grinder may be a cheap alternative of the expensive binder attachment. Indeed the "burnish" Looks a Little like pressed plywood. It gives a bit better finish than leaving the edges raw.

Tell me guys what you think about the "burnish".

A few years ago I bought a combination leather burnisher and sander from Leather Machine Company (Cobra). It can sand the layers until they are even. With the sides flat you can use an edge tool to remove the lip formed by the sanding from the top and bottom. The larger the number the more leather it shaves off the edge. I would use a #3 on your holsters. Then, wet the edges and rub them into the groove in the burnisher that allows the inside and edges to be slicked.

In case that machine is too much money, there is a cheaper solution. Use a powered sander on the edges and an edge tool as described above. If you have a drill press you can buy a burnisher that fits into a chuck on a drill press. It is made by Richard Loy.

[garypl]

You are burning the leather, not burnishing it.  Your grinder is spinning too fast and you are using a grinding wheel.  You need to slow it down and put on either a burnishing attachment or buffing wheel and maybe use less pressure.  You will be better off just wetting the edges and burnishing by hand with a piece of wood or canvas.

Gary

[bullmoosepaddles]

This man will tell you everything you need to know about how to edge slick you leather. All you need on the simplest level is a hand held sanding block or a sanding drum on a drill press. A edge beveling tool, a polished stick, some stiff cloth, old jean material will work if you don't have canvas,  some water and some saddle soap. 

Also I know you are trying to learn an often frustrating craft. But the process of learning usually requires we step out of our comfort zone and try to do something new to us. The masters of the craft have been using many of these practices for the last 100 years or so. Try the simplest solution first.  

I wish you luck in your new endeavors  

 

[RusticLeatherShop]

Well that Cobra burnisher is again 450$ and it has similar RPM as my common DeWalt grinder, which is 3450 RPM.

I would Need just an propper burnisher wheel which fits to the grinder.

As well I figured the clogged with leather sanding Stone will act as a burnisher the more it is clogged. Somehow that works to a certain Point.

What else is "burnishing" than hardening the leather by applying friction heat coaling it (hence burning = burnisher) partially.

Best is to find some method of burnish effectively (btw beeswax is not availlable over here nor does saddle soap).

[Wizcrafts]

21 minutes ago, RusticLeatherShop said:

Well that Cobra burnisher is again 450$ and it has similar RPM as my common DeWalt grinder, which is 3450 RPM.

I would Need just an propper burnisher wheel which fits to the grinder.

As well I figured the clogged with leather sanding Stone will act as a burnisher the more it is clogged. Somehow that works to a certain Point.

What else is "burnishing" than hardening the leather by applying friction heat coaling it (hence burning = burnisher) partially.

Best is to find some method of burnish effectively (btw beeswax is not availlable over here nor does saddle soap).

If you prefer to discuss burnishing techniques instead of machine edge binding, there is a better section of our forum where you will get better answers. The forum is titled: How Do I Do That

I encourage you to start a new topic in that forum as this one is for leather sewing machines.

[RusticLeatherShop]

I just did another Experiment according to the Video by turning the grinder on and Holding an simple bathing Soap which contain glicerine, at it so it's clogged with bathing Soap. I ran the Holsters edge through it and afterwards moisturizing the edge with water. This makes the edge shiny and sealed.

That seals the edge but IMHO does not look so nice as the "ply Wood" look of the Vaseline Version. I can get here Petroleum Jelly as well for slicking. Dunno if that improves the burnishing.

[Wizcrafts]

2 minutes ago, RusticLeatherShop said:

I just did another Experiment according to the Video by turning the grinder on and Holding an simple bathing Soap which contain glicerine, at it so it's clogged with bathing Soap. I ran the Holsters edge through it and afterwards moisturizing the edge with water. This makes the edge shiny and sealed.

That seals the edge but IMHO does not look so nice as the "ply Wood" look of the Vaseline Version. I can get here Petroleum Jelly as well for slicking. Dunno if that improves the burnishing.

Read this article about burnishing edges, then look at his hand and machine mountable burnishers.

[SolarLeatherMachines]

5 minutes ago, RusticLeatherShop said:

I just did another Experiment according to the Video by turning the grinder on and Holding an simple bathing Soap which contain glicerine, at it so it's clogged with bathing Soap. I ran the Holsters edge through it and afterwards moisturizing the edge with water. This makes the edge shiny and sealed.

That seals the edge but IMHO does not look so nice as the "ply Wood" look of the Vaseline Version. I can get here Petroleum Jelly as well for slicking. Dunno if that improves the burnishing.

You need to be careful using the grinder like that.  If whatever you're clogging the wheel with has a different rate of expansion than the actual stone of the wheel, you stand a decent chance of fracturing the wheel and having it let go all over the shop.  You need to buy some canvas wheels that are specifically made for doing this.  Or leather wheels.  You're gonna hurt yourself.  

[Matt S]

1 hour ago, RusticLeatherShop said:

Well that Cobra burnisher is again 450$ and it has similar RPM as my common DeWalt grinder, which is 3450 RPM.

I would Need just an propper burnisher wheel which fits to the grinder.

As well I figured the clogged with leather sanding Stone will act as a burnisher the more it is clogged. Somehow that works to a certain Point.

What else is "burnishing" than hardening the leather by applying friction heat coaling it (hence burning = burnisher) partially.

Best is to find some method of burnish effectively (btw beeswax is not availlable over here nor does saddle soap).

I use a bench grinder as the motor for burnishing, but I use a wooden burnishing wheel from Nigel Armitage. It's nothing particularly fancy but well made and well balanced for minimal vibration. Almost any hardwood will work for such a wheel, or as others have said stiff canvas or felt, leather, plastic... they key is that it's smooth, firm, well balanced for and not going to fracture. 3000 RPM is bloody fast -- for a 50mm wheel that's about 57KPH. Alex is right -- fracture a 125mm wheel like you're using and you'll be dodging bits of rock at 140KPH. Make a hell of a mess of you.

Different leathers burnish better with different substances and techniques. I tend to use diluted water-based glues as burnishing agents as this gives a faster and longer-lasting result. PVA (white wood glue) is a good starting point. You can use just about any wax for an extra shine.

[RusticLeatherShop]

Hi,

I have this availlable for burnishing edges. An 3450 RPM DeWalt bench grinder with 2 sizes of sanding Stones (one fine and one medium coarse).

In the fotos it Shows 4 layers sewn together 5 oz cow leather using Vaseline as slicker Agent (the item is an pocket Holster + mag pouch for any mouse 380 ACP pistol). The fine sanding Stone was used and so it has clogged the outer Surface with leather material from "burnishing" leather as such as it's now not sanding anymore but rather it's a Slick Surface.

What do you think?

How can I use an bench grinder for leather burnishing? Any more ideas?

Any experience using an common bench grinder as an burnisher?

[RusticLeatherShop]

Lets please continue the discussion on Burnishing leather with an bench grinder here:

 

[Lobo]

Burnishing edges is really nothing more than "slicking" and polishing the leather to a smooth and glossy surface. The method that I found most effective and time efficient was using a 1" diameter hard felt polishing bob mounted in a bench-top drill press. After dressing the edges with a drum sander, then beveling the edges, I would dye the edges, then rub the edges with a 50-50 mixture of beeswax and paraffin wax, then polish the edges using the hard felt polishing bob turning at about 1700RPM. The friction caused the wax to melt and moderate pressure forces the wax into the exposed leather, sealing the edge quite well. A minute or two per item (belts, holsters, etc) left the edges at a highly polished state.

I have finished holsters and belts that I have used for more than ten years and the edges still look great. When a bit of wear shows I can apply a little bit of dye, rub the edges with the wax mixture, and polish out on the felt bob, leaving the edge looking like brand new.

Friction causes heat and abrasion, and the felt polishing bob uses both to quickly finish the edges to perfection.

Years ago I became obsessed with creating the perfect edge. I used custom hardwood mandrels, working edges for endless lengths of time trying to achieve perfection. After trying the hard felt polishing wheels and the wax mixture I realized just how much time I had wasted year after year, when the desired effect can be had in only a few minutes.

[Wizcrafts]

I have merged the entire previous discussion into this one. It will serve as background for new visitors to the topic.

[RusticLeatherShop]

I had today switched to an aluminum fan belt wheel type for burnishing.

At first it seemed promising but then I went back to the original bench grinder set up as that came from factory (one coarse and one middle sanding Stone).

The sanding Stones give me a bit better shinier and even finish than the belt wheel.

[johnv474]

Are you looking for a better result or just to save money?  

The leather looks scorched. 

You have spent this thread trying to figure out how to not spend money.  Learning to burnish or skive is nearly free.

In the alternative, you can bind by hand and sew with your machine, or by hand, with any thickness of leather you like.  

Or just use one of the many nearly free edge paints or treatments, or make your own.

[RusticLeatherShop]

no binding by Hand. For what I did the expensive machine buy? Not to do anything by Hand whatsoever.

Edge paint and threathments are not availlable over here in Southamerica.

I feel even the Wood burhishing Attachements to a drill on Amazon will not do the trick.

Still looking for an leather edge finish solution.

[chrisash]

Why o Why do you go against all the experts on here, your original question was about price for making a turned edge or rolled edge, the price reflects the low volume of people wanting the item so stock hangs around for slow movement and costs the shop nearly dead money

You burning idea with the grinder gives the worst finish i have seen and wastes a good grinding disk which also wont last long as noted above

I would suggest you follow Nigel Armitage video's on YouTube which cover all your questions and is a master at helping all with his free lessons

[Matt S]

4 hours ago, RusticLeatherShop said:

no binding by Hand. For what I did the expensive machine buy? Not to do anything by Hand whatsoever.

Edge paint and threathments are not availlable over here in Southamerica.

I feel even the Wood burhishing Attachements to a drill on Amazon will not do the trick.

Still looking for an leather edge finish solution.

I'd guess you bought that sewing machine for sewing thick leather. If you wanted a machine with cheap off-the-shelf binding attachments maybe you should have bought something else. Most users of 441-type machines don't use them for binding but a lack of a binding attachment for your machine doesn't mean you can't bind leather with it. Binding attachments are essentially one-trick ponies -- one type of fold, one type of tape, one size of material per binder. As you've found the more specialist the binder the more expensive so most small workshops simply don't have an attachment for every job. In fact the setup time involved in using a binder means that for short runs it's often quicker and easier to bind manually and then sew it with the machine. I'm curious, how are you going to layout, cut, punch, glue, polish, set rivets with a sewing machine if you don't want to do anything by hand?

You can use normal cheap art-shop acrylic paint for edges. Normally you need to thin it with a little water to get it to soak in.

You have been advised by several people (including myself) sources of good quality off-the-shelf burnishing attachments, and how to make one yourself or have one made by a local craftsman. Why are you ignoring valuable advice you're being given for free?

If you're having trouble with a burnishing machine why don't you burnish by hand until you can get the machine burnishing sorted? It really doesn't take very long.

[chrisash]

Also if you follow how to skive with a knife on Youtube you can reduce all the area's you sew your edges down to a more manageable size so your not working with such large thicknesses at the edges

[RusticLeatherShop]

4 hours ago, chrisash said:

Why o Why do you go against all the experts on here

Nothing as such as I am "against all the experts on here".

Dont jump on the bandwagon some try to send on the trip to mob me.

Yes I bought the machin as a replacement for rivets, and such stuff.

So acryllic Wood or iron paint will do it? I dont trust that since it can crack and peel in my experience. Paint with a brush? good receipe to mess up the rest of the work by smearing paint all over the dear Piece. Taping the rest of the Piece as in automotive tape painting, not gonna do it.

I bought the machine for quick and easy work.

[Matt S]

43 minutes ago, RusticLeatherShop said:

Nothing as such as I am "against all the experts on here".

Dont jump on the bandwagon some try to send on the trip to mob me.

Yes I bought the machin as a replacement for rivets, and such stuff.

So acryllic Wood or iron paint will do it? I dont trust that since it can crack and peel in my experience. Paint with a brush? good receipe to mess up the rest of the work by smearing paint all over the dear Piece. Taping the rest of the Piece as in automotive tape painting, not gonna do it.

I bought the machine for quick and easy work.

Acrylic paint as in you might use to paint a picture with. You can get a tube for $1 in whatever colour you want. Edge paints last just fine if properly applied, I've got items in daily use over 1 year old that are just fine. I haven't tried the stuff from the art shop for that long (just the proper stuff). What have you tried?

As to making a mess, there's lot of us manage not to. Maybe ask people how they do it? No painter's tape here, or streaks across the leather.

Have you tried burnishing an edge by hand using a piece of wood, bone or plastic? What happened? Did it turn out as you wanted? If not how did you try to improve it? Have you looked into making or having made a wooden burnisher attachment like people have suggested, or buying one of the specific burnishers people have suggested? If you can't do the basics a sewing machine isn't going to magically make you good or fast at leatherwork. That requires proper practice and experience.

I find your use of the "flogging a dead horse" animation ironic. Maybe it's not so much a bandwagon as a popular movement.

[garypl]

It’s very easy to apply a clean coat of edge paint.  Here are some examples of test pieces I did recently - no paint dripping down the surface of the leather.

Use good acrylic paint, sand between coats and take your time.  I have an eyeglass case I have been using daily for over a year, in and out of my back pocket, and I see no appreciable wear on the edge paint.

Gary

 

 

[RusticLeatherShop]

That would be an possibility. Using paint as for use in Aquarella painting on paper.

That should be availlable here.

that paint above Looks nice.

[garypl]

2 hours ago, RusticLeatherShop said:

That would be an possibility. Using paint as for use in Aquarella painting on paper.

That should be availlable here.

that paint above Looks nice.

Try buying some acrylic paint and practice on some scrap - you may be pleasantly surprised at the results!

Gary